Home studio dumb question

H

honey badger

New member
Hi all I'm new so please excuse and questions that may seem a bit stupid. I want to set up a home studio to record songs. Nothing fancy it'll be me on a guitar or two, plus bass, plus some percussion etc and vocals. I don't want to use a computer I want to do it all dawless.
At present I have a Zoom HD 8 which I don't really like because the playback sounds like its coming from a cardboard box next door, and an old fostex fd 8 which doesn't work. I want to get a new mixer, ideally with its own hard drive or failing that one without, plus an external hard drive. What do i need guys please? I've got mic's, monitors etc I just need to record onto something and be able to tweak the sound. Thanks in advance everyone
 
The zoom HD8 should sound pretty good - so this points to what's going in, and where it goes afterwards - so that's mics and speakers.

I find it hard to imagine doing recordings now on a linear system where you have to go back to old processes to do things. Computers make recording so versatile now, I'd not go back. However, lots of people do hate computers - I get that.

First task then is to find out if your HD8 is faulty, because sonically it's not horrible at all. Mixers with recording facilities are getting rarer and rarer, and the Zooms seem to be one of the few left.

What are your monitors? I'm trying to work out if you have recorded good quality but are not hearing it? Nothing bad about the zooms at all. Mixers rarely have the ability to use external drives - the ones with digital outputs go into the computer. Plugging your guitar into the zoom should get decent enough results. What is it like on headphones?

We need some more info really - but without a computer, you're getting less and less products that will be useful as the months go on. hardware based recording systems are getting quite rare really. You could buy a second hand huge, amazing quality analogue mixer on Ebay for hardly any money and then buy something like a second hand HD24 and have a very high quality system - you could get some very good deals, but the sad fact is that a cheap interface and free software can do much more useful stuff. Some folk are into old analogue stuff and that's a specialist area now, but mid range one box products are sadly on the way out.

Are you sure your monitors are doing the job? Maybe a clip or two on Soundcloud of the sound you have will give us a clue? My stick in the mud colleague is still producing decent quality music on his zoom with a few mics and DI boxes - so the zoom isn't the problem I very much doubt.
 
rob aylestone said:
The zoom HD8 should sound pretty good - so this points to what's going in, and where it goes afterwards - so that's mics and speakers.

I find it hard to imagine doing recordings now on a linear system where you have to go back to old processes to do things. Computers make recording so versatile now, I'd not go back. However, lots of people do hate computers - I get that.

First task then is to find out if your HD8 is faulty, because sonically it's not horrible at all. Mixers with recording facilities are getting rarer and rarer, and the Zooms seem to be one of the few left.

What are your monitors? I'm trying to work out if you have recorded good quality but are not hearing it? Nothing bad about the zooms at all. Mixers rarely have the ability to use external drives - the ones with digital outputs go into the computer. Plugging your guitar into the zoom should get decent enough results. What is it like on headphones?

We need some more info really - but without a computer, you're getting less and less products that will be useful as the months go on. hardware based recording systems are getting quite rare really. You could buy a second hand huge, amazing quality analogue mixer on Ebay for hardly any money and then buy something like a second hand HD24 and have a very high quality system - you could get some very good deals, but the sad fact is that a cheap interface and free software can do much more useful stuff. Some folk are into old analogue stuff and that's a specialist area now, but mid range one box products are sadly on the way out.

Are you sure your monitors are doing the job? Maybe a clip or two on Soundcloud of the sound you have will give us a clue? My stick in the mud colleague is still producing decent quality music on his zoom with a few mics and DI boxes - so the zoom isn't the problem I very much doubt.
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Hi Rob

Thanks for responding. The monitors are M-audio studiophile AV 32 not the best but the best I can afford. Recording whole playing sounds OK but playback is awful plus I find mixing a faff. I much prefer the layout of the fostex where its all there in front of you and there's no need to go in and out of menus for multifunction buttons etc. I've got a DAW set up on the pc recently just to try it but I prefer old school coz I'm old I guess.
Ive had the Xenyx 1202 suggested to me but what would I hook it up to?
 
Assuming you never want more than two mics, the zoom would still be a better product than the cheap basic mixer you are thinking about? The speakers are never going to be nice quality to listen to at that price point. They always claim to have good bass - but the pair of similar style ones I have are impossible to mix on because the bass is enhanced to the point it gets muddy and horrible on anything other than dance music with synth basses. I'm away from home using these small speakers and every mix is wrong. In Cubase I now have a crazy eq curve set for them to make the bass more controlled, but checking each mixc on headphones needs more work at the bottom end. To use a DAW needs a decent interface but the benefits once you persevere are HUGE. Simple stuff - like eq curves, reverbs and dynamics. Let alone the virtual instruments and the editing abilities. Once you have borrowed a bit ion the first chorus to repair the less well played second one, you never go back. Imagine using a typewriter with no copy and paste? I failed to convince my friend to do it, but he knows he really should learn the new skills because the benefits are great. It's of course a choice.

What is your zoom like with decent headphones? I bet its clean and balanced, and its those speakers messing things up - what you hear is not what you recorded.
 
Hi Rob, just to answer your point regarding the interface its a Behringer U-phoria UMC22. The DAW I've got is Podium, I also have Audacity but I find Podium a bit easier
 
I'm a little unsure of where your issues might be. I've got the R24 and an H4n, and both make good recordings. Certainly nothing "boxy" sounding. I typically use the R24 for remote recording, then pull the SD card and dump the files into Reaper. I have used the R24 to do a full mixdown using the internal effects and EQ. It sounded fine, of course the effects of the Zoom sounded different from those in Reaper, so things like reverb and EQ balance were different. I didn't try to mimic the EQ curves between the two system.

You can always look at other systems. In the realm of self contained recorders, Tascam has the DP24 and DP32, which are comparable to the R24. Nothing these days will have a hard drive, they will all have SD cards, which I prefer. I've got a project on the back burner to convert my old Yamaha AW16G and AW1600 to use SD cards, just for fun.

BTW, the AW1600 is really nice machine once you get used to the workflow. I thought the sound quality was excellent. You can find used ones for around $300. They have a 40GB hard drive, but have the capability of dumping files directly to a computer for backup. The audio format is proprietary, so you can't simply dump a .wav file like you would with the Zoom.
 
Thanks I appreciate the help. The tascams look like my kind of thing. Looks like I've got some options so thanks for the advice guys, like I said I'm very very new to this and it all seems confusing at the moment. I think I need to see what I've got and just get stuck in.
 
honey badger said:
I'm very very new to this and it all seems confusing at the moment
Click to expand...
It is very confusing initially. But bit by bit, the fog does clear. The key, though it sounds so obvious, is to persevere through the frustration. I'm about to embark on two new avenues at once, a new operating system and getting to grips with a video camera. I haven't used a video since around 1993 and new operating systems have long been a pain in the patootie for me. But persevere I must and so must you. With recording, it really does make sense eventually.
 
I record syndicated radio shows professionally and always record to a recorder first, then copy to PC for editing. My PCs are OK, bu a fragmented HD, a cheaper SSD, etc. can "stutter" and you can't fix it. A dedicated recorder is designed to record reliably. I can't go back for a second "take" later.
 
Look at a BOSS BR-1600. They are out of production now, but plenty available on EBay. I've been using it for several years and I love it. There is a learning curve of course, but there are instructional DVD's available.
 
Hi Dalton, thanks for the advice I just checked those out, they look similar to my zoom. I've spent the weekend getting to grips with everything and to be honest I'm making some headway finally.
Really grateful for all the advice and suggestions though everyone. I've no doubt I'll be back with with more dumbass questions at some point!
 
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