Acoustic Treatment - Sound Absorbing Shields

[meseleto]

Hi everyone,

I am currently recording in a small walk-in closet (5feet X 4 feet X ~7feet high) and I have lots of echo. I am only using the studio to record rap/r&b vocals so I don't have any instruments. I have read a handful of articles on the importance of acoustically treating your room so I know how important this is. I was wondering if anyone could tell me if acoustic shields are worth it or if it would be better to customize the design by buying foam and cutting/gluing it.

The Auralex MudGuard Microphone Isolator gets pretty decent reviews on a few websites and so does the Cad AS32 Acousti-shield 32 Stand. Anybody have any thoughts on these?

Some articles say place it in a corner while others argue that placing it in the middle of the room is best. I have played around with microphone placement in the room but I don't think that's what's really contributing to the problem.

 

[RAMI]

I am currently recording in a small walk-in closet (5feet X 4 feet X ~7feet high) and I have lots of echo.

That's probably one of the worst places to record in. Can you not record in the main room of your studio? Smaller the room=bigger the problems.

could tell me if acoustic shields are worth it or if it would be better to customize the design by buying foam and cutting/gluing it.

Not sure what you mean by "acoustic shields". It depends on what they're made of and how dense the material is, etc....Forget about foam, even if it's sold with the word "acoustic" in front of it. You need the proper materials, which would be rigid or semi-rigid fibreglass, or a few other mineral-based materials. Like I said, foam will only make it worse.

The Auralex MudGuard Microphone Isolator gets pretty decent reviews on a few websites and so does the Cad AS32 Acousti-shield 32 Stand. Anybody have any thoughts on these?

Not familiar with those, but they might be fine. Again, it depends on the material, not what the company calls them to make them seem to be more than what they are.

Some articles say place it in a corner while others argue that placing it in the middle of the room is best.

Neither is good. In fact thopse are the 2 worst places. Bass builds up in the corners, and usually gives you a null in the middle of the room. You want to be away from the corners, but not right in the center of it.

I have played around with microphone placement in the room but I don't think that's what's really contributing to the problem.

You're right.The problem is that you're recording in a closet. Period. On top of that, the only way to make a closet sound good for anything is to put so much sound treatment in there that your room will now be 3'X2' and 5' high.

It's time to get come out of the closet.

 

[Ethan Winer]

It's time to get come out of the closet.

Exactly. This might help:

Do I really need a vocal booth?

--Ethan

 

[sixer2007]

So then, If someone has no treated rooms at all, and they want to track vocals, would a gymnasium be a good place? Or just the biggest, most open room they can find?

 

[mjbphotos]

You can't get 'echo' from a closet that small, you can, however get nasty reverb/wave effects.

 

[meseleto]

Ouch RAMI damn that hurt lol!

If foam actually makes things worse then why are there such good reviews from people claiming that it helped to reduce echo?

I have attached a crudely drawn sketch of my extra room and where I currently have my stuff. I was thinking about building a soundproof box for my microphone and placing additional foam along the walls if needed. Some sites have 32 1'x1'x2" acoustic foam sets for $108 that have good reviews. I will gladly save the money if there are smarter ways.

Mjbphotos what would the "nasty reverb/wave effects" sound like? Right now I'm no messing around with mixing until I make sure I have my room/eq set up properly. When I record vocals by themselves, they sound decent but I can still hear what sounds like an echo to me. When I combine them with the instrumental it sounds very bass heavy but I'm not sure if this is normal and can be cleaned up during mixing/mastering or if it is due to a poor set up.

Thanks everyone!

 

[meseleto]

Oops, I just realized that the Studio Building & Display section is probably more appropriate for my questions. Should I just open up a new thread in that section, sorry folks!

 

[RAMI]

Ouch RAMI damn that hurt lol!

Didn't mean to hurt anyone. Just speaking what I hope is the truth, based on my own so-called knowledge and experience.

If foam actually makes things worse then why are there such good reviews from people claiming that it helped to reduce echo? !

Because it does help reduce "echo", etc....They're not wrong. The thing is, ANYTHING on a wall will reduce echo, so will furniture. The problem is that treating a room is more scientific than that..

In sort, bass frequencies are 95% of the problem in 95% of rooms. Foam isn't dense enough to absorb bass frequencies. So, by using foam, all you're doing is cutting the highs and mids, which then makes bass more like 100% of your problem. It's a little more complicated than that, but that's it in a nitshell.

 

[jimmys69]

Oops, I just realized that the Studio Building & Display section is probably more appropriate for my questions. Should I just open up a new thread in that section, sorry folks!

It's in the right place now.

Listen to Rami. He has it right.

 

[meseleto]

No, no I didn't mean you hurt my feelings or anything I just shocked that what I had learned was that far off. I actually prefer brutal honesty like that so cheers friend!

Ok so would I be okay if I soundproofed the area around the microphone and installed "bass traps" in the corners of my room? If I had something custom built like fiberglass covered in acoustic foam and installed them in the corners of the studio?

If I moved the microphone into the main room, what kind of acoustic treatment would I need? Should I close off that gap between the walk-in closet and the main room or leave it open? The main room just has my equipment + 2 couches for now.

 

[Ethan Winer]

You can't get 'echo' from a closet that small, you can, however get nasty reverb/wave effects.

Right, the main problem with very small rooms is a boomy resonant sound at bass frequencies. Typical thin foam does nothing to help that.

--Ethan

 

[Kaidee]

Hi everyone,

I am currently recording in a small walk-in closet (5feet X 4 feet X ~7feet high) and I have lots of echo. I am only using the studio to record rap/r&b vocals so I don't have any instruments. I have read a handful of articles on the importance of acoustically treating your room so I know how important this is. I was wondering if anyone could tell me if acoustic shields are worth it or if it would be better to customize the design by buying foam and cutting/gluing it.

The Auralex MudGuard Microphone Isolator gets pretty decent reviews on a few websites and so does the Cad AS32 Acousti-shield 32 Stand. Anybody have any thoughts on these?

Some articles say place it in a corner while others argue that placing it in the middle of the room is best. I have played around with microphone placement in the room but I don't think that's what's really contributing to the problem.

Here's the thing because I learned a lot when I was trying to get my little crawl space of a studio room together. There always seem to be mixed reviews and responses about using reflection filters for recording. What I learned is that a lot of companies like Post Audio I think they are on Amazon and CAD and some other company I can't remember regurgitate these cheap imitation design of the SE Electronics Reflexion filter. They don't really have any results because they're not on the same level as a real Reflexion filter they are just knock off designs from overseas.

like look here.

There's a lot more than a few companies that sell that same filter design as I found out for that one and another design like this one...Which you find everywhere mostly ebay.

The Auralex MudGuard is a nice option but I passed on that one because it's just an isolator and not a filter. Since there is a difference between isolating vocals and "filtering" vocals. If you're recording in a small space you're more than likely already isolated enough.

My problem was that I my vocals were isolated enough but the room made my voice sound too open on track. That put me down to try the SE Ref filter for 299 but what made me skip out on it was that it's smaller than it looks if you see it in person. I waited a while to try to catch a break on the price but I still don't feel it's worth anything more than 200 maybe.

What I ended up doing was buying the Soundkitz AEF SoundKitz.Com audio equipment and I have been more than happy with it. I just got the basic version and it was a notable improvement. Even though it had good reviews the only review I care about is the one my ears give. My vocal takes sounded much more focused and crisp. I have minor wall treatments up in the attic room area but it is a large room and the only way to close it off properly would be to have someone finish walling it up. I think you'd have better luck since your recording in a walk in.

I also heard good stuff about the Realtraps, I know people use that with good results and I think that's the only other product I remember being worth while.

 

[meseleto]

Ok I will check that out, thanks for everybody's input!

 

[pad]

That's probably one of the worst places to record in. Can you not record in the main room of your studio? Smaller the room=bigger the problems.Not sure what you mean by "acoustic shields". It depends on what they're made of and how dense the material is, etc....Forget about foam, even if it's sold with the word "acoustic" in front of it. You need the proper materials, which would be rigid or semi-rigid fibreglass, or a few other mineral-based materials. Like I said, foam will only make it worse.

Not familiar with those, but they might be fine. Again, it depends on the material, not what the company calls them to make them seem to be more than what they are.

Neither is good. In fact thopse are the 2 worst places. Bass builds up in the corners, and usually gives you a null in the middle of the room. You want to be away from the corners, but not right in the center of it.You're right.The problem is that you're recording in a closet. Period. On top of that, the only way to make a closet sound good for anything is to put so much sound treatment in there that your room will now be 3'X2' and 5' high.

It's time to get come out of the closet.

Hello RAMI, I am a noob and was wondering if there are any books or other resources that you might be able to suggest for learners so that they can get acquainted with the fundamentals of sound recording from the beginning. I too have seen lots of reviews and blogs, etc promoting the use of these kinds of pieces of foam as solutions to a bad room and I would like to learn the professional way of setting up an adequate environment for recording. Any help / insight you can offer would be appreciated!

 

[mjbphotos]

Hello RAMI, I am a noob and was wondering if there are any books or other resources that you might be able to suggest for learners so that they can get acquainted with the fundamentals of sound recording from the beginning. I too have seen lots of reviews and blogs, etc promoting the use of these kinds of pieces of foam as solutions to a bad room and I would like to learn the professional way of setting up an adequate environment for recording. Any help / insight you can offer would be appreciated!

You'll do better to search through the newbies section of the forum first, and asking there, rather than replying to a 3-year-old thread.

 

[pad]

Hi mjbphotos, thanks for your input. But I have already searched, as you kindly suggested, for answers to my specific question regarding books/resources and so far I haven't found anything. That was why I decided to direct my inquiry towards someone with expertise in the subject matter who also happened to be online at the same time as I was.
Still, thanks a lot for taking the time out to post a reply on this thread after so long, thanks especially for your motivation to be so helpful to others

 

[RAMI]

Hi mjbphotos, thanks for your input. But I have already searched, as you kindly suggested, for answers to my specific question regarding books/resources and so far I haven't found anything. That was why I decided to direct my inquiry towards someone with expertise in the subject matter who also happened to be online at the same time as I was.

Yes, even though it is a 3 year old thread, I'm still around.

Still, thanks a lot for taking the time out to post a reply on this thread after so long, thanks especially for your motivation to be so helpful to others

I'm not sure if that's sarcasm or not. But, just for the record, MJB is one of the most helpful people on this site, and probably the most helpful person in this particular section.

As far as your question, pad, I really have no idea about any books, vids, etc...I learned pretty much all I know from people here on this site, and trial and error.

Ethan Winer has a great site that really helped me a lot. Read and watch pretty much everything you can on his site:RealTraps - Acoustics Articles

^^^^That page alone should keep you busy for a long time. It has pretty much all the info you would need to get started.

I hope this helps. Good luck.

 

[mjbphotos]

But, just for the record, MJB is one of the most helpful people on this site, and probably the most helpful person in this particular section.

You flatter me. I just try to pass on what I have learned here - hard to believe its been over 10 years. Learning the whys, how and wherefores of home recording requires time, experimentation and a lot of errors. You can read fundamentals in books/online, but doing it is the best way to learn. Make some recordings, then post the mixes in the MP3 clinic and let others advise.
Do a google for 'home recording' and you'll come up with lots of reading material. Read as much as you can - you will read conflicting information in some, ask here when in doubt about some particular thing.

For people just starting out, these threads in the newbie section of the forum are must reads: HERE and HERE