I have an Alesis ADAT recorder. Is it possible to hook up The ADAT to an 8 track reel to reel such as a Tascam or Fostex to record 10 or 12 tracks simultaniously and overdub the remaining tracks? Thus haveing some tracks analog and some digital. Is there a device that makes that possible without robbing a bank? Thanks, Don
8 tracks ADAT+8 tracks reel to reel= 16 simultaniuos tracks?
- Thread starter alba359
- Start date
Track Rat
Just Your Average Sized Member
Get your ski mask ready. On the ADAT side you need the BRC which would generate SMPTE time code and then Tascam makes a sync box that I can't remember the name of that would read time code and lock the two machines together. And of course you'd loose a track on the reel to reel for time code. It would be cheeper to buy an additional ADAT, hook 'em up and record.
sonusman
Banned
Trackrat has explained it well. I will add to this.
You would need to "stripe" SMPTE time code to the analog tape on one track (preferably tracks 4 or 5, as tracks 1 and 8 are on the other sides of the tape, and are more prone to being damaged from storage and rubbing against the reel. Time code NEEDS to be preserved well for it to work well. This is a great rule to follow for more important tracks that carry a lot of high frequency information on analog tape. Bass guitar and kick drum are two very good candidates for tracks 1 and 8.).
You will need the BRC for this too work. The BRC will generate SMPTE time code, AND read it. You would do it like this:
1 - Run a cable from the BRC's SMPTE output to the tape decks input. If you are recording at +4 or -10 on the analog deck, you need to make sure that the BRC is outputting this same operating level, which is selectable on the BRC (refer to manual for how to select this.)
2 - Put a tape in the ADAT machine. You need to run tape in the ADAT for the BRC to output SMPTE, because the SMPTE is derived from the proprietary time code on ADAT tape.
3 - Start the ADAT Play, and the analog decks play and record the SMPTE. There are SMPTE offset's available on the BRC and those should be applied (the BRC manual has a good explaination of SMPTE offsets too!).
4 - Hook up a cable from the analog machines output to the SMPTE input on the BRC, and select External Sync for the BRC. Press play on the BRC (the ADAT tape will not move yet because there is no incoming time code for it to follow), then press play on the analog deck. The ADAT will now start to play, and will take a bit of time to "sync" with the incoming time code.
Some warnings!!!
ADAT's like to see VERY stable time code!!! Since the SMPTE is being generated from your analog machine, if the reel motors on your machine are not rock solid, the ADAT MAY not stay in sync with the incoming time code from the tape. This is all about timing issues. The ADAT NEEDS to have stable timing to follow, and if the tape machines motor is fluctuating too much, the ADAT will not be able to stay in sync!
You will need to have plenty of "leader" for the ADAT to sync with the incoming time code. This can be as little as 5 seconds, and as much as 20 seconds. Probably around 8-10 seconds will be what works. What this means is that you will want to have at least 8 seconds of tape roll before you engage Record on the ADAT so that it can get in sync with the incoming time code. The ADAT WILL NOT record until a sync is achieved. Your milage may vary in regards to how long sync takes.
When you stipe the analog tape, it is a good idea to set the ADAT to -5 seconds to start. You would then start the analog machine first, then start the ADAT. The SMPTE code then will start at 22:59:55:00 (23 hours, 59 minutes, 55 seconds, 0 frames) , and when the ADAT get's to 00:00:00:00, you will have that on the analog tape. You will want to go ahead and stripe the whole analog tape in one pass.
When you go to record on the ADAT, you will want to start the recording at around 00:00:10:00 (10 seconds). This way, you will have that first 10 seconds of ADAT tape to run before it start recording.
I will be honest, I have tried to make older analog machines sync with ADAT, and did not have great luck. Some analog machines just don' t have motors that are stable enough to make this happen. If yours is, GREAT!!! If not, you will either need to have the motor serviced or replaced, or abandon the idea. Before you go buying all the stuff you need to make this happen, you may want to borrow a BRC and try it out to see if it will work with your analog deck.
Good luck!
Ed
You would need to "stripe" SMPTE time code to the analog tape on one track (preferably tracks 4 or 5, as tracks 1 and 8 are on the other sides of the tape, and are more prone to being damaged from storage and rubbing against the reel. Time code NEEDS to be preserved well for it to work well. This is a great rule to follow for more important tracks that carry a lot of high frequency information on analog tape. Bass guitar and kick drum are two very good candidates for tracks 1 and 8.).
You will need the BRC for this too work. The BRC will generate SMPTE time code, AND read it. You would do it like this:
1 - Run a cable from the BRC's SMPTE output to the tape decks input. If you are recording at +4 or -10 on the analog deck, you need to make sure that the BRC is outputting this same operating level, which is selectable on the BRC (refer to manual for how to select this.)
2 - Put a tape in the ADAT machine. You need to run tape in the ADAT for the BRC to output SMPTE, because the SMPTE is derived from the proprietary time code on ADAT tape.
3 - Start the ADAT Play, and the analog decks play and record the SMPTE. There are SMPTE offset's available on the BRC and those should be applied (the BRC manual has a good explaination of SMPTE offsets too!).
4 - Hook up a cable from the analog machines output to the SMPTE input on the BRC, and select External Sync for the BRC. Press play on the BRC (the ADAT tape will not move yet because there is no incoming time code for it to follow), then press play on the analog deck. The ADAT will now start to play, and will take a bit of time to "sync" with the incoming time code.
Some warnings!!!
ADAT's like to see VERY stable time code!!! Since the SMPTE is being generated from your analog machine, if the reel motors on your machine are not rock solid, the ADAT MAY not stay in sync with the incoming time code from the tape. This is all about timing issues. The ADAT NEEDS to have stable timing to follow, and if the tape machines motor is fluctuating too much, the ADAT will not be able to stay in sync!
You will need to have plenty of "leader" for the ADAT to sync with the incoming time code. This can be as little as 5 seconds, and as much as 20 seconds. Probably around 8-10 seconds will be what works. What this means is that you will want to have at least 8 seconds of tape roll before you engage Record on the ADAT so that it can get in sync with the incoming time code. The ADAT WILL NOT record until a sync is achieved. Your milage may vary in regards to how long sync takes.
When you stipe the analog tape, it is a good idea to set the ADAT to -5 seconds to start. You would then start the analog machine first, then start the ADAT. The SMPTE code then will start at 22:59:55:00 (23 hours, 59 minutes, 55 seconds, 0 frames) , and when the ADAT get's to 00:00:00:00, you will have that on the analog tape. You will want to go ahead and stripe the whole analog tape in one pass.
When you go to record on the ADAT, you will want to start the recording at around 00:00:10:00 (10 seconds). This way, you will have that first 10 seconds of ADAT tape to run before it start recording.
I will be honest, I have tried to make older analog machines sync with ADAT, and did not have great luck. Some analog machines just don' t have motors that are stable enough to make this happen. If yours is, GREAT!!! If not, you will either need to have the motor serviced or replaced, or abandon the idea. Before you go buying all the stuff you need to make this happen, you may want to borrow a BRC and try it out to see if it will work with your analog deck.
Good luck!
Ed
Recording Engineer
Moderator
I'm Doing It!
Tascam TSR-8 "'N Sync" with two ADAT-XTs... How can I put put this... IT SUCKS!!! Yeah, it works... Just a pain in the ass! I'd much rather be all on 2" and all the ass pains associated with that as it's well worth it in comparison!
Let me know when you have the $10k for me to buy it! I have the 2" transport and the heads... Only all the cleaning, case, cards, and PSUs to go... Oh so close... Ha!
Tascam TSR-8 "'N Sync" with two ADAT-XTs... How can I put put this... IT SUCKS!!! Yeah, it works... Just a pain in the ass! I'd much rather be all on 2" and all the ass pains associated with that as it's well worth it in comparison!
Let me know when you have the $10k for me to buy it! I have the 2" transport and the heads... Only all the cleaning, case, cards, and PSUs to go... Oh so close... Ha!
Thanks Ed
Wow...........!!! Thanks Ed. Where did you learn all this stuff! Can you recomend some books reading material or videos to point me in the right direction. I know little about recording. I have played drums in local lounge bands for many years and have always wanted to set up a small studio to record with my musician friends and make demos for small bands. My studio is being built in my back yard starting on Tuesday. It will be 24 by 24. Just the shell will be built, I will finish the inside. So far my recording equipment consist of ; ADAT, Alesis Studio 24, Fostex 450 board (may use as a sub mixer for drums) Sony 4 track Minidisc recorder (for mixdown and field work), Blue Max compressor, Behringer Virtuilizer, 2-AKG C1000S, Studio projects C1, 3-Shure57's, nd868 mikes and mike stands. I have hardly used this stuff as my house is too small. Thanks guys, Don alba359@bellsouth.net
Wow...........!!! Thanks Ed. Where did you learn all this stuff! Can you recomend some books reading material or videos to point me in the right direction. I know little about recording. I have played drums in local lounge bands for many years and have always wanted to set up a small studio to record with my musician friends and make demos for small bands. My studio is being built in my back yard starting on Tuesday. It will be 24 by 24. Just the shell will be built, I will finish the inside. So far my recording equipment consist of ; ADAT, Alesis Studio 24, Fostex 450 board (may use as a sub mixer for drums) Sony 4 track Minidisc recorder (for mixdown and field work), Blue Max compressor, Behringer Virtuilizer, 2-AKG C1000S, Studio projects C1, 3-Shure57's, nd868 mikes and mike stands. I have hardly used this stuff as my house is too small. Thanks guys, Don alba359@bellsouth.net
Blue Bear Sound
New member
Hmmm... just an off-topic comment... you DON'T want to be using a minidisc recorder as a mixdown unit.... at least - not for any serious work.
Bruce
Bruce
Thanks Blue Bear Sound
What would you suggest? The reason I am using the Sony Md Mk 2 for mixdown is because I already own one. Eventually I will go to another medium. I will use it to learn on. When I was a teenger just learning drums I had some of the junkiest equipment avaiable. I think it helped me in the long run. It taught me to make the best of what I have, to make repairs, and to appreciate good equipment when you get it. Hope I'm not rambling too much. Thanks Blue Bear Sound, Don
What would you suggest? The reason I am using the Sony Md Mk 2 for mixdown is because I already own one. Eventually I will go to another medium. I will use it to learn on. When I was a teenger just learning drums I had some of the junkiest equipment avaiable. I think it helped me in the long run. It taught me to make the best of what I have, to make repairs, and to appreciate good equipment when you get it. Hope I'm not rambling too much. Thanks Blue Bear Sound, Don
What I assume Bruce is trying to say here is that mini-disc is not
good beacuse you wanna mixdown to something that leaves the signal UNCOMPRESSED.
Many people use DAT or reel (1/4 or 1/2). If you would consider bringing a computer into your system you could of course mixdown to a .wav file and burn a CD as the final product.
BTW, sounds pretty cool with a studio in your backyard. Why don´t you post some pictures here so we can follow the progress?
giggsy
good beacuse you wanna mixdown to something that leaves the signal UNCOMPRESSED.
Many people use DAT or reel (1/4 or 1/2). If you would consider bringing a computer into your system you could of course mixdown to a .wav file and burn a CD as the final product.
BTW, sounds pretty cool with a studio in your backyard. Why don´t you post some pictures here so we can follow the progress?
giggsy
Thanks Giggsy
I have an old Dokorder 4 track reel to reel, 7" by 1/4", fastest speed is 7 1/2 ips. I thought the mini disc would be better for mixdown. I will try and keep you informed on studio, I have no camera, all spare money goes into drums and recording equipment. The contractor says he needs 3 days of no rain before he can begin. So far it looks like Wednesday. Thanks for your reply and intrest. If someone needs to know about drums I may be able to help, of course my knowledge is limited. Thanks, Don
I have an old Dokorder 4 track reel to reel, 7" by 1/4", fastest speed is 7 1/2 ips. I thought the mini disc would be better for mixdown. I will try and keep you informed on studio, I have no camera, all spare money goes into drums and recording equipment. The contractor says he needs 3 days of no rain before he can begin. So far it looks like Wednesday. Thanks for your reply and intrest. If someone needs to know about drums I may be able to help, of course my knowledge is limited. Thanks, Don
Anytime, man.
A 1/4 reel to reel is very popular to mixdown to and it also sounds great, esp if you "add" some tape saturation. Just make sure that the heads are fine and well aligned. You can always make a digital copy later.
I´m not familiar with the brand (not coming from the States which is a good thing right now, I guess, with half of the country on fire...) but you might wanna have a repairshop make sure it´s fine.
You don´t wanna have the azimuth all wrong and the tensionrolls causing tapehiss.
And you should borrow a camera just for your own documentation. It´s hard to remember all the details when you´re building a studio and sometimes you might wanna go back to check on how you assembled something or solved a problem.
I might take you up on the drum help offer later on...
giggsy
A 1/4 reel to reel is very popular to mixdown to and it also sounds great, esp if you "add" some tape saturation. Just make sure that the heads are fine and well aligned. You can always make a digital copy later.
I´m not familiar with the brand (not coming from the States which is a good thing right now, I guess, with half of the country on fire...) but you might wanna have a repairshop make sure it´s fine.
You don´t wanna have the azimuth all wrong and the tensionrolls causing tapehiss.
And you should borrow a camera just for your own documentation. It´s hard to remember all the details when you´re building a studio and sometimes you might wanna go back to check on how you assembled something or solved a problem.
I might take you up on the drum help offer later on...
giggsy