ibleedburgundy
The Anti-Lambo
I didn't say a majority (although it could be).
The performance of the United States under Donald Trump in response to the coronavirus has been piss poor. Do you deny it?!?
My Corona
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I didn't say a majority (although it could be).
The performance of the United States under Donald Trump in response to the coronavirus has been piss poor. Do you deny it?!?
DM60
Well-known member
This, I think, everyone can agree on.
This is an example of your passive aggressive twisting of things.
Your statements “your misinformation” or “Your Video”, which you have made on a few occasions.
‘Your’ implies ownership or authoring. Well, they’re not MY videos, I don't own them, I didn’t create them, etc. They aren’t mine
You don’t even know what specific videos or channel I was talking about being taken down. So to claim that ‘my videos’ are misinformation or harmful or dangerous is simply an assumption on your part.
As to the 1984 reference, yes we live in an age where what we say and do can be monitored. And that has been proven publicly.
We live in an age where history is being rewritten and sometimes erased.
And we live in an age where “wrong speak’ and “wrong think” exist.
Who gives a shit if it’s being done by the government or private corporations, They are doing it.
It IS happening. Censorship on a mass scale is occurring.
As to all of us, no matter what ideology we hold, we’re all subjected to this new world.
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Thats not exactly true. They have deleted lots of content providers who were not of their liking and nothing to do with money. More that they were right of left wing.
Mick Doobie
Resist We Much
You said "much" of the deaths in the US are due to misinformation. What is your definition of "much"? What is your definition of rhetoric? Politicized talking points? Propaganda?
I'm just asking you to provide evidence to back up that statement. Unless your statement is misinformation?!?
DM60
Well-known member
Dismal, hard to say, with riots and protests, but it is high:
United States 4 562 037
Europe: 2 904 970
I put the US alone and grouped Europe to get a closer population count. But I don't think this lays just on Trump. I think he knew what would happen to the economy and didn't want to go into lock down. But when he did try to stop flights into the country, many people had a fit. I think that is true that delay and idea may have created more cases. But also many Americans have a struggle to go into total lock down. Once again, look at the protests, that had to have some impact and while you may try and blame Trump for that, you would be stretching it just to throw rocks at the guy.
I would also agree he has tried to push for a more aggressive opening, because the economic fallout of this is going to get worse the longer it is drawn out. I think the risk of tracking with higher cases and manage from open hospital beds is a better strategy than shutting totally down.
But to be honest, the goal posts keep moving in the news. The original idea back in April/May was track the cases but the critical metric to watch was hospital capacity.
For the nation:
This was from CDC from July 14th. Not sure why it hasn't been updated.
Inpatient Beds Occupied (all Patients) 504,432 (479,075 - 529,789) 63% (62% - 64%)
Inpatient Beds Occupied (COVID-19 Patients) 64,496 (61,047 - 67,946) 8% (8% - 9%)
ICU Beds Occupied (all Patients) 75,257 (70,290 - 80,225) 61% (59% - 62%)
So if our critical metric is hospital capacity to treat the sick in the middle of July, based on capacity to treat the sick, then we are doing really well.
I mean it really depends on what your POV is, like it or not, life has to be managed risk/reward. We do it everyday. We know for sure what the impact of a lock down will have on the economy, what we don't really know (and don't say you do, because no one really knows) what will be the total deaths be and will it go into a true crisis mode (death rates higher than 10% or what ever the threshold would be and capacity to treat is exceeded). Which there is going to be some deaths, just like there would be normal flu season. But those decisions have to be made.
TAE
All you have is now
Monday morning quarterbacking is so easy...hindsight is 20/20. It's ( insert name ) fault ...because...
we're in weird ass times and in a few years we can look back and say well ( insert name ) really screwed the pooch on this..would of, could of, should of...For sure "mistakes were made" and continue to be made but mostly made with best intentions.. For certain there are financial opportunities that lie within this abyss that do sway many to the dark side..and it is on all levels...from Big Pharma wanting to cash in to people used to making minimum wage suddenly making more with unemployment than if they work choosing not to go back to work because "it's just not safe yet"...and then there's the union...OY!
I just hope n pray none of y'alls or your loved ones gets it and if ya do ya live to the tale.
we're in weird ass times and in a few years we can look back and say well ( insert name ) really screwed the pooch on this..would of, could of, should of...For sure "mistakes were made" and continue to be made but mostly made with best intentions.. For certain there are financial opportunities that lie within this abyss that do sway many to the dark side..and it is on all levels...from Big Pharma wanting to cash in to people used to making minimum wage suddenly making more with unemployment than if they work choosing not to go back to work because "it's just not safe yet"...and then there's the union...OY!
I just hope n pray none of y'alls or your loved ones gets it and if ya do ya live to the tale.
ibleedburgundy
The Anti-Lambo
Republicans are resisting wearing masks, resisting social distancing, resisting peer reviewed studies, and rushing to open businesses and schools back up when the overwhelming consensus of medical experts/epidemiologists says otherwise. Do you deny this?
Republicans have been urging people to go out and socialize, "liberate" yourselves, and ignore what the vast majority of doctors and epidemiologists are recommending. Do you deny this?
You think politicians overruling the medical community isn't having huge consequences?!? That isn't supported by the data.
There are no firm estimates at this time of how many people are dying as a direct result of misinformation campaigns that victimize unsuspecting folks like yourself, Herman Cain, TAE, Miroslav, RFR, Olson, etc. Whatever the number is, it would take years to validate, and it will be significant. The performance of the USA under Trump has been a complete disaster:
The USA is 4.2% of the world's population, but has 23% of the fatalities and 27% of confirmed cases. That is a shit result!
And while it's understandable that certain large population centers would struggle with the initial outbreak that took hold before we had much time to react, there's no excuse for the states that don't have high population densities but haven't learned the lessons by now, or by June, and are experiencing new outbreaks as a direct result of misinformation campaigns.
Here are the top 15 worst states right now in terms of new cases per capita on a 7 day rolling average, and the political party of their Governors:
1. Florida (R)
2. Mississippi (R)
3. Louisiana (D)
4. Tennessee (R)
5. Nevada (D)
6. South Carolina (R)
7. Georgia (R)
8. Texas (R)
9. Alabama (R)
10. Arizona (R)
11. Oklahoma (R)
12. Idaho (R)
13. Arkansas (R)
14. Missouri (R)
15. Alaska (R)
Of these states, only two of them (Nevada and Louisiana) have a Democrat Governor. It is not a coincidence that these are largely the same states that are most vulnerable to the kind of Republican misinformation campaigns that you are vulnerable to.
Source:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/grap...avirus-us-cases-deaths/?itid=sn_coronavirus_2
Here is a list of 215 countries. The USA is among the 10 WORST both in terms of coronavirus cases per million people and coronavirus deaths per million people.
Coronavirus Update (Live): 18,070,640 Cases and 689,761 Deaths from COVID-19 Virus Pandemic - Worldometer
ibleedburgundy
The Anti-Lambo
The states (counting DC) that had big protests (Portland, Oregon, New York City, New York, Washington DC) are not the ones that are experiencing current outbreaks.
All three are in the bottom 20 (out of 50+ states and territories) in terms of coronavirus infections per 100,000 residents:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/grap...avirus-us-cases-deaths/?itid=sn_coronavirus_2
ibleedburgundy
The Anti-Lambo
The population of Europe is 741 million people.
The US has 330 million.
So by these numbers we have 50% more infections with less than half the population, which would mean our infection rate is significantly worse.
ibleedburgundy
The Anti-Lambo
DM60
Well-known member
I must be looking at bad data, according to the CDC site, California has the highest rate, followed by Florida (people just have to go on vacation), Texas, New Your City, New York State.
But for increased trends, I think that gets a little harder, I am reading Hawaii has the biggest increase with 88%, followed by New Jersey (in percentage). But I think we both know, if you go from one to two, then that percentage is tainted, which is what is going on in Hawaii.
But that goes to my point, it really depends on how you slice the numbers and what you want them to say. To me, the number of cases is less important than the number of hospital beds.
The economy has to be factored in and risk assessed. This is where people argue IMO.
DM60
Well-known member
Well, I was looking at the EU only.
As of 1 February 2020, the population of the EU is about 445 million people.
TAE
All you have is now
Here's a new interview with Dr. Gold discussing WTF is going on with Hydroxychloroquine this is screwed up shit...or not if you want to believe Mark Zuckerberg 
I repeat WTF? Dr. Gold is legit...why in the world would she put herself in the crosshairs of being tar and feathered by the evil Machine? I put this up on D-tube where it will not be taken down by Uncle Marky knows best...what an asshat maroon
[video]https://d.tube/#!/v/tomco919953/QmWmGoJmYeXfX272wigCpFxEJGQjuYbJDs3swMPcGJASFK[/video]
I repeat WTF? Dr. Gold is legit...why in the world would she put herself in the crosshairs of being tar and feathered by the evil Machine? I put this up on D-tube where it will not be taken down by Uncle Marky knows best...what an asshat maroon[video]https://d.tube/#!/v/tomco919953/QmWmGoJmYeXfX272wigCpFxEJGQjuYbJDs3swMPcGJASFK[/video]
Mick Doobie
Resist We Much
You're attempting to move the goalpost. You said "much" of the deaths in the US have been due to misinformation. You have yet to define "misinformation".
On the subject of "misinformation".
- Early on President Trump restricted travel from China. Democrat elected officials resisted. Rather than focus on preventing an outbreak in this country, they resisted and chose to say there was nothing to fear, to focus on demonizing trump and calling him racist, xenophobic. They chose to deny evidence that there was a pandemic in bloom, coming from China, and enthusiastically invited people to gather in large numbers to attend Chinese New Years celebrations. Even as far as to encourage people to hug a Chinese, some of whom may have just returned from visits to China to celebrate CNY celebrations.
- Many Democrat politicians in spite of all evidence have strongly resisted identifying the origin of the virus as coming from China. Misinformation? Cuomo has called it the European virus. Pelosy, "the Trump virus".
- Masks. Fauci early on said masks do little to nothing to prevent the spread of the virus. Later he changed the tune and said we must wear masks. Which was "misinformation"? If he says one thing, and then another, is there any surprise that it would cause doubt in people's mind and they would resist?
- People are being told by the government that they cannot gather to worship, go to church and practice their right to worship. In fact they have been threatened with arrest should they do so. Yet, there has been no such concern and restrictions placed on protesters gathered in the hundreds, if not thousands. Government officials have said singing in church would cause the spread of the virus, but express no such concern for protesters gathered shoulder to shoulder and screaming their lungs out. I guess some constitutional rights are more important than others?
- People are being told by government officials that they cannot gather at funerals to bury their loved ones. Yet we see some of those same officials gathered in large numbers at John Lewis' funeral. Without a speck of irony evident, former President and shit stirrer Barack Obama said we must vote by mail because gathering in numbers is too dangerous...while speaking to a church packed with people. So according to powerful government officials, people can't gather to bury their loved ones, yet they themselves can gather for Lewis. I guess some people are more important and deserving of dignity & respect than others?
- Some experts are being banned/deleted from social media for straying from the official line from other preferred experts and/or politicians.
Is there no wonder people resist hypocrisy (and lies?) from the government and "experts"?
Finally, there was a study I read a couple few weeks ago. Make no mistake, it was a study that supported a strict response to the virus. At the molecular level, or whatever, bacteria are huge compared to virus. These masks they are saying we must wear, even the medical masks, they do very little to nothing to stop virus molecules. They go right through, or pass through the gaps at the nose or side of face. Homemade masks? forgetaboutit. As an example, they said if someone is smoking in a room, across the room, and you can smell it, if it was the virus you are exposed. The conclusion being masks do little to nothing. The real effective option is filtering the air in the room, a constant recycling and filtering. The study also brought up the eyes. Wearing a mask, even if they worked(which the study said they didn't), it does nothing to protect the eye membranes. Apparently others have read the same study, as there are now "experts" suggesting the need to wear goggles or face shields. No mention on masks doing little to nothing?
Your turn. Define the misinformation you speak of, and how it has caused "much" of the deaths in this country.
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TAE
All you have is now
I heard it from a guy on the internet about this study...Brother Mick link to the study or it's useless...Based on what you say, this "study" left you with the impression that mask are a waste of time..
The comparison of you can smell smoke..( you can) then the virus can get through just like the smoke...is not true ...maybe the virus itself is as small as the molecules that carry the smell of smoke..I don't know...what I do know is the virus can't survive if it is not incapsulated in some form of water moisture..saliva / mucus...the virus doesn't fly on it's own... it is carried in tiny droplets that do get caught in the mask..can some get through the sides of the non n95 mask.... yes.. and yes even a dumb bandanna is better than nothing... To say mask are useless is just not factual..to say mask reduce your chances 100% is not factual either...It is on the higher side of 50% reduction for sure...It is just prudent / responsible / respectful of others in these times when we don't know if we have the virus or not for up to a few days after we get it to wear a mask in public if only to help lower the chance of us unknowingly spreading it. Plus the fact that it does at some level help reduce the chance of you getting it if you are exposed. It is a temporary inconvenience that sure isn't going to hurt and may very well help. That's my view on that topic... would like to see the study as I can in no way understand how they can scientifically support the take away you got from it.
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