Who's using Audition 2.0?

undrgrnd studio

undrgrnd studio

New member
I recently transitioned to 2.0 from 1.5. And while I laid to rest some issues with 1.5, I seem to have new issues with 2.0. Mainly the new way of doing Punch-ins, but there are some other things. Anybody in here using 2.0, maybe we can help each other out with shared knowledge?
 
I asked about punch-ins once before in here but never got much of an answer. I guess there were not too many people in here who knew.

What sort of things did you want to know? I'll try to help if I can, but I'm no expert either.

RD
 
One thing that drives me nuts, is if i do a punch in the new track is layered on top of the original. Then if i don't like it and I record a new punch, that track gets layered on top of the first punch in, and so on and so forth. Then after like 15 takes and you finally get it right, sometimes the last punch in gets lost behind the original track. Then you have to go sort through everything and hope you can find it. IF you do find it you have to bounce the track to a new track to merge the pieces. In 1.5, all you had to do was right click and merge the clips, easy.

Also the program saves every single take and puts it in the file area, then when you close the session you get asked if you want to save like 200 files. I have no idea what files are the good punches and which are the bad. It's so annoying.

Does any of this sound familiar to you?
 
undrgrnd studio said:
One thing that drives me nuts, is if i do a punch in the new track is layered on top of the original. Then if i don't like it and I record a new punch, that track gets layered on top of the first punch in, and so on and so forth. Then after like 15 takes and you finally get it right, sometimes the last punch in gets lost behind the original track. Then you have to go sort through everything and hope you can find it. IF you do find it you have to bounce the track to a new track to merge the pieces. In 1.5, all you had to do was right click and merge the clips, easy.

Also the program saves every single take and puts it in the file area, then when you close the session you get asked if you want to save like 200 files. I have no idea what files are the good punches and which are the bad. It's so annoying.

Does any of this sound familiar to you?
Click to expand...
Yes, that baffled me too for a while but, I think I have it figured out.

Here is what you want to do to clean up this mess.

1. After recording say 15 punch-ins, right click on either the original track or the top punch-in clip. Click "Bring to Front" to find the clip you like best. (Which ever clip is on top (or in front) will be played over top of the original. The ones hidden beneath will not play.)

2. Once you are satisfied you have the best punch showing on top, right click the original track and choose "Remove Hidden Clips." (All other clips are removed from the multitrack timeline window but are still in the files list window. I'll get to that then.)

3. Instead of the old Merge command, now we use the Group command. Click once on your original track and notice that the punch-in clip is also highlighted. (As long as it is in front.) Right click and select "Group Clips." Your original and punch-in clips become locked together and stay together until ungrouped. It still shows the punch on top of the original but that is okay, just leave them that way forever. Even if you move the track, they will stay together like glue.

4. Now go to your main program FILE menu and choose "Close Unused Media." All those extra unwanted clips are removed from your session and will not save with the session.

Hope this answers your question.

RawDepth
 
I actually have used that approach a few times, but it seems like so much work for something that was 2 clicks in 1.5.

The problem is that many times you will click on the original file to trim the end or something, and then that original clip becomes the top layer, and then you have to search through the punches for the take you want. And if you're like me you might have Track 2.1 all the way through Track 2.4.86.1. When you have more than one punch spot on a track like that it gets real bad.

Also I don't like grouping files, it always seems unfinished when they aren't merged. That's just me though.

Another big problem. Lets say you are punching across two clips in the group (the end of Verse one, and the beginning of Chorus 1). You set the punch area and then Audition decides it will record the preroll right over the old track.

So now what I do is set the markers for the punch in area, add in some preroll and then record. If I don't like that punch take, I undo the recording which annoyingly also undoes your punch in markers. So I reset the punch in and do it over again. I do all of that because I STILL find it easier than searching through 50 takes later. Once I have a good take with just ONE punch in layer I bounce to a new track and save the wav. Then I go and close all unused media and save session.

But you see how ridiculous this all is? It used to be so much more intuitive and efficient.
 
Nice job!
I would only like to add that I (in some difficult cases) prefer to use bouncing
of two tracks. I think if solo has to be corrected in one diffcult spot we need to
use different tracks and volume envelopes to make smooth "welding" spot.
sikter
 
sikter said:
Nice job!
I would only like to add that I (in some difficult cases) prefer to use bouncing
of two tracks. I think if solo has to be corrected in one diffcult spot we need to
use different tracks and volume envelopes to make smooth "welding" spot.
sikter
Click to expand...

Yeah I do that, except I have never used any envelope filters. But for instance I will do a guitar track through the first verse. Then I start a new track and record the chorus. Then I go back and record the second verse on the verse track. Then I go back to the chorus track etc etc etc. Then when I am all done, I'll bounce the track to one track and kill all the individual pieces. Sometimes you can bang out a difficult track real fast that way. OF course I almost never to do that on the original "base" (not bass) track. I always record a base guitar or something all the way through if their are no separate and distinct sections of the song with pauses.
 
You NEVER use volume envelopes or you don't use them during bouncing?
What about mixing?
Do you use automation?
 
Nope I've never used an envelope on a track, I also never used any automation. I'm not even sure what either does or how you use it. I have only been using my PC as a recording box for about 8 months. I used to use a Boss 1180CD, and before that I used a Yamaha 4 track, heck before that I used a tape player.

Mixing, well yeah I mix the tracks all the time. Listen to some of my songs.

www.myspace.com/danieljamessmall

Could you explain how envelopes are used if you don't mind? I also am not sure what you're referring to when you talk about automation.
 
Nice songs by the way.
Volume Envelope:
I find it very useful while arranging song and polishing dynamics in the finale mix.
Volume envelope is (If it’s not set to OFF by user) green line on the top of your file in multitrack. No matter if it was recorded recently or just inserted to the project.
Line being on the top means 100% of its volume.
Let say it’s a drum track and I decided to turn it down at the end of the chorus which was not my plan in the first place. I edit the envelope (which takes 3 seconds only) and my drums are muted so long the envelope is at bottom of the track. Then I can make them to fade in after that particular part. There is an option in software to make the “splines” so we can get those changes very smooth.
If intro section is loud I always turn those instruments down a little bit at place where vocal comes in but I turn everything up at chorus (Depending of songs off course)

Some times I record several different instruments and those envelopes decide which one will play in which part of the song. By editing envelopes I change arrangement very quickly without editing tracks destructively.

Sometimes I use volume envelopes to turn some peaks down.

I don’t know if I mention all good examples but in generally, volume envelopes force your track varies in volume during the song.

Automation has just the same result. AA 2,0 can drive those lines automatically.
You play back your project and adjusting your volume fader at the same time in mixer view.
Next time you play it the fader moves automatically. (You can always make some fine adjustments manually)
If you play your AA2,0 theme try to look at those faders in mixer view.
Many of them move up and down thanks to automation.
You can even do those tricks with panning and FX.
Let’s say your vocal has some reverb during all song but you wish to put big echo only at last word in chorus. You can easily do that by using FX automation.
It is possible to the same differently I know but this is best way I know.

Pan envelope is a blue line in the middle of the track. If you edit it and like it goes from the top to the bottom in 5 seconds interval you’ll notice sound moving from left to tight speaker smoothly during those 5 sec (Just an example)

Some people bounce many different guitar tracks to one file (To reduce number of the tracks) and wish to move solo part to the centre, rhythm at beginning to the left at riffs which come at the end to the right. That’s why panning envelopes can be useful.

I should probably read this over and correct many of my stupid English sentences but I have to run. Just quote those parts and I’ll try to explain what I meant.

I hope you (and others) will find this useful keeping in your mind that those are not rules or correct ways. That’s the way I do it and I am a just an amateur (self learned).
This is my hobby only.
 
Oh wow thanks! I always wondered how you were supposed to really mix with software when you can't really turn knobs during playback. Like you can with analog. That's something will definitely help with my mixes. I have been destructively editing to reduce volumes in certain sections of songs. That's awesome. I'm going to try mixing a track tonight using these. Sweet!
 
Automation is definitely your friend. I've been using it in FL Studio for quite a while, and its great to see AA2 get it.

I did recently upgrade from 1.5 to 2.0. The driving factor for me was that I can record cleanly in 96/24 in 2.0 on my computer, which is something I could not do in 1.5
 
billv said:
Automation is definitely your friend. I've been using it in FL Studio for quite a while, and its great to see AA2 get it.

I did recently upgrade from 1.5 to 2.0. The driving factor for me was that I can record cleanly in 96/24 in 2.0 on my computer, which is something I could not do in 1.5
Click to expand...

Hello Bill,
I guess you are talking about 96 kHz sample rate and 24 bit.
How do you set up AA 2,0 for 24 bit recording?
I did not know it was possible so I record 32 bit
 
sikter said:
Hello Bill,
I guess you are talking about 96 kHz sample rate and 24 bit.
How do you set up AA 2,0 for 24 bit recording?
I did not know it was possible so I record 32 bit
Click to expand...

You are correct. Adobe Audition can only record in 16 or 32 bit depth but not 24. You can change this in the Multitrack Preferences dialog box.

I believe that if (during recording,) your hardware sends in data at 24 bit then the software simply converts it to either 16 or 32 bit prior to writing tracks. 32 bit will preserve the same track quality as 24 bit but creates much larger files than 16. Also it reduces mathematical rounding errors when using plug-ins, (which maintains quality.) Finally, down sampling at the very end of the line is best.
 
Last edited:
sitker and RawDepth - I didn't communicate very clearly, did I?

My soundcard (M-Audio Delta 44) supports 24 bit/96 kHz, which is why I was thinking "24" instead of "32". Indeed, from AA's perspective, the settings are 32 bit / 96kHz.

With AA 1.5, I had settled on 32 bit / 48kHz recording. Nice and clean that way. But setting the sample rate to 96 kHz was always problematic. Lots of pops and noises, even with higher latency settings on the soundcard.

With AA 2.0, I've not had that problem. It was very easy to get a good clean recording at a 96kHz sample rate.
 
32 bit is the same thing as 24 bit.

AA v. 2.0 uses a mathematically more precise nomenclature than we're used to seeing but I believe it refers to a signal with the same data bit depth as what we call "24 bit".

Don't stress - do the 32 bit thing and it'll work fine and sound stellar.
 
sikter said:
You NEVER use volume envelopes or you don't use them during bouncing?
What about mixing?
Do you use automation?
Click to expand...


using envelops is a good skill to learn because you can position where you want your vocals or you can have to of them and pan each to get a good effect...

i use the volume envelops especially knowing that sometimes you cant hear one part or one part is too loud you just find the area and take the volume envelope and drop it accordingly to the level youd like...saves time when mixing and mastering
 
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