+4 dB or -10 dB?

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deepseasquid

New member
If I am setting up my mixer to pass inputs through to my soundcard, should I set the mixer and my soundcard to +4 dB, or to -10 dB? Both have a setting for each. What is the advantage of a specific setting? Am I right in thinking that at -10 dB, I won't have to have as hot a signal to begin with(from my sound module, etc.)? Thanks in advance for any replies.
 
deepseasquid...
Older sound system (I mean really old before ~1980) delivered lower signal (about -10dB). So you set it to -10 only if you hook that old grandma's gramaphone to your current system ;). Most of newer sound system somehow delivered signal "hotter" (don't worry, it's better). It recognized as +4dB. As I believe you don't use the old sound system, set it to +4dB on both sound card & mixer...

;)
Jaymz
 
deepseasquid

...and BTW, where did you got that nick ? Are you also one of those UFO: X-COM game maniac ?


MEEEE TOOOO !!! Terror from the deep is one of the coolest game ever... :D
 
Thanks James.......Yeah, I don't have Gramdma's old Grannyphone lying around anywhere, and even if I did, I probably would have to rub a couple of pieces of coal together to get it to start spinning the platter. So thanks for the reply. I'll make sure I use the +4 dB settings on both mixer and soundcard.
 
+4 is professional level. in otherwords BALANCED.

-10 is consumer level. in otherwords unbalanced.

This is oversimplified, but it's a good hard and fast rule when you are wondering where to set the switch.

Sorry james argo, that's not the right information here. My circa 1995 JVC home stereo defintly prefers to operate at -10 db. As well as the 1/4 in. in/out's on my ADAT.

IF you have the device that you are routing signal to set at +4 and your source outputs an unbalanced -10db signal, let's say a tape deck, you will have to increase the gain to get appropriate levels, which will indroduce a lot of self noise (from either the source or input) into the signal.
 
James HE said:
+4 is professional level. in otherwords BALANCED.

-10 is consumer level. in otherwords unbalanced.

This is oversimplified, but it's a good hard and fast rule when you are wondering where to set the switch.
Click to expand...
No James, it's not an oversimplification - it's wrong....

Gain structure (whether a signal is -10dBV or +4dBu), is a completely separate issue from whether a signal is balanced or not.

You can just as easily have -10dBV balanced signals as you have +4dBu unbalanced signals.
 
Bruce is correct. The levels and balanced/unbalanced are seperate issues. You need to check the spec sheets for all the gear in the recording chain and structure your gain staging to the lowest common denominator. Most prosumer gear is -10 and unbalanced. You wouldn't want your soundcard set to accept +4 level if your preamp only outputs -10 and vice versa.
 
Thanks guys for all the replies...My Mackie 1402 has a setting that gives you the option of Mic/ +4dB. Now I know that the output of a mic level is less than a line level, and I mostly use synths and sound modules. The Mackie goes into a Delta 1010. I have read the manuals for both, but there really is nothing more in each except to say that you can set it to either +4 or -10 dB. As most of you know, the Delta gives each input and output channel an option for either of these two. All my 1/4" cables are balanced(trs), and I know that say, an output with RCA's is going to be unbalanced by definition, but I've been running both Mackie and Delta at +4dB, and I haven't had a problem...just wanted to know if I was missing something. Sometimes the level on a channel without a trim is a bit low, even if the sound module's output is all the way up. I can easily bump up the level later in Sound Forge...but I would rather get an appropriate level going into the Delta to begin with. Thanks in advance for any more info.
 
The +4.-10 has nothing to do with the actual output level if both connected devices are set the same. If the output was -10 and the next input was +4 then the level would be low.

The problem you are having is that you need to plug the devices that require more gain into one of the inputs with a preamp and gain pot. The keyboard is just sending out a low signal and that's fairly common.
 
Blue Bear Sound said:
No James, it's not an oversimplification - it's wrong....

Gain structure (whether a signal is -10dBV or +4dBu), is a completely separate issue from whether a signal is balanced or not.

You can just as easily have -10dBV balanced signals as you have +4dBu unbalanced signals.
Click to expand...

:o so? ;)
 
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