Recording piano

[djp16]

Hi, bit of a newbie to recording, and i've heard the piano is the hardest instrument to record. So rather than just buying one or two mics hoping they sound good, i was wondering if anyone could give me a bit of advice on how to set-up, what type of mics and pre-amps (suggestions).

I am recording an upright piano, in a large living room. It is next to folding doors on the right which lead to the hallway, and to the far right is the kitchen, to the left is the entertainment unit. Floorboards cover the floor, and there is a couch and two matching chairs, and the kitchen table behind. I hope its not sounding like a recorders nightmare lol.

Thanks in advance for any help.

 

[cello_pudding]

man. piano is tough. probably the one thing i had to keep trying things.

it may be kinda subjective to the style of music, the room you're in, and what mics you have, the actual piano.

i have an upright, a medium big room, 2 sdc 991's, a ldc 990, and a sm57.

i tried micing under with the sdc's left and right, micing over left right, XY at a distance.

i've tried putting the 991's left and right, and trying different combos with the ldc and the 57.

what worked for me was the 57 underneath micing the bass strings, 991 on top getting the treble strings, and a 990 on the right at a non phasing distance.

i found the 57 to be the only thing that gave it the bass it needed. it just came out crisper and fuller.

 

[SouthSIDE Glen]

I suggest you give this thread a thorough read. The OP wound up being very happy with the result.

Note though that results vary greatly by piano type and room quality. Also, when internal/close miking the piano, inches can be miles.

But above all, have the piano tuned before you hit that Big Red Button .

G.

 

[DavidK]

But above all, have the piano tuned before you hit that Big Red Button .

G.

Have it tuned twice. By NASA scientists.

 

[SouthSIDE Glen]

Have it tuned twice. By NASA scientists.

In metric or English?

BTW, re the OP. I didn't catch the reference to an upright piano in the OP. The thread I references talked about a grand piano. Allow me to correct myself:

There are several options on an upright. Usually, though, you'll first want to angle the piano 15-20 degrees to the back wall to reduce standing waves between the backboard and the wall. From there you can:

1. Remove the kickboard underneath beyboard. This is purposely made to be removed for tuning and servicing purposes. From there using a miking technique similar to what's described in the other thread for the grand.

2. Open the top cover of the piano and mic over each side facing in.

3. Mic the piano from the rear, actually miking the back of the soundboard.

4. Have someone play the piano and walk around behind the player from leftto right. Bob and weave your heard a bit if you have to; the purpose is to listen for a "sweet spot" where the paino naturally sounds the best. Stick a mic there.

5. Any combination of 1-4 that works well.

HTH,

G.

G.

 

[djp16]

Cheers guys, this info is helping give me an idea of what to do. Except i will need to save up a bit more for some mic's, and look around, see what sounds good etc.

cheers

 

[rgraves]

I suggest you give this thread a thorough read. The OP wound up being very happy with the result.

Note though that results vary greatly by piano type and room quality. Also, when internal/close miking the piano, inches can be miles.

But above all, have the piano tuned before you hit that Big Red Button .

G.

Yeah, Glen helped me out a lot, and I did find out that piano REALLY is one of the most difficult instruments to record.

After all kinds of experimentation, and trying what people told me here, I figured out my problem:

First, I had to find the best micing technique for the situation. Glen helped me get that figured out. In this case it was the ORTF like 2-3 inches off the strings. Never would have thought to close mic it that much. But it worked.

Second, and most importantly turned out to be mic choice. The piano I was recording was naturally a little bright...not really too bad, just slightly bright. If I was able to record it just how it sounded in the room, that would have been fine. Unforetunately, I was using two KSM 141s which accentuated the brightness with the boost the mics have in the highs. Mic position and technique couldn't fix that for the life of me. I probably spent 3 days recording different positions and crap without thinking much that the mics were really making the sound too harsh.

Finally I realized (thanks to suggestions from other here) that I needed to also use some different mics to get the sound we wanted. In this case, some tube condensor mics without the upper boost worked out great. I would probably also go for a pair of SM81s rather than the KSM 141s or KSM 137s in this case, because the piano was already bright enough. Those KSM 141s work out fine for Steinways and more mellow pianos though. Not good for Young Chang or Yamahas definitely!!

I'm still rather puzzled how people can just show up to a gig and set up mics and have to record a piano with only an hour to set up everything. I think you just need experience and a good mic selection

 

[cello_pudding]

haha..how could i forget.

the bottom board and top board are basically always off of my piano.

i tried to post a clip but lightningmp3 is not being nice. i uploaded it when i posted, and days later, no dice.

oh well.