Recording acoustic guitar ( new mic)

maxman65

Member
I have a very basic set up . Tascam dpoo8ex 8 track . Recently bought the new mic lewitt 440 pure which is large diaphragm. I've experimented with this . The capture seems fairly clean but still lacking a bit in presence . The recorder also has small internal mics one of which I can use in conjunction . Using both does sound possibly thicker but possibly less clean . I'm tempted to end up double tracking the guitar part with the large diaphragm condenser mic . I'm recording in a small environment which is largely non reflective acoustically . Any ideas ?
 
Before the real 'sperts come in...Put a few sq mtrs of "hardboard" on the floor.

Dave.
 
Don't use the built-in recorder mics.

Do experiment with mic placement and your position in the room.
Unless you have a room that is well-balanced acoustically (most home studios are not), it's better to record somewhat of a 'dead' sound, then EQ and add reverb in post-production.
 
It's a pretty flat non reflective environment and small . I had the mic about one foot to 18 inches from the body / neck aimed about 45 degree angle into the body corner and roughly level to fretboard height . Re : hardboard is that to re introduce some reflection off the floor
 
Move the mic. There are areas where you will get more body tone. Shift up, down, on axis off axis, etc. Sometimes to get the tone you want it's easier to double the part with two or more mic positions, just check for major phase issues(minor phase differences tend to sound good). I have done a quick set up just by putting an LDC laying down sideways in the keyboard tray of my desk and just moving the guitar around to get the tone I wanted.
 
Yes Double tracking has crossed my mind but would need to be pretty tight overdub . This isn't a cut and paste situation. Yes see what you mean . Slightly different position on the overdub to introduce more tonal variety
 
I have a very basic set up . Tascam dpoo8ex 8 track . Recently bought the new mic lewitt 440 pure which is large diaphragm. I've experimented with this . The capture seems fairly clean but still lacking a bit in presence . The recorder also has small internal mics one of which I can use in conjunction . Using both does sound possibly thicker but possibly less clean . I'm tempted to end up double tracking the guitar part with the large diaphragm condenser mic . I'm recording in a small environment which is largely non reflective acoustically . Any ideas ?

lack of presence ? move closer !
 
It's a pretty flat non reflective environment and small . I had the mic about one foot to 18 inches from the body / neck aimed about 45 degree angle into the body corner and roughly level to fretboard height . Re : hardboard is that to re introduce some reflection off the floor

What are you using as a playback system for your recordings? Headphones....monitors? What models etc. Not saying that whatever you're listening with is the culprit......but often times it's a factor. As I recall.......going back in time.......I think you mentioned that your environment was a mobile home or trailer of some sort? Apologies if that's not correct.
 
Just using M-30x cans alone can certainly affect your results. I understand if incorporating near-fields is not practical money wise or space wise. You're not completely alone in that regard. Assuming you have no desire to give your music to anyone else or post it or distribute it.......and your goal is to have fun with your songs for yourself.........no one should tell you that your play-back setup is not workable. However........that being said......you never know what you might do with your music down the road........so being able to produce a result that will reliably play well on many systems is something you might want to consider. Your recorder and mic are fine. Maybe think about upgrading your headphones? If that helps to solve a few issues for you......it can be worth it.

By the way........if you post a part of your work here.......we might be able to save you some time as well.

Just my 2 cents as always.
 
I'll experiment some more . It's not bad sound really but feel It could be a bit more "present " /fuller /thicker . Tempo is fairly moderate and I have a rhythm track as a guide so I will also test out double tracking and see if that's a viable solution . Meanwhile play around also with mic proximity and gain to optimise . I could upgrade headphone but I'm not convinced yet that's where it lies.One way or another I feel there's a bit more I can get out of that existing kit
 
Go ahead and post a sample here. Can't hurt. Trust us. We're here to help....and we've all been there.....heard that......still there.....hearing that. Based on your OP.......without hearing your result it's equally as likely likely that we'll lead you astray.....as it is we'll help you. Are you referencing your results anywhere else other than the M-30x's? Your car or someone else's car or stereo? I've had the M-30x's and they're very fine for tracking.......better than most IMO.......but they're not up to the task of mixing and mastering and hearing the proper nuances........"presence".......sound stage.......etc....etc.....that you're looking to improve upon in your work. The recorder and mic you are using are a notch above those cans IMO. You're going to experiment without being able to hear properly. Now....I'm not at all suggesting that you need to spend lots of bucks by any means............although investing in a top notch set of cans will never cause you a problem. Just upgrade enough to take the headphone element / debate.......out of the issue. If I may suggest..........a budget of under $150 gives you a few options that will quickly reveal elements of your mix or tracks you may not be hearing correctly.
 
I wouldn't too discouraged. The acoustic guitar is always a bugger to record--at least for me. I've had more success with almost everything else, including some oddball instruments like a plectrum banjo or a resonator ukulele. I've tried expensive instruments (including my Martin 000-18), new strings, and alternative playing approaches (bar chords, power chords, transposition using a capo, etc.) I've tried Nashville tuning, open tuning, dropped tunings. I've used a variety of stereo techniques as well as a dedicated stereo mic, and I've doubled tracked. I've pointed the mic from every angle and placed it anywhere from the 12th fret to the sound hole. And I've used every mic a could get my hands on, including a $1k Soundeluxe U195, an AT5050, and a Shure SM81 small diaphragm condenser. I've never used a ribbon mic, but I'm pretty confident that my success would be marginal. Bottom line: It's a challenging instrument, especially if you are playing solo. Unfortunately, you just have to keep trying, even if it means knocking your head against the wall. So try the some of the stuff I've listed above. Experiment, experiment, experiment.
 
Yes all true. I do think at some point I need to hear this through speakers / monitors . I have a fairly decent Hifi buried somewhere Rogers speakers . Also definitely i think an acoustic guitar is a particularly challenging instrument to record inherently . Recently got hold of a Yamaha s975 for its string sound in there .granted its never going be like the real thing but its pretty decent . That I tested direct input to recorder adjusted gain panned hard left and right . Sounded fine to me .Good to go pretty much . Seemingly no real comparison for level of difficulty with miked acoustic. Not really in a position to buy any more kit right now . I've maxed out on my budget for all this
 
Whenever I see "classical" guitar performed, on TV say, there is always a lovely big room and often just a pair of crossed (co-i) capacitors set discretely some 2mtrs in front of the player. The sound, BBC as a rule, is invariably excellent.

But most of us don't have lovely big rooms! If you can tap into the BBC's iPlayer try to find some Julian Bream masterclasses.

Dave.
 
Will do . Yes what I did here was to get a mic to try cover all applications as far as possible . The large condenser lewitt will likely come into its own on vocals . Budget permitting I might have had a pair of smaller condensers for guitar . It was a budget driven compromise purchase . Still pretty decent on instruments (should be )
 
Whenever I see "classical" guitar performed, on TV say, there is always a lovely big room and often just a pair of crossed (co-i) capacitors set discretely some 2mtrs in front of the player. The sound, BBC as a rule, is invariably excellent.

But most of us don't have lovely big rooms! If you can tap into the BBC's iPlayer try to find some Julian Bream masterclasses.

Dave.

Another interesting approach can be found on any of the NPR Tiny Desk sessions on YouTube. The room looks horrible but the sound is always quite remarkable. Most of it is done with a stereo mic setup and a guru of course. :D
 
Dwillis 45 (still don't know how to do a yellow box reply ) . Thought occurred to me . Martin 00018 from memory is an om type . Probably a Lot of detail but less projection . That brings me back to mic proximity comment someone made ?
 
Yes.......certainly when recording an acoustic guitar or other string instrument.......mic placement is critical and in my experience.....can be unique to each instrument's character. No two guitars seem to have the exact same sort of mic placement mapping. Using your Lewitt alone or using your Lewitt with one of the Tascam built-ins......at some point you'll likely get closer to the results you want. Keep trying. You don't mention (or I missed it somewhere) what guitar model you're using. What's the sonic character of that guitar? If you've ever gone into any GC "acoustic" room and played around with several brands and models......the differences between all of them are astonishingly clear. I own the "cheap" Martin. When I played it at home it sounded great compared to my Fender and my Ovation. But.....when I played that same model in the GC "acoustic" room.....it was....to say the least.....less than sparkling and tonally so so. My point is......some guitars will never achieve what we hear on great tracks of others. Effects and other efforts can help......but it is what it is.
 
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