LazerBeakShiek
Rad Racing Team
Blah blah blah..
Well today was rough...
- Thread starter CrowsofFritz
- Start date
Dave Matthews
Dave's not here
Correct.
Cheers for the admission.
Dave Matthews
Dave's not here
In no particular order...
Ban semi auto weapons
Ban clips larger than what... 10?
Enforce background checks for all gun sales
Delay acquisition for 10 (or something) days
Age limit 21
Enforced training for all gun purchasers
There may be more, but nothing here stops a gun sale, except for units that are explicitly designed to kill humans in large numbers.
Dave Matthews
Dave's not here
And you?
Dave Matthews
Dave's not here
Children call 911 begging for help.
One girl covers herself in her friends blood to look dead.
Professional "good guys with a gun" do nothing for an hour
21 people die
Is this a good thing?
One girl covers herself in her friends blood to look dead.
Professional "good guys with a gun" do nothing for an hour
21 people die
Is this a good thing?
What you propose has its good points and others garbage.
A semi-auto is just a self loading gun that doesnt require a bolt or pump action to load. It is a feature of some military guns and is therefore seen as horrific or only for the military. It does allow the gun to be fired faster. Is that a feature of the problem?
Clips larger than 10? A clip can be changed in 1 second?
Enforced training? So you want people to shoot more accurately when they buy a gun or what?
Age limit to buy. Yes and background checks yes. Because crims shouldnt have guns.
Every country has bad laws. Sometimes these are bought in by politicians trying to make a name and using knee jerk reactions to do this.
Would your measures solve the problem? Evidence says no. Americas problem is its citizens not a gun. Why is it that Americans feel the need when the get pissed off to go around killing others? Laws and restrictions do not stop these people, because they obviously care not for any laws. Restrictions would just make them source other methods to kill with, like a truck as others have used or even a bomb which is used often as well.
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CrowsofFritz
Flamingo!
The court found that the Airforce and state of Texas failed in terms of the submitting and reviewing the history of the Sutherland Springs shooter.
Some laws need to be better enforced, as a few users mentioned here earlier.
If Republicans don’t want the mentally unhealthy to get a gun, why did Trump revoke Obama’s law where the mentally unhealthy (only people so unhealthy, they cant even account for their own financial affairs) are not allowed to purchase a gun?
LazerBeakShiek
Rad Racing Team
30 rd magazines are not the problem. The people changed. I dont know whats wrong with them.
I had a blast with my 30 rd in my 10/22(semi .22 cal pop gun for young adults). Id tape two of them together so all I had to do was flip it. We shot bottles cans, old steel signs..In dove season you could shoot the doves. Tastes like chicken..This is on private property, where they own a hunting cabin.
Oh, there was a time when you could get a permit to shoot the muskrats down by the river, they were overpopulated. Cant really eat them.
and then the coyotes, you could get a permit to kill the wild dogs..I wasnt into that. Although they were a problem.
10/22's look like a normal rifle, a cheap plastic stock, and bannana magazine is all it takes..there are even full auto kits for the sear mechanism.
I had a blast with my 30 rd in my 10/22(semi .22 cal pop gun for young adults). Id tape two of them together so all I had to do was flip it. We shot bottles cans, old steel signs..In dove season you could shoot the doves. Tastes like chicken..This is on private property, where they own a hunting cabin.
Oh, there was a time when you could get a permit to shoot the muskrats down by the river, they were overpopulated. Cant really eat them.
and then the coyotes, you could get a permit to kill the wild dogs..I wasnt into that. Although they were a problem.
10/22's look like a normal rifle, a cheap plastic stock, and bannana magazine is all it takes..there are even full auto kits for the sear mechanism.
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LazerBeakShiek
Rad Racing Team
Growing up around guns and discipline, man you listened and followed what they showed you. There was a little something special for you to do now and then. You had to listen. Take it serious.
Kids today what? Play grand theft auto, 25% never complete a first objective and run around killing everyone in the game. Then turn 18, never learning any safety or practices, go out and buy a deadly weapon for no practical reason..After killing so many people on a TV screen...They are ready for it. It was training for them.
No? When i was in high school the Nintendo had light gun game called Duck Hunt..HArdly the same.
You know you can use different loads in the ammunition? Turkey shot and rat shot are much less lethal. Why the FMJ and hypervelocity loads? Plenty of steps before banning anything.
I agree they are funnest outdoors. They make the biggest bang out the barrel.
Finally, America is so batshit insane and full of hate, you need protection. Some form of deterrent. Police will not help you.
Kids today what? Play grand theft auto, 25% never complete a first objective and run around killing everyone in the game. Then turn 18, never learning any safety or practices, go out and buy a deadly weapon for no practical reason..After killing so many people on a TV screen...They are ready for it. It was training for them.
No? When i was in high school the Nintendo had light gun game called Duck Hunt..HArdly the same.
You know you can use different loads in the ammunition? Turkey shot and rat shot are much less lethal. Why the FMJ and hypervelocity loads? Plenty of steps before banning anything.
I agree they are funnest outdoors. They make the biggest bang out the barrel.
Finally, America is so batshit insane and full of hate, you need protection. Some form of deterrent. Police will not help you.
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brassplyer
Well-known member
Playing video games as far as what skillset is required and what sensory stimulation they provide is *nothing* like actually shooting a weapon.
If the bolded held any water then people who play Paintball and Airsoft which involve actually running around shooting people for "kills" in a real world, in-person situation would become spree killers on the regular. They don't.
The reality is mass shootings are statistically, comparatively rare and school shooting events as a way kids die is an extremely rare, even tinier subset of that but they garner attention way out of proportion to their statistical significance.
Looking at school shootings specifically, the total deaths I come up with in the US since 1776 is 258. That includes K - 12, colleges and universities, all faculty and student deaths by shooting and the perpetrators if they died as a result and includes the Kent State shootings. That's in the entire country over the course of 246 years.
Every one a senseless tragedy, in many cases they almost surely could have been prevented if people around the shooter hadn't been asleep at the switch and/or derelict.
As a comparison, some annual numbers of shooting deaths just in Chicago:
-2016 770
-2017 660
-2018 561
-2019 492
-2020 769
-2021 797
That's *one* city. But you don't see anything like the kind of attention media pays to a school shooting event. These shootings are generally with illegally obtained, illegally possessed firearms. It isn't John and Jane suburbanite law abiding gun owner driving the gun crime stats.
According to Dan Rosenberg whose son Drew was killed by an unlicensed illegal alien hit-and-run driver and runs the site http://unlicensedtokill.org/ and who did an in-depth study, he estimates approximately 3000 Americans are killed every year by illegals just in that one category of violent crime - that's a 9/11 size death toll *every year* which doesn't even include incidents like the multi-deportee convicted felon who killed Kate Steinle and whose convictions were all overturned by the California justice system - apparently by California judicial logic even though a stolen gun was in his hand when it went off he wasn't considered to be in possession of it. Convicted felons nor illegals are supposed to have a gun in their hand at all - illegals aren't supposed to be standing on American soil to begin with - but no matter.
Of course Dan Rosenberg's research was hampered by the fact that criminal acts by immigration status aren't consistently tracked by law enforcement and government.
I don't recall Robert Francis "Beto" O'Rourke or any Democrat making any noise, showing up at any meeting demanding the border be locked down to save American lives. Hell no, open borders is now an official part of the Democrat - and Libertarian - party platform.
Nor do I recall him making any noise about banning tobacco products that reliably kill close to 500k Americans every year, government is of course happy to take a healthy cut of the sale to a reliable market of nicotine addicts.
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ibleedburgundy
The Anti-Lambo
Ah yes, it's all the immigrants' fault, despite the fact that immigrants commit less crime on average than American citizens. Oh yeah, and 'those people' (black people) in inner cities. Let's point the finger 'them' too.
Nevermind that homicide rates in Republican states are generally worse than in blue states:
www.cdc.gov
5 worst states for homicide in the USA:
1. Mississippi
2. Louisiana
3. Alabama
4. Missouri
5. Arkansas
^^^All hardcore Republican states with practically zero gun control laws.
Nevermind that homicide rates in Republican states are generally worse than in blue states:
Stats of the States - Homicide Mortality
www.cdc.gov
5 worst states for homicide in the USA:
1. Mississippi
2. Louisiana
3. Alabama
4. Missouri
5. Arkansas
^^^All hardcore Republican states with practically zero gun control laws.
60's guy
Well-known member
I hadn't a clue that the CDC was compiling statistics on murderers as if murderers were all suffering the affects of a perhaps communicable disease rather than focusing all of their attention on Covid. Covid remains the #1 killer in the U.S. and abroad.Ah yes, it's all the immigrants' fault, despite the fact that immigrants commit less crime on average than American citizens. Oh yeah, and 'those people' (black people) in inner cities. Let's point the finger 'them' too.
Nevermind that homicide rates in Republican states are generally worse than in blue states:
Stats of the States - Homicide Mortality
5 worst states for homicide in the USA:
1. Mississippi
2. Louisiana
3. Alabama
4. Missouri
5. Arkansas
^^^All hardcore Republican states with practically zero gun control laws.
I have no interest in arguing back or forth with you or anyone else. However, you neglected to acknowledge the CDC disclaimer.
"States are categorized from highest rate to lowest rate. Although adjusted for differences in age-distribution and population size, rankings by state do not take into account other state specific population characteristics that may affect the level of mortality. When the number of deaths is small, rankings by state may be unreliable due to instability in death rates."
The top 5 of the CDC report per capita of 100,000 was:
Mississippi - 20.5
Louisiana - 19.9
Alabama - 14.2
Missouri - 14
Arkansas - 13
Let's take a look at a different set of statistics. Same year, 2020.
List of U.S. states and territories by intentional homicide rate - Wikipedia
District of Columbia - 28.2
Puerto Rico - 16.7
Louisiana - 15.8
Missouri - 11.8
Arkansas - 10.6
And BTW, the State of California ranked the HIGHEST of all States with 2,203 homicides in the year 2020.
California is NOT a conservative controlled State.
Quite the opposite!
CrowsofFritz
Flamingo!
California is the most populous state. That’s not how you measure it. You look at the rate.I hadn't a clue that the CDC was compiling statistics on murderers as if murderers were all suffering the affects of a perhaps communicable disease rather than focusing all of their attention on Covid. Covid remains the #1 killer in the U.S. and abroad.
I have no interest in arguing back or forth with you or anyone else. However, you neglected to acknowledge the CDC disclaimer.
"States are categorized from highest rate to lowest rate. Although adjusted for differences in age-distribution and population size, rankings by state do not take into account other state specific population characteristics that may affect the level of mortality. When the number of deaths is small, rankings by state may be unreliable due to instability in death rates."
The top 5 of the CDC report per capita of 100,000 was:
Mississippi - 20.5
Louisiana - 19.9
Alabama - 14.2
Missouri - 14
Arkansas - 13
Let's take a look at a different set of statistics. Same year, 2020.
List of U.S. states and territories by intentional homicide rate - Wikipedia
en.m.wikipedia.org
District of Columbia - 28.2
Puerto Rico - 16.7
Louisiana - 15.8
Missouri - 11.8
Arkansas - 10.6
And BTW, the State of California ranked the HIGHEST of all States with 2,203 homicides in the year 2020.
California is NOT a conservative controlled State.
Quite the opposite!
60's guy
Well-known member
Granted. California is the most populous State.
Let me ask you a direct question.
If "you" had a son or daughter murdered in California would "you" simply measure your loss as being acceptable statisictally.?
ibleedburgundy
The Anti-Lambo
I hadn't a clue that the CDC was compiling statistics on murderers as if murderers were all suffering the affects of a perhaps communicable disease rather than focusing all of their attention on Covid. Covid remains the #1 killer in the U.S. and abroad.
I have no interest in arguing back or forth with you or anyone else. However, you neglected to acknowledge the CDC disclaimer.
"States are categorized from highest rate to lowest rate. Although adjusted for differences in age-distribution and population size, rankings by state do not take into account other state specific population characteristics that may affect the level of mortality. When the number of deaths is small, rankings by state may be unreliable due to instability in death rates."
The top 5 of the CDC report per capita of 100,000 was:
Mississippi - 20.5
Louisiana - 19.9
Alabama - 14.2
Missouri - 14
Arkansas - 13
Let's take a look at a different set of statistics. Same year, 2020.
List of U.S. states and territories by intentional homicide rate - Wikipedia
District of Columbia - 28.2
Puerto Rico - 16.7
Louisiana - 15.8
Missouri - 11.8
Arkansas - 10.6
And BTW, the State of California ranked the HIGHEST of all States with 2,203 homicides in the year 2020.
California is NOT a conservative controlled State.
Quite the opposite!
If you think raw totals are valid as opposed to per capita totals, then you are out of your league in discussing this issue.
brassplyer
Well-known member
The fundamental failings of your assertions aside, you completely missed the point of my post - it's that school shootings despite the massive coverage they always garner are statistically rare events - there are categories of crime that have a far greater impact.
60's guy
Well-known member
Therein lies the problem. You have NEVER been open minded enough to engage yourself in reasonable differences of opinion discussions with anyone whom might disagree with you. You have a tendency to label anyone and everyone who disagrees with you to the extent of describing those people to be traitiors.