Apogee Rosetta 200

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zilby

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I make trance music, and all of my synths are internal. I have a powermac G4 1 ghz, and I have been using onboard audio. If I get an Apogee Rosetta 200 with the firewire card, would it make my sound better? Can I use it with Logic Pro or Cubase SX3? I used Reason 2.5 this weekend, and the synths sounded great with powermac internal audio, but when I exported the song to AIFF from the program it sounded really bad, even though within Reason 2.5, it sounded fantastic. I am trying to build a nice recording studio, and I am looking for some good advices. I can never trust sales reps, because they want to sell you everything...

So the question is, do you recommend Apogee Rosetta 200 for use with Logic Pro or Cubase SX3 if I am initially going to use software synths (the sound is already digital internally)? Any recommendations?
 
The main use for the Apogee would be in doing analog to digital/digital to analog conversion, as well as possibly a master clock for your DAW. If all of your sounds are internal, I wouldn't expect it to be of much use to you unless you want to record out of your computer to a separate mastering deck. You say the sound degraded after bouncing the song down from Reason to an AIFF format. What settings did you use in the bounce? If it sounded good in Reason I would expect you could export a version that would sound ok with the tools you already have, provided they were configured correctly.
 
I just selected Export Song As Audio File. That's the only option that you have in Reason. So what you are saying is that internal audio on PowerMac G4 is good enough to get good sound...?

Could you please give an example of a full studio setup using the Rosetta 200 and a synth using MIDI and let's say Cubase SX3? Thank you. I know the question sounds stupid, but I am new to "moving up to a pro setup." I used to have Aardvark setup, but a sold it a couple of years ago. Thanks.
 
zilby, the only reason to use an external AD device is if you're recording sounds outside of the digital domain and into your computer - such as a vocal, bass guitar, etc - using a mic or a DI. Since you're already using digital sounds and samples - you don't need something like a Rosetta 2000.

If you are using external MIDI devices such as stand-alone synths and drum machines, and you want to record audio from them into your computer, then you'd have a use for an external AD converters.

The sounds inside you're computer are going to sound as good as they'll sound. It will vary from the amazing to the crap. Depends on where they came from, who made them, and the overall quality.
 
Dot said:
zilby, the only reason to use an external AD device is if you're recording sounds outside of the digital domain and into your computer - such as a vocal, bass guitar, etc - using a mic or a DI. Since you're already using digital sounds and samples - you don't need something like a Rosetta 2000.

If you are using external MIDI devices such as stand-alone synths and drum machines, and you want to record audio from them into your computer, then you'd have a use for an external AD converters.

The sounds inside you're computer are going to sound as good as they'll sound. It will vary from the amazing to the crap. Depends on where they came from, who made them, and the overall quality.
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Great. Thank you very much!!!

EDIT:
By the way, what are the main differences between Apogee Mini-Me and Apogee Rosetta 200 other than one is USB and the other one can be Firewire (for an extra $500)? They look very similary, but the price is much different.
 
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The Minime is an A/D (analog to digital) converter only. The Rosetta 200 is an A/D, D/A (digital to analog) meaning it can convert it back out again to the analog realm. In addition to the USB connection, the Minime has a S/PDIF port too which allows you to connect to the S/PDIF input of your soundcard or other interface. I have one and use it to connect to my Protools Digi-002R interface.

As far as internal Mac sounds go--they're fine. Most commercial studios running Protools use a Mac so it's not the computer that's causing a loss in quality. When you did your export, could you choose a sample rate (e.g. 44.1 kHz, 48 kHz, etc.) and bit depth (e.g., 16-bit, 24-bit)? You need to insure that your final output is at 44.1 kHz, 16-bit if you want to play it on commercial CD player. If your session in Reason was setup at a different sample and bit rate, it will need to be dithered/converted to the correct values. Not doing so could result in a difference between the playback you hear in Reason and the playback you'd hear in the exported file. I don't use Reason, so hopefully someone who does can clarify/elaborate.
 
AlexW said:
The Minime is an A/D (analog to digital) converter only. The Rosetta 200 is an A/D, D/A (digital to analog) meaning it can convert it back out again to the analog realm. In addition to the USB connection, the Minime has a S/PDIF port too which allows you to connect to the S/PDIF input of your soundcard or other interface. I have one and use it to connect to my Protools Digi-002R interface.

As far as internal Mac sounds go--they're fine. Most commercial studios running Protools use a Mac so it's not the computer that's causing a loss in quality. When you did your export, could you choose a sample rate (e.g. 44.1 kHz, 48 kHz, etc.) and bit depth (e.g., 16-bit, 24-bit)? You need to insure that your final output is at 44.1 kHz, 16-bit if you want to play it on commercial CD player. If your session in Reason was setup at a different sample and bit rate, it will need to be dithered/converted to the correct values. Not doing so could result in a difference between the playback you hear in Reason and the playback you'd hear in the exported file. I don't use Reason, so hopefully someone who does can clarify/elaborate.
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Thanks. I was wondering why you would hook up a Minime to Digi-002R? I also looked into the Digi002R solution, and it seemed that the preamps and the Digital Inputs were good on it? Also, what are some reasons to go from Digital back to Analog as on the Rosetta 200?
 
With Mini-me connected to the Digi-002R, I can get 2 extra input channels (the 002R has 8). I also slave the clock in the 002R to the Mini-me, as it's a better clock.

As far as a two channel D/A converter, some people like to print masters to a 2-track tape machine, or want to use external effects boxes. In these cases, conversion is necessary.

The preamps in the 002R I've heard aren't stellar, and you only get four. I've never used them, as a I track through a Soundcraft M-series board into the line inputs on the 002R.
 
Alex, why use the 002 at all? Couldn't you run spdif out of the M series into the minime? Sorry, maybe I'm confused by what you said. Could you rough diagram your chain for me?

Thanks,

-Jake
 
Cause I want to record 18 channels at once (or maybe sometime--so far my max is 14). But anyway, the 002R has 8 channels of A/D conversion (and 8 channels of D/A for that matter as well). It also has a coax S/PDIF input/output (RCA connectors) and ADAT in/out. The mixer I have is the M12, which has 12 mono channels with preamps and direct outputs. With the Minime, I get two additional preamps, plus the clock source. It then inputs to the Digi 002R over the S/PDIF coax input. The S/PDIF output on the M12 is (I believe) just 2-channels off the master fader bus, but I use it for monitoring as well so this wouldn't work for me. Plus, I doubt the converters in the M12 are all that great. In addition to the Mini-Me, I've got a Tango24 from Frontier Audio that is just a straight 8 channel A/D - D/A converter box that connects to the 002R ADAT in/out connections. This gives me 8 additional inputs along with 8 more outputs (for a total of 16). It is clocked to the Mini-Me as well.

Hopefully the narrative helps. I could try and diagram it later if it's of any value to you.
 
That's helps a lot. The reason I asked is that I have the M8 and have yet to read about anyone using the spdif output in a real life application...however, they are really nice mixers for the money. I would be interested to hear the M12 -> Mini-Me as it would have a more dedicated clock.

Thanks,

-Jake
 
The Mini-me isn't connected to the M12. The M12 has a S/PDIF output only, same as the Mini-me. I basically use the the M12 for its preamps as well as ability to monitor existing tracks on the 002R while doing overdubs. I also use it as a PA front end during rehersals.
 
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