Preamp for recording Beatles type music

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I definitey do not understand your point.

And THAT pretty much sums it up...


Does the keyboards sound change for who plays it? Anybody can press the A key down similarly and it will play the same sound.


The whole point is that no two people will play "similarly"...so it will not sound the same.
You really need to get off the player piano and MIDI data mentality about music and how it is made.
An instrument is a tool, but everyone uses the tool a bit differently, and so the resulting sounds are not the same....IF you learn to hear the differences.
 
Of possible interest to note:

Leo Fender was cheap. He designed and built some legendary equipment, but when people go back to look at the recipe it seems like what was originally in those amps was sort of based on what was at hand. 20% tolerance components. A variety of different transformers and speakers. It makes it entirely possible that you could have 2 or more different examples of the same model year of the same amp that somehow aren't the same.

There were musicians in the UK that spoke to Jim Marshall about wanting to buy a Fender Bassman locally because it could be substantially loud. The result was the JTM 45 - in many ways a clone of the Bassman but with different implementation of negative feedback and other minor tweaks. Pretty much the same circuit but with a distinct voice instantly recognizable as Marshall. The same, but, not.

EMI is fairly unique in the history of recording. The Beatles catalog was no doubt the result of the creative output of John, Paul, George and Ringo but there was also the production team of engineers, the facility and George Martin. EMI was not in the business of producing pop bands and initially there wasn't very much excitement over signing The Beatles. Makes me wonder what it would sound like if they had recorded at Olympic or Trident or somewhere else with a different production team. Or what if they had decided to pioneer the indie movement, buy a 4 track and do everything in Paul's mom's garage themselves?
 
The engineers have the knowledge on how to apply the equipment to the artists talent.

I have no clue what your talking abot, make a cel phone video handing your guitar off to a buddy. Both of you pay an A chord similarly. LET'S HEAR THIS DIFFERENCE . SHOW ME!

I find this too elementary a topic to discuss with any detail.

For me it is the same sound. No one is changing the patch on the keyboard or guitar preset. You claim you play the A chord a little different. However you articulating the same sound.
 
No the gear is what makes the sound. Your are talking semantics like a artistic brat if you ask me.

The gear operates on a set of presets and patches, sometimes even actual samples. The gear contains the path or chain that controls the sound the gear makes. The artist controls the time and amount of the event. I chose my sounds based on the presets, or model of amplifier. A sound can be saved as a preset and shared with others. When another loads a custom preset designed by another they can enjoy that sound too. It is not coded to the creator. However its up to player to maintain the accuracy of the piece.
 
Maybe art isn't always confined to a dot matrix.

Not always. I used analog gear too.

Everybody has a different style of play. I wouldnt claim the gear changes tone just because the person holding it is different. Accuracy is the key.

A guitar sound should be recognizeable, searched for , repeatable, and when dialed in celebrated.
 
The gear operates on a set of presets and patches, sometimes even actual samples.

If all you ever play are presets and patches...then you will not understand.

Get out of the box.
Pick up a real guitar...go sit at a real piano...or a real drum set.
No two people will play them exactly the same or sound exactly the same.

It's like singers.
They can sing exactly the same note through the same mic/preamp/compressor gear...and no two singers will sound the same.
 
Perhaps if two guys play a single chord or note or strum a keyboard chord or whatever on the same instrument........with the absolute INTENTION to make them sound alike........MAYBE you get a lot of similarity.....although a scope would likely show some differences. A player piano is mechanical.....and people are not....NO MATTER how much they try to be. And all that having been said........since songs are NOT made up of one single chord or note or strum.......what does an overall "sound" have to do with a single anything......including a pre-amp.

Your logic seems to say that you and I can be the Beatles.......if we just play the same instruments. Ok.......uh...huh.
 
No two people will play them exactly the same or sound exactly the same.

.

The inverse is also true.

The only way to sound exactly the same,
is by playing them exactly the same.
Adding, with the same gear.


Exactle the same in 1/8 quantization or less is a very finite space.
 
Cloning people was NOT done back then. We hadn't back engineered all the Roswell debri yet.

Robots?
 
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From my perception, everyone else is trolling. Not Lazer. I completely understand what he is saying, I think. And if so, I agree. Everyone else is being overly technical. This discussion kind of falls under the overused myth that "tone is all in the fingers". Not even close. But anyway...

Leaving all technicalities aside, on the surface example: If you eat a pancake at IHOP in California, then go to New York and eat a pancake at IHOP, they are 99.9% of the time going to taste exactly alike. If you buy a Fender Twin in California and one in New York, they might not taste alike, but they are going to sound alike. Doesn't matter who plays it. SOUND...not style, not talent, how one chords an A, how one strums an A, etc. etc....the amps themselves will sound the same.

I can't tell you the number of guitar players I've seen and heard that were not particularly good or technical players, but their tone was fantastic. Then I look at their gear. And there ya go.
 
Then I look at their gear. And there ya go.

Sometimes money can buy happiness.

A Korg A3 will makes the guitar sound for U2's mysterious ways. The edge masterfully articulates the sound brilliantly for the recording.

Anybody can buy an A3 and use the preset 76 on card 1. Here is a direct input A3 and that B chord that I just did in the 6i6. I have no idea how to properly record anything,,,see my newbie post! It sounds pretty close, being recognizable, researched, and celebrated.
 

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The inverse is also true.

The only way to sound exactly the same,
is by playing them exactly the same.
Adding, with the same gear.


Exactle the same in 1/8 quantization or less is a very finite space.

And this approach is what you think makes for good music...everything the same, quantized for accuracy...?

OK...I guess we all have our styles and preferences.

....the amps themselves will sound the same.

Yeah...my amps all sound the same when no one is playing them. :D

You're arguing that the same brand/model of gear sounds the same...OK, but you leave out the rest...someone has to actually play/use the gear, and THAT is where the differences come from.
Go turn on your amp and stand back and let me know how it sounds without anyone playing it.

No one is saying that gear is not important, or if 10 people buy the same amp, it won't generally be the same sounding amp.
What's being said is that when people play, no two people sound the same, and even one person strumming one chord several times, each strum will not be identical. Sure, it may still be an "A" chord, but the subtle difference in the harmonics and dynamics of each strum is where the beauty lies.
I would think it would be totally boring if every strum was 100% identical....but apparently some people want that, and they use MIDI and preset patches to make everything the same, and robotic.

There is an article in the current Tape Op magazine where an engineer talks about tracking stuff with Neil Young, and how they took 10 Fender Reverb Deluxe amps, tried them all...and picked out the two best sounding ones...so even you're notion that every Fender is identical is not accurate.
 
"There is an article in the current Tape Op magazine where an engineer talks about tracking stuff with Neil Young, and how they took 10 Fender Reverb Deluxe amps, tried them all...and picked out the two best sounding ones...so even you're notion that every Fender is identical is not accurate. "

All real world production amplifers are subject to component tolerances. One percent MF resistors might be pretty cheap but 1% Caps are not! Then there are inevitable tiny differences in transformer windings.

So, a good amp manfctr has a QC spec giving the response as + or - so many dBs about a standard. 2dB is held to be fair for R&R. Thus one sample might be 4dB louder at 4kHz (ref 1kHz) compared to another and 4dB is quite audible I assure you.

Not all amp makers are as fussy as even 2dB and many don't bother to check at all!

Dave.
 
There is an article in the current Tape Op magazine where an engineer talks about tracking stuff with Neil Young, and how they took 10 Fender Reverb Deluxe amps, tried them all...and picked out the two best sounding ones...so even you're notion that every Fender is identical is not accurate.

Quit using an electron microscope. Pick up the magnifying glass instead. You don't need a electron microscope level ear to duplicate a sound.

Those dudes are talking shit. My BS meter pegged at least.

Go to Guitar Center. Pick 10 NIB Fender DRRI amps. They are going to sound the EXACT same. I think its guaranteed in Fenders warranty.

Again you claim a significant difference player to player and gear to gear. Please provide a cel phone quality video to illustrate your point.

I get you want to be an idividual and sound unique. To think one Fender amp is going o have a golden sound over another of the same model is bullshit.
 
To think one Fender amp is going o have a golden sound over another of the same model is bullshit.

That is a fallacious statement known as a straw man. The claim isn't that one amp will sound objectively better than others of the same model, it's that they will not be identical. If Neil Young likes two better than the others, that's a subjective preference to which he's entitled.
 
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