Having an Objective View of Your Abilities

Yeah, I always liked the concept that just stopped him from having to hear the distractions to the music that was already in his head

I like this thread. I have been having simillar thoughts recently and have cut my self off from buying any new gear/software and concentrate on 1) practicing/playing and singing more to get the material right first, 2) getting the best out of what I have by using it to it's best effect by learning it inside and out and 3) realising I have to get better (not the gear) if my songs are to get better

it's been a month and the gear aquisition cold turkey is starting to ease (a little)

moresound said:
Psssst....Wanta buy a microphone?
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LOL!!!

I've actually the opposite right now. I havn't bought gear in a very long time as i've focused mostly on song writing. I just started buying gear again and WOW my music sounds SOOOOOOOOOOO much better! I do agree that it is a good idea to refrain from gear constantly to better your sound. I see A LOT of people doing that and its just pathetic. Thanks for starting this post! I also get AMAZED at how some people can post music and they actually think their music has been blessed by the Gods of music or something. I find that most of the people that say how good their music is, have a completely twisted ego and their music usually SUCKS. Great thread!
 
grimtraveller said:
This, I guess, will always be the artistic {sorry Greg ! :D} dilema. If something sounds good to you and no one else and therefore you want to do it that way, is it not a compromise to do it the way others may want it done, simply because that is how they like it ? The worst kind of compromise ? Though there are tons of songs we all love in the versions that came to us, there are also tons of artists that hate their work and wish they'd gone their way instead !

On the other hand to simply ignore where the rest of the human race may be at in relation to one's 'product' is no solution either. Many artists have suffered coz of this down the centuries.
Keeping the tension and balance is crucial yet difficult. For the home recordist, I guess there are at least two camps, those for whom this is a hobby and those who actually want to compete in the wider world. But the OP has applications to both parties.

Interesting piece, plenty of soul food.
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Great point! I find that most of the really great music comes from the heart. Sometimes that appeals to a lot of people sometimes it doesnt. Regardless, I believe that when music is created for other people it often loses the sincerity and doesnt evoke a feeling that all great music does. I also think there is a huge loss of quality when someone writes music from any place other than their OWN heart and soul.
 
Time to Quit While You are a "HEAD"

Yes How we want,
what we want
& when We want it.

I have had to Curb a few instance of that over the years, But HEY ! I walked in and Out of the Local Music Store Yesterday without so much as Buying a GTR pick. Now that's Progress..And "Comments from the PEANUT gallery" NAAH you can Keep'em!

gecko zzed said:
All true, but, predictably, easier said than done.


Underpinning all this is the current thirst for instant gratification . . . "What do we want?" "Perfection!" "When do we want it?' "Now!". Many people have forgotten that quality results (in any field) demand expertise and knowledge, which take time and effort to acquire . . . "I haven't had much experience in recording, but we want to record a band demo by tomorrow. How do we get a good commercial sound?"

Time and patience is needed, as is objectivity. Don't heed the comments of friends and relatives; they tell lies.
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Lt. Bob said:
I'm pretty seriously competent for all the good it does me.
I have to work 6 nights a week just to get to 40k a year. That's poverty right there really.
Better than working in a convenience store though.

But my point is that having fun and joy with your music is far more important than how good you are.
We've all know great players who were bitter and unhappy with music.
That's worthless ..... what's the point?

I think the only competency you need is whatever level it takes to make you happy.
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Amen, I have to agree here. This really applies to me. When I first started playing and song writing, the people who loved me told me I was great, but I knew in my own mind I would not be some virtuoso, so I just had fun with music, it became a hobby and focus my abilities into a career.. So while someone who does this for a living, I think they probably do need to do self evaluation at some point but my livelyhood does not depend on it so I do it for fun and because I like it. No pressure, just fun. If people like what I do, then great, if they don't, than that is fine too. I don't have to self evaluate because I have nothing to prove, no ego to injure. Do I progress, sure, but because I want to not out of need to feed the ego or the pocketbook.
 
GuitardedMark said:
Great point! I find that most of the really great music comes from the heart. Sometimes that appeals to a lot of people sometimes it doesnt. Regardless, I believe that when music is created for other people it often loses the sincerity and doesnt evoke a feeling that all great music does. I also think there is a huge loss of quality when someone writes music from any place other than their OWN heart and soul.
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I have heard this argument presented many times, and it is very appealing. But I remain unconvinced by it. And the reason is that there are so many performers out there who record stunning versions of other people's material. Take, for example, Eva Cassidy's version of "Somewhere Over the Rainbow". There is an art to writing material that is good, but there is an equal art to taking what someone else has written and creating something special from it. I do agree that heart and soul is important, but it is particularly important in performance, moreso than writing.
 
Love love love

I love this thread

especially the chap who posted on the last page or so about it being
"hearty and honest" lmao brilliant words (also damn true)

Anywho while reading through I was reminded of a quote by Vladimir Horowitz i read on the sleeve of a Cd of his...
the bugger of it is, I cant find the case, and amazingly I cant find the quote online!! that in itself challenges me in new ways :P

but to paraphrase quite crudely I'm sure, it was something like:

"For me three things have to be coordinated, and no one thing should overpower the others. Heart, knowledge, and technique.
without heart, you are an automaton, without knowledge you are a novice, without technique you are an amateur"

I liked the idea of that balance of passion, theoretical knowledge, and technical mastery.
 
my first post here: Horowitz had it right.

I've been at this music thing for 50 years. I play piano (50), keyboards (6), guitar (3) and vocals (1.5 and taking lessons). My dad played trumpet. I'm fighting hearing loss in my right ear, so I do need a second pair of ears periodically. I've been doing my own recording and mixing for the past 3 years. I'm lucky to have some friends who will not mince words, and I also know a couple semi-pros who have been able to make some constructive suggestions. After my last project, I went back and listened to my first one, and was in the "what was I thinking then?" mode.

I, too, remain unconvinced by the argument about "music written by one person and performed by others" is lacking in feeling. I have heard very emotional performances of Schubert, for example, by pianists in the past 20 years. I've also heard very sterile performances of the same works. Stravinsky wrote the Rite Of Spring, did a recording of it with himself conducting, yet said "Wow!" after he heard Bernstein's NYPO performance. Composers can get bogged down in the minutae of their own compositions.

Some people can write whole songs, some people are good at writing instrumentation, some good at writing lyrics. Typically classic songs like "Stormy Weather" were a collaboration between a lyricist and a music writer, but it took Lena Horne to bring it to life. I can't write lyrics to save my life. I can write melody and chords. So until I find someone who writes lyrics, I'm doing other people's songs.

But see my signature.... ;)
 
Supercreep said:
Now for the rub: If you have a tin ear, none of this is going to help you turn around a decent product.
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How do you know whether the problem is your gear or your skill? I can't record decent tone quality from my cello no matter how hard I try, yet people say my live sound is beautiful, so I don't know if it's my playing, or my (mostly low end) gear, or my (lack of) recording skills. The vocals were unintelligible to anyone but us, and our attempts at miking drums sounded like a garbage truck running over a pile of steel barrels. How do we know where to start?
(I really hope it's mostly skill. Skills we can learn. Gear costs money.)
 
Randomsignal said:
How do you know whether the problem is your gear or your skill? I can't record decent tone quality from my cello no matter how hard I try, yet people say my live sound is beautiful, so I don't know if it's my playing, or my (mostly low end) gear, or my (lack of) recording skills. The vocals were unintelligible to anyone but us, and our attempts at miking drums sounded like a garbage truck running over a pile of steel barrels. How do we know where to start?
(I really hope it's mostly skill. Skills we can learn. Gear costs money.)
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At this point it's gonna be mostly skills you need to learn. A beginner can get equally poor results with the very best gear while a pro can get decent results with entry level gear.
So just spend your time learning right now. You won't even know what gear you want to buy until you learn a bit.
 
Having an Objective View of Your Objectives

Possibly the title for this thread should have been "have an objective view of your objectives." I've played guitar for over fouty years, and I'm still a poor guitar player. Of course, I knew when I was twenty that I wasn't much of a guitar player, but I still enjoy playing and it makes me feel good. I don't have all of the top-of-the line equipment, I record on a notebook computer, and I use a $40.00 DAW and a few freebie VST effects.

While it is absolutely true that a lot of the members of this forum are expecting to produce music like Barbara Streisand in Capitol Records studios without having developed enough talent and technical knowledge, it is equally true that many (most?) of the members of this forum are recording for fun and personal enjoyment. A pair of $20 dollar dynamic microphones meet my expectations (today).

I think that some of the overzelious 'techno Gods' on this board are every bit as out of line as the 15 year old rock star wanna bees. This is a home recording forum - not a pro-audio forum (although today's cheap technology is far superior to the pro-audio equipment of 20 years ago).

Anyways, recording my playing and being able to listen to it objectively has done more to improve my playing skills over the past year than anything else over the prior 39+ years. And actually listening to my singing has led to enough of an improvement that my Wife no longer has to leave the room when I sing and play guitar. I'm rather proud of this (my wife not having to leave the room or the house) when I play.

On top of it all, the advise and suggestions that people have made on this forum have really done a lot to make me sound better than I am, That is my objective here and it is being fulfulled rather well (THANK YOU ALL).
 
gcolbert said:
Possibly the title for this thread should have been "have an objective view of your objectives." I've played guitar for over fouty years, and I'm still a poor guitar player. Of course, I knew when I was twenty that I wasn't much of a guitar player, but I still enjoy playing and it makes me feel good. I don't have all of the top-of-the line equipment, I record on a notebook computer, and I use a $40.00 DAW and a few freebie VST effects.

While it is absolutely true that a lot of the members of this forum are expecting to produce music like Barbara Streisand in Capitol Records studios without having developed enough talent and technical knowledge, it is equally true that many (most?) of the members of this forum are recording for fun and personal enjoyment. A pair of $20 dollar dynamic microphones meet my expectations (today).

I think that some of the overzelious 'techno Gods' on this board are every bit as out of line as the 15 year old rock star wanna bees. This is a home recording forum - not a pro-audio forum (although today's cheap technology is far superior to the pro-audio equipment of 20 years ago).

Anyways, recording my playing and being able to listen to it objectively has done more to improve my playing skills over the past year than anything else over the prior 39+ years. And actually listening to my singing has led to enough of an improvement that my Wife no longer has to leave the room when I sing and play guitar. I'm rather proud of this (my wife not having to leave the room or the house) when I play.

On top of it all, the advise and suggestions that people have made on this forum have really done a lot to make me sound better than I am, That is my objective here and it is being fulfulled rather well (THANK YOU ALL).
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yep ...... couldn't have said it better.
 
if you install soundtreatment on you ears not only is it cheaper but you can then mix or record anywhere you are...
 
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