Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 32

Thread: Phantom Power for Oktava MK-219 Mic

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Posts
    19
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Rep Power
    0

    Phantom Power for Oktava MK-219 Mic

    Sign in to disable this ad
    Hi

    I practise my live set at home using an old Octavia MK-219 Mic, into a TC-Helicon Mic Mechanic (v1) into a Steinberg u22 into powered monitors

    The Octavia MK-219 hisses a lot though as it needs 48V Phantom Power and the Mic Mechanic only produces 24V

    What would be the best cheap and easy solution to this? Would putting something like this:

    SubZero Phantom Power Supply at Gear4music
    Behringer PS400 Phantom Power Supply at Gear4music

    between the Mic Mechanic and the Octavia sort it out?

    The Mic Mechanic has always on phantom power so would that cause any problems going into one of these units?

    Thanks very much in advance

    Masten

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    on the lam
    Posts
    237
    Thanks
    20
    Thanked 8 Times in 8 Posts
    Rep Power
    187319
    do you mean a Steinburg UR22? I couldn't find a u22. It has 48v phantom power, you don't even need to use the mic mechanic

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Posts
    19
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Rep Power
    0
    Hi there

    Yeah sorry is a ur22.

    I'm using the Mic mechanic pedal for the reverb. I use this inline with the mic at small gigs (where phantom power not a problem as they use dynamics) and want to simulate as much as possible that environment when Im practising at home. I only have a condenser mic at home though that needs 48v.

    Unless you're saying that the phantom power on the ur22 (which I have off when mic mechanic is inline) would go through the mic mechanic to the mic, but am worried it might damage the mic as that would be 48V from that and 24V from the Mic mechanic

    Any phantom power experts out there?

    Thanks

    M

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Massachusetts
    Age
    71
    Posts
    4,531
    Thanks
    11
    Thanked 230 Times in 211 Posts
    Rep Power
    10181459
    I've got a Behringer PS400. I believe there are a couple of capacitors which would block any phantom voltage coming from the Mike Mechanic from getting into the 48 volt side of the PS400 and the mic. Conversely these same capacitors prevent the PS400 48vdc from getting to the Mic Mechanic. I'm 95% sure you wouldn't have a problem. Connect everything up and then apply power.

    However........ if it were me doing this......
    The PS400 goes about $24-$25. Rather than use the money for something you'll likely never use on anything else except this setup, get an inexpensive dynamic mic instead. The Octava seems to be a classic sort of mic that could seem to serve a better purpose than what you are presently using it for. A dynamic will be closer to what you use at gigs as well.

    Go cheap.....
    https://www.amazon.com/Behringer-Ult...ruments&sr=1-2

    or a little better.......
    https://www.amazon.com/Electronics-V...gateway&sr=8-3
    Mark.......

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    northampton uk home of Dr Who and Blackstar Amps!
    Posts
    10,010
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 671 Times in 635 Posts
    Rep Power
    9374895
    Beware budget phantom power units. I would not call myself an "expert" but I have bought a couple of pups!
    The problem is some PSUs do not deliver the standard rated current of 10mA. That Octavia requires 8mA and that is high by today's standards, most cap mics only need 1/4 of that. SO! Before you buy a spook juice box, buy a digital test meter*. A 10 one from Halfords will do. Then, ASK the vendor or the 48V supply if the box can deliver the standard current (they never 'king say!) and if not pass. If they say "yes" ffs test it when delivered (I'll tell you how).

    By the very nature of an add on phantom power unit it MUST protect the downstream device, mic pre, from 48V and therefore will protect itself from any residual voltage.

    But, I agree with Mark. A budget dynamic could be a better bet but, the "mechanic" might not be a good, low noise pre amp? The UR22 by all accounts is. Can you not borrow the band's dymo for a try out?

    Other dynamics to consider:
    Prodipe TT-1 about 30 and there is a Shure for about 20. My son in France uses one and it is comparable to an SM58. Not going to be AS good or as rugged of course for 80 quid or so less!

    *I strongly and constantly urge musos to buy such a meter (and pay a bit more if you can). How TF people test pedal batts and check cables without one baffles me?

    Dave.

  6. The Following User Says Thank You to ecc83 For This Useful Post:


  7. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    essex
    Posts
    2,855
    Thanks
    13
    Thanked 410 Times in 375 Posts
    Rep Power
    4008612
    We use multiple mixers for stage/recording work and use passive splits.its very common for both mixers to accidentally have their phantom power switches pressed. Nothing happens apart the pop on live mics. Electronically something does happen because the two voltages will have a small difference in level, increasing current flow in one or the other, but as the supply voltage is already 'floating' the change in drive seems to do nothing at all? If you draw out the circuit you are changing the resistance that creates the phantom voltage, which does put a small damping on the audio, but I have never noticed any audible impact.

    One warning. I have had one Chinese phantom unit that doesn't have the capacitor DC blocking and the 48v went back to the mixer, which did nothing apart from make all the channel peak LEDs turn on!!

  8. The Following User Says Thank You to rob aylestone For This Useful Post:


  9. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    northampton uk home of Dr Who and Blackstar Amps!
    Posts
    10,010
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 671 Times in 635 Posts
    Rep Power
    9374895
    I could be doing the TC pre amp a disservice?

    TC do make some excellent kit and the very well written specification attached suggest the unit does in fact have a very low noise pre amp.

    Note however that the max input is necessarily lower than that on most AIs and mixers as a result of the low, 9V supply. This means that the Octavia might not in fact be a good choice anyway because it has a very high output of -20dB/Pa.

    Deffo give a dymo a do before you spend out on a spook supply!

    Dave.
    Attached Files Attached Files

  10. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    northampton uk home of Dr Who and Blackstar Amps!
    Posts
    10,010
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 671 Times in 635 Posts
    Rep Power
    9374895
    Quote Originally Posted by rob aylestone View Post
    We use multiple mixers for stage/recording work and use passive splits.its very common for both mixers to accidentally have their phantom power switches pressed. Nothing happens apart the pop on live mics. Electronically something does happen because the two voltages will have a small difference in level, increasing current flow in one or the other, but as the supply voltage is already 'floating' the change in drive seems to do nothing at all? If you draw out the circuit you are changing the resistance that creates the phantom voltage, which does put a small damping on the audio, but I have never noticed any audible impact.

    One warning. I have had one Chinese phantom unit that doesn't have the capacitor DC blocking and the 48v went back to the mixer, which did nothing apart from make all the channel peak LEDs turn on!!
    Yes Rob, people do get exercised about phantom power and in most cases there is no problem.
    THE biggest "danger" as you mention, is plops, can be bangs(!) through monitors and PA though once ears have recovered there is rarely any lasting damage. Valuable vintage ribbons and dynamic mics for that matter should be protected but even that is more an apocryphal story than hard fact?

    So, rare but damage can happen. The input to a mic pre (or any other) should be protected by capacitors and diodes. However the protection is only up to the voltage of the internal supply rails, a max of +&-18V and generally lower than that in budget gear. The capacitors are also unlikely to be rated at no more than 22V and so phantom power could bias the input devices into "lockup" Again, permanent damage is unlikely but can happen.

    Once again I shall be a boring old sod and say "you can only know/test for these thing with a FEKKIN' meter!"

    Dave.

  11. #9
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Posts
    19
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Rep Power
    0
    Hi guys.

    Thanks for the advice. Very helpful

    Rob: Yeah will prob steer clear of the chinese ones then

    Dave & Mark: The thing I didnt mention (just to keep things simple) was I have the ur22 also running onto a DAW to make demos so I like having the Octava as it's sounds way better than a dynamic for recording as I have a big deep voice. Saying that, I could get a cheap dynamic for practising, then switch it out for the Octava when recording.

    Dave: Yeah looking at first review here: Behringer PS400 – Thomann UK, at.7ma the Behringer PS400 will only generate 22v (less than the mic mechanic), so that's not gonna work - like you said.

    Thanks

    Masten

  12. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Massachusetts
    Age
    71
    Posts
    4,531
    Thanks
    11
    Thanked 230 Times in 211 Posts
    Rep Power
    10181459
    Well you got my curiosity up, so I popped the 'hood' on the PS400 so I could make some direct voltage measurements with a few mics at the XLR. (I keep saying I'm going to build a cable jig to do this).

    The operating currents noted are from manufacturers specs. Coincidentally I have a CAD M179 which pulls 8ma like the MK-219.

    No load volts = 47.3vdc.

    MIC, Required current ma, Actual volts measured at PS400 XLR
    AT2020, 2ma, 40.2vdc
    AT3035, 3.5ma, 38.5vdc
    KSM27, 5.4ma, 28.8vdc
    CAD M179, 8ma, 4.52vdc

    Did not try to see if mic was functional or sounded like crap. The voltage drops were reasonable and expected until the CAD M179 was connected. The PS400 power supply just sinks when it sees the 8ma load.

    If the phantom power limiting resistors are the typical 6800 ohms in your UR22, the calculated voltage your MK-219 may actually get at the XLR may be about 20.8vdc based on two 6800 ohms resistors in parallel (3400 ohms) feeding the mic load (if I'm thinking this through correctly).
    Last edited by arcaxis; 06-10-2019 at 05:09. Reason: added info
    Mark.......

  13. The Following User Says Thank You to arcaxis For This Useful Post:


Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 3
    Last Post: 07-25-2013, 18:31
  2. Replies: 6
    Last Post: 01-20-2011, 08:09
  3. phantom power on non phantom power mics?
    By seismetr0n in forum Microphones
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: 10-20-2005, 08:05
  4. can i hook up phantom power mic and non phantom mic at same time and
    By videodrone in forum Roland, Boss, VS Series Forum
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 03-25-2003, 08:13
  5. Replies: 3
    Last Post: 03-21-2003, 17:46

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •