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Thread: Power conditioner and sequential power up

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by ecc83 View Post
    I bow of course to Miroslav's huge experience but please follow my logic for a moment re audio interfaces at least?

    In a typical small studio the AI will likely be USB bus powered and if you are happy to power a PC (which draws a g'dawful current waveform!) from a UPS then the DC to that AI is as clean and stabe as can be got.
    Even an AI that is also "rat" powered such as my 8i6 uses an SMPSU and so does not care about mains waveforms and even if it did, the AI uses DC-DC conveters to derive audio spook and CPU volts.

    I have a cheap 'ass Maplin 500Va inverter, I shall try to hook that up soon and see what'appen! Do you think a top line Sony Dolby S cassette machine would be a good test?

    Dave.
    You don't have to bow...just curtsy.

    So in your example...I would agree, just with the UPS because the AI is not being powered from the UPS or outlet.

    I don't know what people have in their home setups, and I think each person needs to consider their setup and proceed from there, rather then adopt what someone else is doing at face value.
    In my case...I use converters that need AC power, not USB...and their communication with the DAW computer is through PCI cards.

    Also...even in the small home setup, you don't just have a computer and a USB powered AI in most cases. People use guitar amps, preamps, they may have tube mics that need power, or phantom power for other condenser mics...there may other analog gear...and let's not forget your studio speaker monitors.
    All those things benefit from clean analog power (not cheap UPS power)...and they should all be protected too.

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    6 x 2.5KW RMS amps (not class D, so with big transformers) Input rush current means two of them trip a 16A type B breaker. Once on, of course the current drops to hardly anything - and all 6 going full steam-ish won't trip the breaker with continuous demand. start up, via a switch is a no-no.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by rob aylestone View Post
    6 x 2.5KW RMS amps (not class D, so with big transformers) Input rush current means two of them trip a 16A type B breaker. Once on, of course the current drops to hardly anything - and all 6 going full steam-ish won't trip the breaker with continuous demand. start up, via a switch is a no-no.
    Yes, big jobs Rob but! Even more that means they were not cheap? All it needs is a relay in the mains circuit, a suitable chunk resistor to slow the juice down and a triple five timer. Of course, these days they would use a CPU to do the timing and THAT would FU!

    Flip me mate! I did this to a grotty Tuac 100W amp twenty years ago. Not because of inrush current but to prevent the seriously loud switch on CRACK! Mind you I just used a transistor and CR circuit to give about 2secs delay.

    Miroslav (bobs accordingly for we are not worthy) I agree people must sort out their own situation but I firmy believe that the makers of ALL sorts of electronic equipment should design them to cope with most of the worlds power supplies. This is even easier these days since the maturing of SMPSUs which have to have serious filtering to stop the RF crap leaking out of both ends!

    But then that is just one of the hobby horses of this old, med ridden valve jockey!

    It was debated here in some depth (and it wee bit testily!) but balanced mains is not really practical or safe (for third persons) in UK. It IS used in certain medical/science premises but these are of course very strickly controlled. It is in fact very hard to source a 230V centre tapped transformer in UK.

    Dave.

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    I like Jim Brown's paper. It's ten years old but still worth reading.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rob aylestone View Post
    I like Jim Brown's paper. It's ten years old but still worth reading.
    It suffers a bit from the "drinking from a firehose" problem, at least for me. Lots of good information, but it could benefit from being separated into chapters, having a table of contents and index - at least it might be more accessible if you just wanted to get info about the question raised by the OP.

    As a quasi-relevant aside, it does mention the problem of remembering the state before the power went out. My conditioner that has the sequenced on/off feature does not remember, so if there is a power failure, it remains off. Which is Ok, because I probably don't want stuff automatically turning back on if we've had an outage, since it can be a series of off/on/off/on before they get everything re-routed and working again stably around here sometimes. Anyway, the moral is, don't put your UPS on the other side of something that will not power back on itself, if you really want the UPS to only be used for short outages, because it might remain on for days when the outage is only a minute! (DAMHIKT!)
    "... I know in the mornin' that it's gonna be good
    when I stick out my elbows and they don't bump wood." - Bill Kirchen

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    Quote Originally Posted by keith.rogers View Post
    As a quasi-relevant aside, it does mention the problem of remembering the state before the power went out. My conditioner that has the sequenced on/off feature does not remember, so if there is a power failure, it remains off. Which is Ok, because I probably don't want stuff automatically turning back on if we've had an outage, since it can be a series of off/on/off/on before they get everything re-routed and working again stably around here sometimes. Anyway, the moral is, don't put your UPS on the other side of something that will not power back on itself, if you really want the UPS to only be used for short outages, because it might remain on for days when the outage is only a minute! (DAMHIKT!)
    yikes. that admonition about the UPS sounds strangely familiar, I think I heard of it happening to someone I know. No, not me

    and yes, the old flickering while the circuit breakers in the mains system decide who's picking up the tab and who's (in)conveniently forgotten their wallet definitely happens here although not as much of late. Now it is more like either it's on solidly or it's out for hours/days at a time. Although two years in a row the transformer right outside my house at the foot of my driveway has had incidents of critters crisping themselves on some sort of uber huge fuse like device (blue jay one time and squirrel another). I watched the lineman fix it once and it was an astounding simple job, er, well not complex anyway. I wasn't the one elevating up in a bucket towards thousands of volts right over my helmet. He used some sort of fiberglass pole with a loop/hook and reattached some thing that looked like a big spring. I think it took longer to clip his safety harness and grounding cables than the actual reset job.

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    I placed a rack mount 8 position power switch right under my patch bay. I sit down at the desk & can turn on any combination of my gear. For instance I can play my keys with just powering them, the mixer & monitors. I can turn them all on for the whole studio to be up. I have an additional Furman in my rack that turns on all my outboard gear. All of this is powered by 2 in wall sockets. All are reachable by my seat. Other than the Furman all I have are 2 large surge protectors for the computer stuff. I used to use a UPS but it died & I never replaced the battery. We donít lose power here that often anyway.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ladewd View Post
    I placed a rack mount 8 position power switch right under my patch bay. I sit down at the desk & can turn on any combination of my gear. For instance I can play my keys with just powering them, the mixer & monitors. I can turn them all on for the whole studio to be up. I have an additional Furman in my rack that turns on all my outboard gear. All of this is powered by 2 in wall sockets. All are reachable by my seat. Other than the Furman all I have are 2 large surge protectors for the computer stuff. I used to use a UPS but it died & I never replaced the battery. We don’t lose power here that often anyway.
    do you have a picture of this device? I'll have plenty of space in my new desk when I get it assembled.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bluesfordan View Post
    do you have a picture of this device? I'll have plenty of space in my new desk when I get it assembled.
    I think he's talking about something like this:

    Technical Pro SURGE9 Rackmount 9-Outlet Power Strip SURGE9 B&H


    I use something similar in one of my racks for the handful of rack gear pieces that don't have front panel power switches...and reaching to the back of the rack is not easy.
    TBH...I have no idea why this would be of any value for racked gear pieces where you CAN simply use the power switch on its front panel...and you just turn them on in sequence and/or as needed.

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