What method works best for you?

George Parler

New member
This might be an idea that would help other songwriters that may be in a slump or even better, those who are just starting to write.

Just post what method of songwriting works the best for you. If your like me you use every method at your disposal. But what I'm talking about is explaining which one is the esiest and most productive in an average situation for you. This may give the new
songwriters some fresh ideas they haven't thought of yet.

As for myself, the most productive is to write a song through someone else's eyes. When I'm doing this, I try to imagine what I would be thinking, feeling, or experiencing, if I were in that person's shoes. You may say why not through your own eyes. While I do write that way at times, I find I can be more objective to the situation on the outside looking in rather than on the inside looking for a way out. To mine own self I'm not always true. If all that makes any since from a songwriting standpoint?

Well I'm out of the shoot. NEXT?

George
 
I'm not sure what you really mean by 'method', but, if you are talkin about what state of mind, or how songs come to a songwriter, everyone uses a little different 'method'

I am the most successfull , usually when I am slightly tired, and a little buzzed from either alcohal, or a 'blunt'

I start playing my guitar, and just close my eyes and try to just let the music sort of take me where it wants.... Usually, a melody sort of appears,(no magic there) and then if I continue for long enuf, words also come trying to describe the feelings from the music/melody combination. This sometimes results in 1 or 2 pages of lyrics, and sometimes a complete song . But not always, just once in a while . A more common thing, at least for me, is that I sort of tail off when the words don't keep coming, and I go on to a different tune/melody, and keep playin till the ideas run out, or my fingers start to get sore....

I may come back to the same tune/melody several times before it actually becomes a song, and it may not even end up with the 2 pages of words, or even the same thoughts as when it first started.... I'm not sure exactly why this happens, but I always end up with several pages of words that have no melody anymore, because the finished song evolved into something different....

I have gone back to the original pages/ideas, and done another song based on those, but it doesn't always work that well for me..... I end up with notebooks full of excess thoughts, or lyrics , and every now and again will just read thru them for inspiration.

If you want to call this a 'Method', then, thats how it is for me.....



Upstate:D
 
well, for me i tend to write a lot on acoustic guitar (being primarily a guitarist), though at the moment i'm trying to get out of this habit. i always seem to be able to come up with melodies over chord progressions working this way but it seems like a bit of a 'production-line'. by this i mean building song after song as a builder might build a house, from a plan or a set of instructions. in other words my songs written this way tend to sound very generic: verse, chorus, verse, a vocal melody that mirrors the chord progression etc.

what i'm trying to do now with my songwriting is to take away the guitar and focus on what seems to me to be the most important component of a song: the vocal melody. for instance, why let a vocal melody be hemmed in by the linearity of a chord progression? (this is pretty subjective, i'm only talking about how i write when using guitar: personally i find that there are certain types of chords which i'm more likely to play on guitar which could have a dramatic effect on the vocal melody)

perhaps a better way of writing a song on guitar is to write a progression accompanying vocal melody using solely root notes rather than the whole chords. this could free up the vocal melody to go where it wants rather than being 'flavoured' by the type chord chosen to accompany it.

another thing that i'm trying is writing a vocal melody without the use of a guitar at all, or any other instrument for that matter. then when a vocal melody emerges it's a case of bending the other instruments around it rather than vice versa.

cheers
-matt
 
I guess I used the word "method" rather loosely, but you seem to have the idea. For a lack of better tems a guess I could have said what are the particulars that, for you, allow you to flow in your most productive creativity as a songwriter. Or as you define productive creativity.

I know what you mean about pages of thoughts stuffed in a notebook. About once every couple of months I drag it out and go through it. I'll read one that at that moment hits a sweet spot and begins to gel. Then we're off to the races. And you know what I'm talking about. You gotta write like most people need to breathe.

George
 
well,
it depends. I do many sorts. I enjoy writing songs from my point of view, about the past, about the future, about my relationship(s). I can write a poem, put it on guitar and all, or I can just write lyrics, sing them add guitar. I might come up with a neat riff and later add lyrics. I like writing songs that are sort of in the form of Stabbing Westward, Nine Inch Nails, Tool, or Pennywise....its just how I am. I may talk as if its a story, I may make myself the subject, or I might just make statements. My only problem is sometimes knowing what to write about, but if you find something funny, depressing, lifting, write about it. That's what I do.
 
matt's bedroom, you have a point. THat's usually what I do. Making vocals after writing the guitar parts can be very annoying, along with not only pitch, but rythm. I used to just directly improv sing the syllables and words into the songs, didn't work too great, though nice songs. Now I make the vocal melody, and make the guitar/bass/drums around that, not only can you perfectly find that right chord (as there are several), but you can also make them as complex as you'd like.
 
This topic has been covered over and over. If your interested in finding out what others including myself had to say, do a search. Search the whole songwriters forum from the beggining (it hasn't been here too long this place) as there have been some good threads.
 
musicsdarkangel said:
matt's bedroom, you have a point. THat's usually what I do. Making vocals after writing the guitar parts can be very annoying, along with not only pitch, but rythm. I used to just directly improv sing the syllables and words into the songs, didn't work too great, though nice songs. Now I make the vocal melody, and make the guitar/bass/drums around that, not only can you perfectly find that right chord (as there are several), but you can also make them as complex as you'd like.

do you mean make the vocal melody as complex as you like? if so i can see where you're coming from.
 
The biggest pronlem I feel is when you try and write a song. Like I have always said, I don't write songs because I want to (subconsciously (sp) maybe), I write because it kinda' happens. I sometimes just feel like grabbing a pencil and making some notes.

I never try and force it. I don't think-hey I've got to do this first, then add the guitar etc. By looking for a sound and then natuarlly developing and embellishing it; that where most of my songs come from.

Some of you that have read other posts of mine here will know just how much I hate deadlines. As soon as anyone tell's me "you've gotta do this by...." I can't do it. To me, in my mind that equates to some form of systematic approach and the development of rules which to me both scares me and takes the fun away.

Another thing I would add is that you should never (but there are of course no rules) try and manipulate a song by trying to turn it into something that it's not. By taking away this element of trying/seeing it as a job or work you will create something very organic. Let me tell you; I'm not afraid of hard work or putting the hours in, but to me I don't ever think about writing and it comes naturallyAt the end of the day, it's harder to let it go/ignore writing and let it come to you than it is to try and figure out how to overcome writers block, what formulas there are, whatr rules to follow. Why; because there aren't any rules or formulas and you are heading down a dead end when you could be learning to play you instrument(s) better; that's why.

Note: The above is my opinion only (oh, and I haven't read it through for mistakes) and if you don't like it................I don't give a fuck.

Later,
Krystof01.
 
Krystof01,

All the posts in this thread, including yours, is accomplishing exactly what it was intended for. Hence the title: What method works best for YOU. The whole point was so that everybody, especially the new beginning songwriters, could see that from such a diverse group of songwriters, that there are no rules in songwriting except your own. There are no A+B=C formulas. By this they can realize if they can't sit down and write a song at will, its OK. Some write the music first or the lyrics first, and others just get it all at the same time. Some wait for the songs to come to them, while there are others that are gifted enough to make the songs come to them. But by the same token they can also see that what works for others may, or may not, work for them.

I am by no means the best singer/musician/songwriter I've ever heard. But I do know a little bit about it. There were no BBS forums around when I started, that I knew of. What I gleaned over the years came from a lot of trial and error and overcoming misconceptions. So what ever little bit of knowledge I have, if it can help someone else, its theirs.

Time for me to hush,

George
 
I've tried many different ways to write songs. My first songs were copies of other song's melody and chords. I'd change the words then later the melody just a bit. I was like 10 to 12 then.
My first real song was drug induced. From the Mid 60s to the late 70s, just about everything I did was when I was high. Easy enough, but most didn't make much sense when I listened to them later.
When I quit doing acid, Berkely 25, Orange Sunshine, Purple Haze and other mind warppers, my whole style of music changed.

Since the early 80s my style has been pretty much the same. I'd do some chords, then the melody and lyrics would come out together. Then later, add the lead, riffs, turnarounds. Make adjustments to the chords, do the bass.

Now what comes out depends on my mood, what happened hours before I pick up my guitar affects what I play, sing, write. A depressing situation gets just that. I do very little writing when I'm depressed. I was doing Grunge thirty years ago. Hee, hee. When I feel normal, or a bit ansi, then is when the chords I begin playing will mimic my mood. After the chords, comes the right hand. Do I strum? Do I use a pick? Do I finger pick? I really don't decide. Honestly. If I have a pick in my hand, sometimes I lay it down and begin fingerpicking, or the other way around.
Since I have the chords, and the right hand is doing something, I set the tempo, beats/per/minute, (I do quite a few songs in 3/4 time) and pick or strum to match. I do this more or less on auto pilot. I let the music take over.
With the chords, I usually start with open major and minor chords, then when I have a rhythm set, I move up the neck to play fuller sounding chords. I use a Yamaha electric/nylon APX9NA when ever I want to just fiddle around. I'm comfortable with that instrument for what ever purpose. Later I may move the song to my SG, or slide guitar, or my J30-E steelstring acoustic. But I always start on my Yamaha nylon.
Something I don't understand is that I write some of my best songs, chord progressions, leads and basses runs when I'm tired. Usually about the time I'm ready put the guitars to bed, and hop in my case for the night.
Something I never know is what kind of song I'm going to be doing, if I do one at all.
I have several Kids songs, Christian songs, Song that would make David Alan Coe Blush with delight, Country, Rock, and my mainstay, slide blues. The words just come out.
Not every time I pick up the guitar do I write, and I never force it anymore. I average about two songs a month now. Sometimes more, some times none. But I practice and fiddle around every day, for hours, cuz that's what I do.
I always use a cassett player to record every practice or fiddling around session. Once I play something and try to write it down on paper, it's gone forever. I can't replicate that lick that 'just came', I can't remember that verse I just sang. I have to record it right then. Just the way I am.
One last thing, I can never, I mean never, practice or fiddle around or above all else, write a song when there is someone around.
There is more that I do and don't do, depending on the time, mood and if anyone is around. But I don't want to hog up all the space on the server's drives.

Hope it helps someone. Even if it just gets someone in the mood to write. The main thing for me is to let the music take over, I just become a tool to make the guitar sound and for a vent of lyrics and melody.
 
krystof01,
i agree with trying not to manipulate songs into something they're not, the trouble is this is probably the biggest weakness of my songwriting and something that i can address now it's come to light.

i have a tendency for my songs to all sound very different, but not in a positive way, in more of a spanning different musical styles, completely unrelated to each other, way.
the trouble is, i'm inclined to try to morph them all into a single/several styles that i feel best suits me as a musician. this is bad because invariably my songs are ruined when i try to do this to them, and after this frustration i never want to go back to the song and do what i should've been doing from the start: building upon it. :(

the thing that frustrates me is every band i listen to has a style, and writes songs (broadly) in a particular genre. i admire this quality, because it shows they are thoroughly exploring one style of music rather than spreading themselves too thinly over a whole range of styles. it's also a way of defining themselves, making them an individual band.

therefore i feel like i've hit upon a contradiction: i'm writing songs in many different styles whilst wanting to write songs in one particular style that i can call my own. as i mentioned though, my only solution to this: morphing my songs, has proved to be ineffective.
:(

anyone else with the same gripe?

-matt
 
Well it looks to me like you've finally arrived and earned the right to be called a songwriter; welcome to the world.

All the above I said about not trying and that also goes for developing your own style is a load of shit. Of course I try to write and end up manipulating songs. it's the theory against the practise. I don't like labelling myself as a songwriter but I guess I am one. I know that I'd like to be able to sit back and let it flow without ever pushing myself but it doesn't work like that (though I'm moving in the right direction).

You know when your a songwriter. that's when you run into these walls and can't seem to climb over them.

Music as with life is full of contradictions. You are your worst own critic. let others voice their opinion on your music. There is not one song that I have written that I a m totally satisfied with, there's always something I think should be there/taken away.

The bottom line is that you do have your own style like all those other bands. I know you do (as we all do). It's just not into focus as the moment/not in the context of a bang for example. It is the fact that you think you haven't got your own style that lies the problem.

I write vary different music and lyrics-rock/blues/classical/folk (country to you lot)/metal (touch on)/pop (touch on)/classical (touch on). Therefore I always used to think I didn't have a style of my own. What happens is that when you record it and listen to your songs it does become apparent that stripping everything else away, there is a style. By putting it into the context of a band there has to be an underriding style (however clear it may seem).

You can't asses our own work or style, others tdo that for you.

Whoo; 500 up.
 
matt's bedroom, I've just noticed your in this country too. So it is folk to you.

I am seeing more and more from over here, and about time. When I joined ther was only me and one other (I think).

Good, I expect you to buy my music then. LOL.
 
krystof01,

i hear what you're saying about everyone having their own style - i guess it's a continuum of the old 'no two people are the same' type thing.
what i mean by this is whatever you write is you, and if you are unique then whatever you write must also be unique. by being unique it is your own style, so yeah, i guess everyone has got a 'style'.
(sorry, i think that was incredibly badly explained :( )


-"Good, I expect you to buy my music then. LOL."

lol, i'll look out for your music in the mixing clinic. have you ever posted anything there?
 
In very general terms, when I write I try to make use of every musicical tool that I have at my disposal. I try to mix creating with my guitar, voice and keyboard. I'll create a song one day with merely my voice and the rhythm, and the next day start the creation process with my guitar experimenting with different chord progressions.

One huge thing that has helped me recently is buying a keyboard. I think as songwriters we tend to follow whatever "works" for us the most, but by adding this keyboard recently my creativity has widened. At first it is always a pain to learn theory and all that, but now that I'm familiar with playing it I have another creative tool to use. And I have written songs that I would have never written if it wasn't for the keyboard. I think musical progression in a physical sense can be a significant jumpstart to a stalled writer's problems.
 
chrisv,

I agree with the keyboardian theory. I play guitar, bass, and keyboards, primarily keyboards. I have hundreds of sounds and performance layers. I just play through the different patches until one of them strikes a creative nerve and then a progression begans to evolve from that. I have written songs using the guitar, but for me expression comes easier through the keys.

<><
George
 
interesting.

George Parler said:
I just play through the different patches until one of them strikes a creative nerve and then a progression begans to evolve from that. I have written songs using the guitar, but for me expression comes easier through the keys.

<><
George [/B]

Hello George.

Like you I prefer keyboards. Somehow it's just easier for me to
interact that way. "Sifting" through different chords, bits and
pieces that I've saved to disc or otherwise helps a lot. Once I've found a progression the lyrics are not far behind.

I appreciate the message in your song in your other post
"Christian Songwriters"- I think it was called "Just One Touch".
Little do we know how much it means, because we can't see
the whole picture- but in Someone else's hands our little efforts
mean so much, and become like refreshing rain in the due season.
Thanks for the post.

may God bless!

the Faithmonster
 
faithmonster,

Thanks for your comments. There are a few songs that I've written that I don't think I had much to do with other than holding the pen. If you know what I mean. But then again even a blind hog will find an acorn every now an then.

<><
Blind Hog........oops, George
 
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