Trouble shooting help- getting a quiet output
- Thread starter vanchamberlain
- Start date
I feel like all the clues are presented in the video I first mentioned. This was released by Focusrite themselves. They wouldn't stage a demonstration with a faulty unit. I agree with Talisman- underengineered mic pres for sure. I would go as far as to say this video is deceptive. It seems like they know the mic pre is underpowered and are trying to divert attention....
I really cannot see what Focusrite would have to gain by such a move? It is trivially simple for a company like that to make a very good pre amp with adequate gain and low noise and the cost saving in making a 'bad one' is virtually non-existant.
An example of how good and cheap mic pres can be is given by the Behringer UMC range. I had the 204HD and the pre amps were excellent.
Dave.
Yes, it doesn't make sense at all- hard to believe. Proof's in the puddin' though.
TalismanRich
Well-known member
I did a quick Google search of "Clarett weak preamps" and came up with quite a few hits of people talking about having to run at 80 to 90% with a variety of microphones, including tube mics and condensers. Most say that the signal is still clean at that point, but if you need to crank it that far with a mic putting out 15mv or 20mv/Ps, what do you do with a dynamic like an SM57 or SM7. It almost guarantees you need a Cloudlifter.
One fellow did say that he found that sometimes the Focusrite Control program seemed to glitch and give low levels. He had to reset it to factory setup, then things improved. I don't have a Focusrite, but I guess it could be an issue in the control software someplace.
One fellow did say that he found that sometimes the Focusrite Control program seemed to glitch and give low levels. He had to reset it to factory setup, then things improved. I don't have a Focusrite, but I guess it could be an issue in the control software someplace.
AhA! yes, there is a gain switch in the Mix Control panel. I have it even in my old Mk1 8i6.
Dave.
Here's a bit of work...
The 8i6 has more gain than the KA6 but might be a tad noisier? In any case I was speaking at about 200mm off mics and you would reduce that distance by a third to a quarter for a dynamic as a rule.
Note that a lot of the noise is PC fan rumble at 100Hz'ish and a HPF at 150Hz gives a considerably better noise floor. The extended LF response of the P150 does it no favours here.
The Video. In truth the guy was at such a low level and so 'dark' that I could not make out much of what he said but there were several anomalies? First, how was he recording hisself? Not through the Focusrite because his voice did not change level. The there were very health 'waveforms' in the tracks at times, was he still complaining about low levels? Also the ring LEDs on the AI were fully lit. Still not getting a good level into the DAW. Which was bloody useless BTW! Tiny meters with no dB markings.
That Shure mic might be a capacitor but it has a very low sensitivity for the breed at 4mV/Pa about 8dB hotter than a 57.
Any operational problems with my recordings please give me the unvarnished and I shall strive to do better.
Dave.
The 8i6 has more gain than the KA6 but might be a tad noisier? In any case I was speaking at about 200mm off mics and you would reduce that distance by a third to a quarter for a dynamic as a rule.
Note that a lot of the noise is PC fan rumble at 100Hz'ish and a HPF at 150Hz gives a considerably better noise floor. The extended LF response of the P150 does it no favours here.
The Video. In truth the guy was at such a low level and so 'dark' that I could not make out much of what he said but there were several anomalies? First, how was he recording hisself? Not through the Focusrite because his voice did not change level. The there were very health 'waveforms' in the tracks at times, was he still complaining about low levels? Also the ring LEDs on the AI were fully lit. Still not getting a good level into the DAW. Which was bloody useless BTW! Tiny meters with no dB markings.
That Shure mic might be a capacitor but it has a very low sensitivity for the breed at 4mV/Pa about 8dB hotter than a 57.
Any operational problems with my recordings please give me the unvarnished and I shall strive to do better.
Dave.
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the audio you hear is coming from the camera source, but he's recording through the focusrite into the DAW. I don't think there's anything wrong with the clarett except that the mic pres are too quiet for acoustic guitar. My vocals were weak as well, but usable. I can tell you that I could not get a level above -18 dB (at2020, mxl2003, shure sm81)
DOH! Yes! Video sound of course. I have sympathy with AIs mnfctrs. They could employ pre amp gains in excess of 70dB (however you specify that!) but with a single gain pot that leaves an unacceptable amount of gain at minimum setting and many capacitor mics will overload it. Of course, more gain and a pad button is a solution but..money.
Focusrite have shown themselves to be a responsive company in the past. Their first batch of 2i2s had very poor instrument input headroom but they fixed that to a degree very quickly.
The only proper solution to mic pre gain issues is either a two step gain control a in many mixers or digital gain control. THE problem is that the noob who knows nothing of electronics and gain staging(and cares less about learning) can STILL cock it up, go on the net and proclaim "this pre amp is S**T!
Dave.
yea, I understand the value of not having a high-gain preamp; however, I spent years using an apogee duet (75dB gain) with absolutely no problems with high SPL sources or "hot" capacitor mics. I just think that when you are marketing to people who aren't professionals (noobs who know nothing of electronics) and you advertise a super low noise floor, it's misleading when you have to raise the noise floor so much just to normalize. I just think that, for someone who wants to enter the recording game, this is not the audio interface for them. (unless they want to buy additional outboard preamps). I mean, I've been home recording for over 20 years and it took my 2 minutes to realize the Clarett is not a one-size-fits-all unit. Absurdly low gain- no two ways about it. Super high noise floor once a hpf and normalization are applied.
It think it a little unfair to lob names like "Apogee" into the discussion?
As well as high gain and low noise the 'perfect' pre amp will have high overload levels.
The first two parameters are fairly easy and cheap to provide but high headroom needs higher supply rails and that pushes the cost of everything up.
Dave.
As well as high gain and low noise the 'perfect' pre amp will have high overload levels.
The first two parameters are fairly easy and cheap to provide but high headroom needs higher supply rails and that pushes the cost of everything up.
Dave.