I've come to the conclusion that a studio sound is only found in ... a studio

tikitariki

New member
Edit: I uploaded some short samples in another post along with my definition of "studio", it'd probably help a lot to read that post too.

Hey, wow, I wish I knew this place existed two years ago. I'm a high school graduate who is into just about DIY everything, so after writing lots of music, it was only natural that I would want to lay down my own tracks and have them played back to me. My goal and dream was to basically make songs I wish existed; songs perfectly tailored to my own taste and also to bring my own taste to others ears.

I'm a very cheap person. I think I've invested less than $500 in music in my entire life. I still use my first guitar, which I think is very tight in sound, but it could use better pick-ups. There's seldom times where I actually go: Wow, this is garbage. Especially after all the tweaks my guitar buddy taught me. I have a $100 comboamp, $100 Toneport, $50 mic, etc.

Recently, I've been slowly getting more frustrated with recording, even though I'm getting better and better. I wanted a very heavy distorted sound, yet the clarity was just not coming through and the notes weren't distinguishable enough. My first recording was awful, buzzing bass, staticy guitars, now my recordings sound very tight, with many hours spent EQing and working on tone. But it never sounded "alive."

I was thinking of upgrading my guitar, but I read something on this forum, that kind of changed my approach on the whole home recording thing: A home recording is just that. A home recording. I was told I could get studio quality recording with a Toneport, yes, maybe a $100 studio recording (Great clean settings and such though). I think I may have set my expectations too high.

I must admit that my friend and his Macbook + GarageBand + Guitar and me and my Toneport have really exceeded what is to be expected, but I decided to not spend any more money on recording and just drop it till I'm done with school and have a good paying job. I could be spending that money else where, rather than a dream that may require a collective amount of money. Besides, I plan to major in computer/electric engineering, might come on handy in some aspects.

Maybe if I wasn't into such heavily distorted music, quality would not be such an issue, but anyways, do you guys think I made the right move calling it quits for now? I don't mind putting this dream on pause. I'm just getting very tired of bringing the best out of what would be sub-par. Is home recording with a USB device just a dream in today's time?

Thanks to anyone who takes the time out to read this.
 
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Maybe or maybe not you've made the right decision, but at least you have the wisdom to recognise that the decision needed to be made.

You are mainly right . . . a studio sound is found in a studio. If you are operating on a budget and doing things as cheaply as possible, it becomes a major undertaking to get a 'studio' sound. That's not to say it can't be done . . .but everything is working against it. A good carpenter can make decent stuff with crappy tools, but a good carpenter can make great stuff with a decent set of tools . . . but they cost money . . . so you need to be quite sure that that's the treadmill you want to start spinning.
 
Motown was a 3 track home studio. Paul McCartney's "Maybe I'm Amazed" was recorded on 4 tracks by himself at home in a barn. Lots of Neil Young's stuff was recorded in a barn at his home. Define studio.

Hendrix sounded pretty good at Woodstock - that wasn't a studio it was a farmer's field.

I could use the Musician's Union's recording studio tomorrow - all new with 30' ceilings. It costs $150 a year, so that's 50 cents a day to use their studio that cost at least 500K and is less than a year old.

You need passion, accurate knowledge and persistence. With that you can get a studio if you need it. It's all about what you know and who you know. You can get anything for free if you know how to ask for it.
 
You are correct that you can only get studio sound in a studio. But you can get sound that is damn pleasing at home. Post your songs. Maybe we can help diagnose your tone problem.
 
I could use the Musician's Union's recording studio tomorrow - all new with 30' ceilings. It costs $150 a year, so that's 50 cents a day to use their studio that cost at least 500K and is less than a year old.

Now I've got drool all over my keyboard! Where do you live to be blessed with such a structure?
 
Maybe if I wasn't into such heavily distorted music, quality would not be such an issue.


Ther's something about that statement that just doesn't work for me.
:D


Just one comment (which may be too little too late)...I find that people who are into heavily distorted guitars, often OVERDO it when recording, and they end up with buzz and mush.
You may be trying too hard.

It's not "home recording" that is the issue...it may be your techniques, and yeah, you do need have SOME decent gear, but you certianly don't need to spend hundred$ of thou$and$. ;)
 
I find that people who are into heavily distorted guitars, often OVERDO it when recording, and they end up with buzz and mush.;)

That is SOOOOO true!!! You get a live sound you like on an amp with the pre-gain set at maybe 7, sure that may work for some solo work but when playing back what you recorded, it's nothing but a fuzz box. Especially when playing power chords. Turn it down to 4 or so, eq the mid's up a bit, and suddenly you've got it.
 
That statement about distorted music is literally laughable. You think you have quality problems with your noise? Try recording Yo Yo Ma's cello or Whitney Houston's voice or George Winston's piano clean and with what you refer to as "studio quality". You'll be lying an a fetal position in a pool of your own urine just praying that Mr. Wizard will transport you back to the easy days of having to record a wall of headbanger distortion.

That aside, I have two general problems with the premise of the OP. First, which has been alluded to already, what defines "studio"? Someone please describe the dividing line between studio and non-studio to me.

Second is the implication that the "studio" is what's missing. With all respect to the OP, we could transport you right behind the desk at Mussel Shoals or the Record Plant or Abbey Road or any of the other top studios of the last half century and your recordings might be marginally better than what you have now, but they'd still be far from "studio quality". OTOH, if we transported Alan Parsons to your house, he'd most likely be able to get a fairly-close-to-pro result with your tools.

While I admire and support your DIY attitude 100%, this is not a field where you can just wake up in the morning and decide to do it yourself. It takes a lot of time in the way of experience learning your technique and learning what tools you do have to become good at it. That's not what the clowns at Guitar Center have told you, of course; because if they old you the truth about that, they'd lose 60% of their sales.

Unless one is a one-in-a-billion savant, one does not just wake up one morning, pick up a guitar for the very first time and play it like a "pro" at the end of the day, or pick up a pencil and piece of paper in the morning and start drawing blueprints for a skyscraper that will actually work, like a real architect. Audio engineering is the same way; the idea is easy to visualize, like playing a guitar or designing a building, but it's not something you can just "do" without a lot of time and learning and practice.

Don't waste your prime years chasing a recording dream. The absolute smartest thing you can do right now is to go college, concentrate on your studies and build yourself a day career. At the very least, you can use that as a parachute when your dreams of rock stardom crash and burn, or to supplement the budget for your audio recording hobby so you *can* afford the good toys.

Trust us old-timers, we ABSOLUTELY know what we're talking about when we say stuff like "If I only knew when I was 18 what I know now..." We may just sound like a bunch of over-the-hill-losers when we say that, but unless you want to sound like an over-the-hill-loser yourself when you get older, you'll listen to us. ;)

G.
 
That being said...along with the man behind the glass...its the Mic and pre+ the room that can get you there.

The advise above about distorted guitar is gold...when you do record it...you want to try for the sound you want...then cut back about 10%.
 
Now I've got drool all over my keyboard! Where do you live to be blessed with such a structure?

That's the Musician's Union in Honolulu. It's a brand new facility and no one is using it. They made it for the symphony.

My view of this is that you don't need a standard studio... lots of bands have put out fantastic live albums. There's all kinds of opportunities and to think you need what most people think of as a recording studio is untrue.

Lots and lots of the best recordings of all time have been done on home studios or not in studios at all.

You don't need a studio. You need a place, and that can be lots of different free things. Saying you need a studio is some sort of not knowing better statement, a form of blaming your tools.
 
We may just sound like a bunch of over-the-hill-losers when we say that, but unless you want to sound like an over-the-hill-loser yourself when you get older, you'll listen to us. ;)

There was a hill....? :confused:
We musta cleared it while I was taking my afternoon nap. :D
 
Trust us old-timers, we ABSOLUTELY know what we're talking about when we say stuff like "If I only knew when I was 18 what I know now..." We may just sound like a bunch of over-the-hill-losers when we say that, but unless you want to sound like an over-the-hill-loser yourself when you get older, you'll listen to us. ;)
Well old timer, I'm older than you but I'm still not as much of a pompous ass. After your wonderful reply I'm sure the kid knows everything he needs to know about making a decent recording now. :rolleyes:
 
Wow, you are all very support, like I said, wish I would've came here much earlier on my trip through bringing my own visions to life.

Please, lets not fight. Time is so irrelevant considering the internet is a growing easily accessible resource. Kids can make car bombs at eleven if they wanted to. Even though I'm only eighteen and have been doing this since I'm sixteen, me going onto YouTube, I find thirteen-year-old kids doing what I dreamed of doing. Recording is just a hobby of mine, I do not expect to make money, so I'm definitely going to go through college. I have way too many friends who have this dream and I do not see living with my parents or working minimum wage to somehow fund gear for such a dream (IMO, maybe they should major in music production or sound engineering...).

One important thing I should've done was define studio. By that, I meant proper equipment and set up. What I was trying to say in my first post was that I may have been trying to get by with far too little for the quality I'm looking for.

Anyways, I've included two brief samples of my music to show you what I'm producing.

http://senduit.com/01e83b
That track is kind-of rock/shoegaze-y. I took away some synths I had over it (drums and synth was provided by FL Studio, which I forgot to include in my gear) The bass is done by simply just messing with the EQ of my electric guitar and also setting it to a bass sounding tone. The layered guitar sounds just fine with my equipment, especially since the general sound of shoegaze has a lo-fi feel, even though its probably not recorded with that intention. I would probably consider this my best song and recording, but I have to work on my singing first, hehe.

http://senduit.com/022d8e
This sample is from a screamo (technically speaking, it is sub-genre of hardcore punk, not exactly what the whole "hair over one eye" kid kind of music) song I made. Here is where you can see where I kind of run into trouble. This is me probably maxing out the quality of my gear. You can do some miracles with EQing, but you cannot improve the source sound more than what it really is. I used to blame my guitar, but seeing how elaborate some studios are, I feel I may have been hoping for too much with what I have.

For the other song I was working on, its a sludge metal song, which is slow, heavy, and a bit southern. Something like the band Neurosis. But when I record, the clarity just doesn't come through. I've tried turning the distortion down and then it just doesn't sound the same.

When I look at people's studios, I see a lot of boards and things I've never seen before, so it makes me wonder if I'm missing a large step in recording, even with a crap guitar, I figure I should be able to get a more accurate signal.

Sometimes, I want to just give it all another shot, but I don't want to be disappointed. I'm really poor, so all the shortcuts I take really don't help me improve my source's sound. So I'm not saying that home studios can't produce great records, I'm simply saying, with what I have, I may be a bit over my head in terms of standards.
 
First...don't think anyone here is really fighting...it's just normal forum tennis. ;)

Reading your second post, I'm reminded of where I was many years ago when I started recording somewhat seriously...and I was only a few years older than you. I guess every decade or so a few years get shaved off and people start doing things sooner. :)
Anyway...I felt kinda' the same as you when I started out. I could record stuff, but it didn't sound very pro and I certainly didn't have any $$$ resources to dive into more pro recording, especially back in the '70s when *pro* gear cost a LOT of $$$$$!!!

Point is...you may be expecting too much, too soon. I think guys your age are a bit naive about the effort, knowledge AND the $$$ that is needed to get to a more pro quality level in your recordings.
It's a little less expensive these days to get started than back in my youth...computers have lowered the cost of entry...BUT it still requires knowledge/experience. I think you young guys often assume that the computer technology is going to cover a lot of that for you....that the equipment will somehow make it easier. Nope...it still takes time and effort.

Maybe you don't want to invest that time, effort and money...and that's fine..it's not for everyone. But keep in mind that ANY hobby or career requires those things. If you want to take up golf (as a hobby or pro sport)...there is a learning curve and a certain cost is required before you can get good at it (at either hobby or pro level).

So...don't give up too soon and/or jump to conclusions that because YOU couldn't hit the mark you were after...then it's not worth the effort and/or that it's beyond most home recording enthusiasts. :rolleyes:
Judging from your descriptions of how/what you did...no hard feelings...but it sounds like you basically spent some time just “dabbling” at it...trying out some different things, and then coming to the conclusion only a real pro studio could achieve what you wanted.
You're jumping to conclusions based only on your limited experiences.

But I do understand that it can be overwhelming...both the effort, the knowledge required AND the $$$ needed.
 
Hey, tiki, no flame wars or fights here. :)

Just to make sure that mo one else misunderstood where I was coming from, I'd say keep the hobby up, but don't let it get in the way of your studies, as you have already indicated you have no intention of doing. Two things can, and probably will happen over time.

First, you will hone your engineering skills. There is much positive to be said about learning to have to force oneself to be good in spite of perhaps lesser gear or budgets

Second, and IMHO even more important, is you'll hone your *musical* skills. After all the music is what it's all about. Recording yourself as a hobby and as a way of listening to yourself from as much of a third-party perspective as humanly possible is a great way of both entertaining yourself and finding ways to push the envelope.

Don't worry about those younger than your or your age that got stuff on meTube or meSpace. Not only is this not a race - there's plenty of time - but so they have something up on meNet? So what? Sure it's a great way to help get laid, but there are many other more sure-fire ways of going that (does you college allow dogs? ;) :D) But beyond that, so some 14-year-old has sone suff up on MeNet, along with a hundred million others. Then what? They get discovered and sign to a multi-million dollar contract with Sony? They might as well just buy a Powerball lottery ticket; the odds are about the same, it's a lot cheaper and less work, and requires a lot less skill.

All I'm saying is to have patience, keep working at it, because work is what it requires, but not to let it get in the way of your college, an idea which it sounds like you already have nailed.

You sound like a pretty damn smart guy, ahead of your years in some ways. Keep it up and the best of luck to you in all of your studies, formal and musical.

Signed,

Doc Pompous

:D

G.
 
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