Simple multi-track recording setup advice?

C

cian

New member
My friends and I were planning on getting a band together to write and record some songs (a few parodies and covers is about it). I'm just wondering if there's anything we should have for our recording setup that I don't know about.

We're just a normal enough band (guitar, drums, bass, vocals, maybe but not likely keyboard) so there's nothing too out of the ordinary.

What we already have:
2 electric guitars
An acoustic-electric guitar
An electric bass
A set of acoustic drums
High-end headphones
Passable Logitech monitors
A few cables with 1/4" plugs.

Is there anything else we will need or that would be very useful (besides mic and computer)?

I'm going to be getting a new Macbook Pro soon anyway so I thought we could use Garageband to try and record. It looks easy enough to use and the range of amps and effects for guitar and bass are fantastic. We won't be needing any of the advanced features seen on other software, the most editing we'll do will be just syncing up the tracks. I'm just not sure of exactly how to record on it.

I've heard of some sort of Firewire interface to plug the guitar or mic in. Is this necessary or is there some other way to do it? And how much do they cost?

Is it possible to record more than one track at the same time? Most of the stuff will probably be separate but it might be nice to be able to do more than one at a time sometimes.

What sort of mic is good to start out with? We won't be needing CD-quality recordings or anything, this is only for fun and most will end up on Youtube at most but it should at least be listenable to and I'm not sure how much I should be looking to spend on a mic. Hopefully it won't be too expensive though because we may end up needing backing vocals too.

What's the best way to record acoustic drums on a budget? We might have access to an electronic drumkit and if so, is it possible to plug the MIDI connection straight in?
 
You need some sort of converter to get the audio into the computer (there are many)...and for each individual track that you wish to record simultaneously...you need an input on the converter.
So..8 mics to 8 individual tracks requires an 8-channel converter...etc...etc.

What you buy is based on your budget and ultimate recording goal/involvement.
 
miroslav said:
You need some sort of converter to get the audio into the computer (there are many)...and for each individual track that you wish to record simultaneously...you need an input on the converter.
So..8 mics to 8 individual tracks requires an 8-channel converter...etc...etc.

What you buy is based on your budget and ultimate recording goal/involvement.
Click to expand...

What does an audio converter look like and how much do entry level audio converters generally cost? I doubt we would need more than 2 inputs, 3 or 4 at most. The recording goal is fairly modest, this is nothing more than a hobby. Sound quality really just needs to be better than a video camera mic and it'll be fine.
 
It depends on what you want goal wise. A zoom H1 in the middle of a room might suit some people needs. Or something with more bells and whistles. Drums could easily be 8 tracks and mics if you get needy. Plus everyone else. If you wanted a track for everyone in one take. Or you could get by with one mic and run everyone one at a time. Probably to a mono take of the full group, or at least the drums. Many means to an end.

A converter is just a name for a soundcard. You computer likely has one. But it likely sucks. And might not allow for multi-tracking. Plus you'll need to amplify the mic signal to a level suitable for recording, which comes with a lot of converters meant for recording. And not just playing games / using skype. Depending on your goals and budget. It'd be a little off to recommend you something with 16 tracks and mega bucks, if your budget is $50.
 
Shadow_7 said:
It depends on what you want goal wise. A zoom H1 in the middle of a room might suit some people needs. Or something with more bells and whistles. Drums could easily be 8 tracks and mics if you get needy. Plus everyone else. If you wanted a track for everyone in one take. Or you could get by with one mic and run everyone one at a time. Probably to a mono take of the full group, or at least the drums. Many means to an end.

A converter is just a name for a soundcard. You computer likely has one. But it likely sucks. And might not allow for multi-tracking. Plus you'll need to amplify the mic signal to a level suitable for recording, which comes with a lot of converters meant for recording. And not just playing games / using skype. Depending on your goals and budget. It'd be a little off to recommend you something with 16 tracks and mega bucks, if your budget is $50.
Click to expand...

Hopefully we won't need 8 track drums:o I'm sure we could get by on a single track. I doubt we'll have many cases where we'll all record simultaneously so that's not of huge importance. When you talk about multiple tracks, do you mean they're recorded to the computer and can be edited individually?

So I would have to by a mic amplifier and plug that into the computer instead of simply plugging the mic straight in? Would that Zoom H1 mic work as a proper microphone to record with or would it be more for practicing with and playing it back?

I don't really have a budget but lets just say €300 as a ballpark figure. I would like to spend considerably less if I could get away with it but that's just to give an idea.
 
A lot of recording software will count each input as an individual mono track. Or as stereo tracks depending on your configuration and software. It's simple enough to break up into mono tracks if that's the case. The main problem with the cheap soundcard that comes with your computer is that there's a lot of noise, and probably some bleed between channels. i.e. shared content between left and right, even when they technically have no relationship. And possibly what ever you are piping out to the headphones getting picked up on the input tracks. Even if there's no headphones plugged into that port. Just a barrel of headaches that could/should otherwise be avoided.

For that money I'd look at a two channel interface of some type. USB, Firewire. Maybe PCI, depending on whatever you already have that's not going to take a chunk out of that budget. Keep in mind cables and adapters and stands. Getting started is not a cheap endeavor. Which is where some of the Zoom like devices shine, because it's pretty much everything (except a mic stand and boom arm). But check the specs as some of them are NOT multi-track capable and/or do not function as interfaces (beyond storage devices) when connected to a computer. Marantz, Tascam, Edirol, Nagra, Korg, .... tons of options out there.
 
what about a stand alone like a tascam dp01 find one used for cheap and work with it. you can also transfer tracks into garage band and edit that way but the stand alones are good cause you can take them places and do portable recording
 
Shadow_7 said:
For that money I'd look at a two channel interface of some type. USB, Firewire. Maybe PCI, depending on whatever you already have that's not going to take a chunk out of that budget. Keep in mind cables and adapters and stands. Getting started is not a cheap endeavor. Which is where some of the Zoom like devices shine, because it's pretty much everything (except a mic stand and boom arm). But check the specs as some of them are NOT multi-track capable and/or do not function as interfaces (beyond storage devices) when connected to a computer. Marantz, Tascam, Edirol, Nagra, Korg, .... tons of options out there.
Click to expand...

Yeah I was hoping to go with a Firewire or USB solution (I assume PCI cards are for desktop computers). Thanks for the advice:)

one guy said:
what about a stand alone like a tascam dp01 find one used for cheap and work with it. you can also transfer tracks into garage band and edit that way but the stand alones are good cause you can take them places and do portable recording
Click to expand...

I looked it up but it's discontinued:( Thanks for the idea of buying secondhand though, looks like they're much cheaper that way. I'll post some ads I've found below, I have a few questions on them.

arcadeko said:
This is what I would recommend - 8 individual simultaneous discreet tracks

Alesis MultiMix 8 USB 2.0 Mixer with USB Audio
Item condition: New
Time left: 2d 09h (Apr 08, 201108:03:16 PDT)
Price: GBP 239.00

Alesis MultiMix 8 USB 2.0 Mixer with USB Audio - eBay (item 260749754299 end time Apr-08-11 08:03:16 PDT)
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It looks nice but it's very expensive. It would basically be my whole budget gone.

As I mentioned above I searched audio interfaces on an ad site and found some stuff that's very reasonably priced. I'm just not sure if it's the right thing:o

Infrasonic Deux Firewire Audio Interface (DJ's) - €70

M-audio FireWire solo - €100

Lexicon Omega audio interface - €100

Line 6 Pod Studio UX2 - €160

They all look fine really but is there any way I can know if they will work in Garageband properly? (i.e. that I can still use the Garageband effects and record two channels simultaneously but edit them seperately).

Also, I notice that some of them have ports that read "guitar" but also seperate "line in" ports. Will anything labeled "line in" pretty much work fine for recording?
 
Ive never used any of those but the Lexicon Omega looks like the best deal with the most inputs. I would look for someone with real experience with it.

They "should" all work with garage band or any DAW.

I think the line in / guitar probably define which have preamps or phantom power - i can't remember which is which but one is an input with no preamp at all (line level i believe) and then the other can handle a little pre-amp - I'ts the amount of default gain or something - but really its been a while and I don't remember exactly - the manual will tell you or someone here probably knows it in there sleep :)

And im pretty sure you want to check the settings cause if you plug something hot into the wrong input you can fry your channel - if its expecting a totally dry low level signal and you run some hot amp output in there - overload your circuits.

That multi-mix might be your whole budget but the ability to mix your tracks AFTER you record them is worth it. After you get that perfect take and realize the guitar was a little too loud your stuck with it - reset levels and record again...
 
Sweet post count Shadow! Don't reply or you will lose it! :)

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I think the post count stays with the post. 1337 is cool, but 7175 might be cooler. Depending on your font.
 
Just to make clear, Lexicon Omega has six inputs but is USB 1 so it will only record two tracks simultaneously in DAW. :(
 
arcadeko said:
I think the line in / guitar probably define which have preamps or phantom power - i can't remember which is which but one is an input with no preamp at all (line level i believe) and then the other can handle a little pre-amp - I'ts the amount of default gain or something - but really its been a while and I don't remember exactly - the manual will tell you or someone here probably knows it in there sleep :)
Click to expand...

Sorry but you lost me there:o What is phantom power and what do preamps do? Will they all work fine and it's just a case that some are better quality than others or will some not work at all?

jimmys69 said:
Just to make clear, Lexicon Omega has six inputs but is USB 1 so it will only record two tracks simultaneously in DAW. :(
Click to expand...

Ah, thanks for the warning. I wouldn't have noticed that. I mightn't go with any of the audio interfaces I put above anyway, I was really just using them as examples.
 
A lot of USB devices are USB 1.x, which implies limits. Generally 2 channels in with 2 simultaneous outs. And 16/48 or 16/44.1 sampling rates.

-----

1337 in hacker / calculator speak is LEET. For those of us who never squashed our inner child like everyone else in the world wanted us to. Since fonts can make 0 and O look exactly the same. Or i, I, l, L, |. Or 5, S. Or 2, Z. Or t, +, T, 7, ...... Depending on your font.

So the count does up. Except when you make the next post (quick reply). Only when you return to the thread later.
 
cian said:
Sorry but you lost me there:o What is phantom power and what do preamps do? Will they all work fine and it's just a case that some are better quality than others or will some not work at all?
Click to expand...

Phantom power is a mixer/interface supplied voltage that runs up the mic cable to power some microphones that are made to use phantom power - kind of like an active pickup or mini preamp right in the mic.

Preamps are little amplifiers in the mixer that raise the signal level before they into the mixing channel.

A track in a mixer could very well use both, I have never seen Phantom Power without a preamp also but i have also never seen a badger.

If you are going to be doing vocal recordings and want great sound, get an interface that has phantom power and preamps. Most do - and you can always buy a stand alone preamp unit if your mixer doesnt have them or you dont like its sound - gets pricey though - but of course this is recording gear so "gets pricey" kinda goes without saying. Not that there are not inexpensive alternatives for everything :D
 
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