Studio monitors really boomy bassy?

I've had a listen to the track. First thing that disturbed me was that there is about 4 minutes of tune, then 4 minutes of nothing.

The bass is not overly dominant, and nor is it offensive. It kinds of sits there ok without making a huge impression on the overall mix.

The guitars on the left and right I find to be overwhelming . . . they swamp everything when they come in, and don't seem to be well integrated into the mix. The centre field of the mix kind of sits alone in the background. There is also the occasional bit of timing tension, where things are quite sitting in time nicely together.
 
thanks for the feedback, its my first recording on the daw setup.

Yeah im having a hard time balancing I guess, I hear it on my studio speakers and end up turning my panned guitars up due to the bass being overly loud on them....

yet when I play it on my cars sound system the bass losses its boomyness and the bass sounds nice and punchy.. and the offending guitars then sound too loud.

its the monitors that are throwing me off I guess as I feel the need to turn the two panned guitars up to make them clear in the mix.

lol yeah no idea how it does that... when I render the track it adds 4 minutes.
 
yeah I have no idea why it does that... some notes seem to be louder than others... especially in the chorus when I move to the third fret those notes spike the overall output.

Can you recommend good headphones for mixing with without breaking the bank ? that give a real sound as I have always preferred mixing with them in the past ?
 
Caution! Deaf, old meds taking valve amp jockey with zero studio experience about to opine!

Well, I AM clinically deaf but I am pretty normal for bass below 200Hz or so and no, that track does not seem boomy.
I also did not like the extreme panning of the guitars. But...

Surely the only way to judge the OP's bass issue would be a co-i pair at his sitting position?

Dave.
 
thanks for the feedback, its my first recording on the daw setup.

Yeah im having a hard time balancing I guess, I hear it on my studio speakers and end up turning my panned guitars up due to the bass being overly loud on them....

yet when I play it on my cars sound system the bass losses its boomyness and the bass sounds nice and punchy.. and the offending guitars then sound too loud.

its the monitors that are throwing me off I guess as I feel the need to turn the two panned guitars up to make them clear in the mix.

lol yeah no idea how it does that... when I render the track it adds 4 minutes.

I think you have made a good start. All the right elements are there, but they just need to be tamed a bit. I think your speakers are not helping you, as exemplified by the difference between them and, say, your car.

If you can't afford studio monitors, you may be better off mixing with headphones, even though they have their own issues. There are plenty of expensive options around, but if you are looking for cheap and reasonable, you might like to look at the Behringer HPX2000 (but definitely not the HPX1000 or 3000). The HPX2000 have a good bass response and a clean airy sound overall, and are surprisingly good for being so cheap.

What DAW are you using? I use Reaper, and its default for rendering is "entire project". This is usually ok, but sometimes you can plonk an item of something out of the way to the right and forget its there, then Reaper thinks it's part of the project when it comes to render. So as a rule I always select what I want to render and use that option instead fo the default.
 
yeah I have studio speakers but the ones I have from an earlier reply from yourself "The Selwins' specifications give a frequency Range of 70Hz-20KHz, which means their bass response will be a bit limite"d.... I will definitely look at those even as just something to bounce back and forth with the speakers when the speakers are cheating my ears.

Yes Reaper also... got it for the good cpu and ease of use, I must have had something I moved by accident to the end of the track possibly a fill lol
 
I just saw those headphones going for 10 pound :O I was planning on spending around 50 pounds should I stick with them or is there something even better around my price range ?
 
after some back and forth testing with my car system I've came to the conclusion its either the speakers or my room setup.

When I listen to songs that sound good in the car/ other outputs.... and the guitar parts come through cleanly when listened to on the monitors at home.. the bass sound hides the guitars to my ears.. if I leave the room and listen in from another room the bass issue isn't as bad.

on the flipside songs that lack bass in the car/other outputs like marque moon sound much better on the house monitors...

I've checked to see if windows 10 has an eq setting that I may have set to something other than flat but cant find it.. and same with my scarlett solo interface both have no eq settings so I imagine the output is flat.

The only other thing I can think of is I have my speakers both turned up full reason being is the volume markings are slightly off from each other on the speakers so didn't trust both were outputting at the same level... so just turned both up to max to leave out any chance of one speaker playing slightly louder... and control overall sound from the pc now.

now sure if any of this would make much difference.
 
Ahh,,, Ok, it's all about the room for you. The mix sounds balance tonally and levels. Not BooMy for me, as others also stated.

What are the room dimensions ? Length Width Hieght.
WHat is your listening position ? Where you sit matters for Nearfield Monitoring, measure distance from Front wall, Back wall, Wall to right, wall to left.

Do you have any room treatment ?

Put your favorite track that you are familiar with, into the DAW. Hit play listen as 75 SPL, 80 SPL, and 90 SPL...
If you find huge tonal changes, then those speakers, in that room, need to stay at the lower SPL. WHen pushed, the Room Modes kick in and destroy the balance. Room Treatment may fix it. Depending on things, a little treatment might get you 60% to 80% better mix experience and translation out of the room.
 
After following this thread for a while it seems to me that the low range of your monitors is what's giving you the problem. As well.......your listening position is CRITICAL with monitors. Sitting back in an untreated small room is likely just going to add to the perceived bass that you hear. When your monitors only reproduce 70 Hz for a low end........it IS likely that the room....unless its treated......will add to the bass you hear. If your monitors could go down to 50hz or at least 60Hz or lower......it would probably seem like the bass on your track is way too much in your room listening position........not too little. If you can't sit in a good spot.....which is in the center between your monitors equally as far from each one as they are from each other......then you're gonna have unwanted issues. So.....try to correct that. As for headphones......while I don't advise that you rely 100% on a headphone mix......they may not lie to you as much as your monitors seem to be. Don't cheap out on headphones though. Not to say that you have to break the bank.......but good headphones become more valuable over time as you learn to improve your mixes.
 
after some back and forth testing with my car system I've came to the conclusion its either the speakers or my room setup.

It is both, to a point. Speakers do not replicate the low end. Depending on the room shape, size, and treatment, the translation out of that room can be better.

When I listen to songs that sound good in the car/ other outputs.... and the guitar parts come through cleanly when listened to on the monitors at home.. the bass sound hides the guitars to my ears.. if I leave the room and listen in from another room the bass issue isn't as bad.

on the flipside songs that lack bass in the car/other outputs like marque moon sound much better on the house monitors...

Same reason really,,, Different environments, and speakers, is what you hear., so to me yes you are correct, and your hearing is ok lol..

I've checked to see if windows 10 has an eq setting that I may have set to something other than flat but cant find it.. and same with my scarlett solo interface both have no eq settings so I imagine the output is flat.

Your using an interface. Adjusting Windows Settings will not really be needed. Focusrite has it's driver you installed and are using. Don't change this. And yes, the interface is considered to have flat EQ.

The only other thing I can think of is I have my speakers both turned up full reason being is the volume markings are slightly off from each other on the speakers so didn't trust both were outputting at the same level... so just turned both up to max to leave out any chance of one speaker playing slightly louder... and control overall sound from the pc now.
You need to use an SPL meter to set the levels of each speaker. Go for 75db SPL. If you do not have an SPL meter, you can find some free ones from your phone app store, Free ones are ok. I use an old RadioShack for about 15 yrs lol, About $39 back then.


--------------------------------------------------------

Hi, I see a couple things,,, You have any info on setting up a mix room ? If not, A ton of info can be shared with you, lol,,,
For now, don't spend a dime until you learn more about this Room Mode thing. Because you ears are ok, your able to get a mix out of the room, you just need to learn. :D

Room size measurements I asked for will help, a lot... There are many things you can do that take little to no money. But everyone here has gone through this understanding...

Talk to ya soon !

--------------------------------------------------------
 
I have never heard of spl what is this and how does it affect overall finish to a song ?

sidenote i think I have helped the issue a little.... I never considered it until yesterday but both of my monitors were sitting high up on their stands... they would be around chest height while I was standing recording, but above my head when I was sitting and mixing.

I never realised that when I was recording my parts standing the track always sounded better than when I was sitting... is there a rule to speaker height ? the bass issue has improved simply by lowering the speakers to my head height.
 
As far as SPL goes, that just depends on personal taste and the genre maybe. It is obvious that when mixing at high volumes, your ears will get fatigued and poor decisions might be made.

I find that multiple mixdown sessions and listening to small nearfields (with and without sub) and the bigger monitors (as well as listening on other systems and god forbid 'headphones') is the best bet to make sure the mix is right.


And keep in mind, it will never be perfect. Even the classics have flaws. Kind of what makes it real right? :)
 
Well the SPL suggestion was to see if you might get better response out of your speakers tonally at lower SPL levels, in that room,,, Also you can level match the speakers with it, as you mentioned doing that not as thorough as using an SPL meter.

I personally mix at around 75db for the most part. Checking at higher levels. But I'm using Scepter 8's from Presonus, in a dedicated treated room.

But no need to be concerned about that. Your room is most of the issue. Well, it is how your using it, that can be improved.
- Your speakers only reproducing down to 70Hz means,,, You really need some better ranged monitors. And then learn them and the new room set up.

______ But don't spend a dime yet ____________ !!! lol

I would face the outer brick wall. About 38% sitting position from that wall, and Center of the left and right walls.
Speakers should NOT be the same distance from front and side walls...

I'm guessing the room is 12" x 26" or so, from your given measurements. Which is a good size really. Real true dimensions is what I was looking for though lol. I'll ask again if really needed, all good :D.

I had a room similar in dimensions. Spent about $900 for treatment from GIK Acoustics...
Email the one nearest you in your Country. Improved my room by 80% or better. Translation was great so I could make my mix moves with confidence. I put a current mix I was working on and sounded like crap, awesome !!! So I started a new mix, when almost done, rendered and hopped in my truck, cranked the stereo once I hit 40mph,,, Sounded killer !!! Listened critically when I got back home, didn't find I needed to change a thing. I didn't have to guess anymore. Now one thing all that guessing did was help train my ears.
Just not always the best training when learning all the things about mixing in a room giving false reference of your moves. Thank God I had a little live mixing experience from playing out for all those years.

With your situation, You are doing good man... You make a few changes setting up in that room correctly you will be real happy with your mixes.


That said,,,
a couple questions might help, knowing where you want to go.

- Do you just want to mix others music ?

- Do you just want to create your own music ?

- Do you want to be like Tom Scholz from Boston and do it all ?

I ask, because that answer should and can help you to get where you wanna go and know how to spend or not. I don't know ya, so don't want to suggest all this, when a little of this or that, would suit ya better. Hadn't seen it asked yet, or mentioned.

Also, since dialing this concern in a little, the Forum Studio Building and Room Treatment has a ton of info.
If you start a post there, please share that Discussion Posts link to this discussion here. Others may find it helpful to follow along. And I'd like to as well lol :D
 
,,, Oh,,, and actually if your speakers were reproducing below 70Hz, you would have even more concerning issues to deal with, especially in an untreated room.

I'll post ya some links of calculators and reference info and tools from a couple of guys that create desirable mix and master rooms. We can get quite a ways on our own with their kindness and sharing. They do this, because they do it for a living, and if you meet your goal, you might be their next customer needing a professional room.

I'll try and get around to posting the links this weekend, when I get time.
 
you do not have an SPL meter, you can find some free ones from your phone app store, Free ones are ok.

There is no way to verify those apps will be accurate without a calibration file for the phone's mic. Even for SPL measuring. Being most cell phone mics suck, I would put very little stock in these apps. Dayton audio makes a measurement mic specifically for cell phone measuring apps.

Dayton Audio iMM-6 Calibrated Measurement Microphone for Tablets iPhone iPad and Android

I have this mic and speaking from experience, even with this mic the mic pre in most cell phones are too easily overdriven and will not give accurate spl measurements though it can give decently accurate measurements of freq response.
 
Also, the whole 'you should mix at 75 db' thing has evolved from a misunderstanding of engineers suggesting you should measure your speakers by running pink noise through them at 75 db for room/monitor correction eq. The reasons for this are much too wordy and nerdy to get into without typing a novel and, like all things audio, this has been argued for and against 100 times over. As for volume while listening and mixing, I'd say whatever you're comfortable with. I've noticed no reduction or improvement in the quality of a mix based on what volume I was listening at while mixing so long as there's no distortion and reasonable headroom.
 
Back
Top