Sudden increase in "can I sing?" posts.

rob aylestone

Moderator
We're getting loots of people posting topics that ignore the sticky at the top of the section. We've already got in trouble when instead of 'what a great voice' we said sort of OK or maybe a bit of work needed, then on pressing we become honest and say well, actually it's not so hot - then it explodes.

It's even stranger when people submit quite lo-fi recordings - as if the recording quality is immaterial. It's getting awkward to be honest. Should we be honest, or because it's singing and not guitar playing (where we are usually quite blunt) be less honest?
 
The reason I posted my thread here is because it seemed like the other sub forum was inactive compared to this one - last post being 2 weeks ago. Maybe other people feel the same
 
....but - the section is about quality, processing NOT singing.

I'm not comfortable giving my opinion directly to people. I have a history of doing this in my work, and I hate that aspect of it. It is horrible looking at a list of names and putting line through those that are pretty good, because I want the exceptional one. I've even been known to scrub an entire project when I cannot find the person I want.

I've not looked yet - have you found the missing tracks for the comparison you asked for?
 
....but - the section is about quality, processing NOT singing.

It is also about vocal technique, though.

So, it would appear to me that technical threads about vocal methodology can go here.

For that, you don't need a quality or finished product, at all. I guess it is the same for any instrument. You can hear and advise on technique from pretty average recordings.
 
If all 'Can I sing?' threads were sincere and from receptive OPs there probably wouldn't be a problem,
but the majority are either from people who know they can sing well and want a back-pat, or people who just don't have it and are likely to implode when they get an accurate critique.

Allowing that to be integrated into a parent forum just means it's much harder to see the stuff that you actually want to see; Discussions on vocal technique.

The same is true for the Marketing Forum.
Clearly a place to discuss techniques and approaches but riddled with advertisements.
The Show-Off subforum was created to maintain the original intention of the parent forum.
 
Very frustrating. There is already a cultural barrier between singer and producer.

There is so much really interesting stuff to discuss about vocal technique. I can't figure out why the topic never seems to take off. I see the sense in hiving off the "can I sing threads", but why is there such a lack of interest in vocal technique, itself?

Why don't more people post about their journey, how they overcame hurdles in singing -- with specific before and after clips, and an explanation of what made the difference? Proof of the pudding, take it or leave it stuff, that needn't incur argument?

You never know who may learn from you, and what you may learn from others, whatever your level of singing.
 
If all 'Can I sing?' threads were sincere and from receptive OPs there probably wouldn't be a problem,
but the majority are either from people who know they can sing well and want a back-pat, or people who just don't have it and are likely to implode when they get an accurate critique.
I usually just adopt a just say no policy to those threads. Actually more just an ignore them policy :D
 
Well, this is it. Like it or not a lot of people simply don't want to read, or participate in, 'Can I Sing?' threads.
If the vocal technique forum is littered with them, that would probably be enough to stop a lot of people even looking in there.

Maybe posting in the sub-forum should have a mandatory pitch-perception test! :P
 
In most cases it's newbs just trying to get an outside objective honest opinion and not generally to aware or concerned about forum etiquette ( is this the right place to be posting)

Being honest without being a jerk is really not that hard. That said, when dealing with such a personal thing as vocals no matter how you try and sugar coat it some people are going to get offended no matter what.. If you're uncomfortable giving an opinion as you don't want to hurt feelings it is probably best just not to respond....or only respond when you have really good things to say...

I try and be honest and there are sometimes where not saying anything is better than "putting it out there" so I just click away..and let the wolves have lunch...Gotta say the main players here now are much more kind than some of the gatekeepers of the past....man it could get ugly FAST!
 
I don't think we get too many angry responses as compared to the more reasonable ones. You have to expect some because its probably the most personal (music) topic most OP'ers will ever ask us about.

I just think it gets under our skin when someone goes off and shoves back. I know it gets to me for sure. Actually.......I think we get a more OP's that just disappear after the first negative vibe.

One thing I think we do wrong is to not ask the OP early on how THEY THINK they sound. Strengths....weaknesses? That way we can know what we're up against and might even be able to give better feedback....or chose to ignore the thread.

As always.......just throwing out my 2 cents worth.
 
I think that singers or people learning to sing tend to be labelled as prima donnas. It kind of takes off from there. There are people whose instinctive reaction is to "put you in your place". That's is the primary reason why you need a thick skin.

Take me, for example. You could bruise a rhino more easily.
 
I think that singers or people learning to sing tend to be labelled as prima donnas. It kind of takes off from there. There are people whose instinctive reaction is to "put you in your place". That's is the primary reason why you need a thick skin.

Take me, for example. You could bruise a rhino more easily.

That's not a bad point..........as regards the average public........but I doubt that too many here on this forum would feel that way about singers. Maybe I'm wrong about that. I think the problem begins when well intentioned family and friends give a Budding singer false signals about their overall talent.......keeping in mind that family and friends may not have the "ear" to do otherwise anyway. You know.....coddled and encouraged.
 
That's not a bad point..........as regards the average public........but I doubt that too many here on this forum would feel that way about singers. Maybe I'm wrong about that. I think the problem begins when well intentioned family and friends give a Budding singer false signals about their overall talent.......keeping in mind that family and friends may not have the "ear" to do otherwise anyway. You know.....coddled and encouraged.

To be honest it really is no different at all to 1st round X-factor/victorian freak-show (same thing).
Some break down and cry, some freak out and fight, some start attack you and your credentials and some just exit immediately.
Of course some take it on the chin and try, try, try again, but I bet everyone one of them has a Mommy who told them they were just super. :P

I mean, that sounds nasty laying out out like that. Family+friends blowing smoke works great when it stays in that little bubble.
The Xfactor stage, or some live gig, or this forum, are outside of that bubble though!
Where self awareness or ability to self-critique is missing, that person's not going to have a good time.

All of that said, I do love seeing 'Can I sing?' follow ups where the OP has put in a lot of work and come back better.
That genuinely is really nice to see/hear.
 
Heh, with a join date of 2016, you don't know the half of it!
You'd have needed that rhino skin a year or two earlier! ;)

Caught the tail end of it! ;)

I tell you, some of the folk wished they were trying to take chunks out of a rhino, instead.

I came here baked solid from experience on other forums! Actually, it goes way back. By time I was 12, I was practically built of mahogany.
 
That's not a bad point..........as regards the average public........but I doubt that too many here on this forum would feel that way about singers. Maybe I'm wrong about that. I think the problem begins when well intentioned family and friends give a Budding singer false signals about their overall talent.......keeping in mind that family and friends may not have the "ear" to do otherwise anyway. You know.....coddled and encouraged.

You haven't met my family. I'd have to be a masochist to ask them what they think. :cool:

In my experience you have to strike a balance between taking advice and being stubborn. Both are necessary, but must not extend to denial. If you simply get cowed by numbers of people saying one thing, it could work against you. When I first struck out on a singers forum, I got a shed load of indifferent responses, and advice on how to fix my deficiencies. But my stubborn streak kicked in, and I told myself not to pay undue attention to stylistic preferences, or how many people were saying what. I would listen mainly to points about more objective issues, like pitch and projection, rather than style.

Eventually, I noticed that the few complimentary replies I was getting were ALL from classical singers (which is weird, since I was not into classical singing, at all). And when I stumbled on advice on youtube that I could relate to, it turned out that the authors were famous classical tenors. (I only realized later, so it wasn't confirmation bias). All the advice I had been rejecting before that, had been more contemporary techniques. So my stubbornness and intuition paid off, and I found what worked for me.
 
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