Something or nothing?

WhiteStrat

WhiteStrat

Don't stare at the eye.
Sometimes when I try to write a song, I feel more like I'm just beating a bunch of chords to death, then wanking over them... :(

Here's the latest thing I'm working on. Sorry for the abrupt ending but I've mixed and posted enough to ask the following question: is this too predictable or even mechanical in it's arrangement and execution?

The lead guitar is just a scratch track--threw that on tonight so I could post the mix, but the rest of it's pretty close to the real deal.

(While the question I pose is more about writing/playing, feel free to comment on the tracking & mixing as well--good or bad--as again, except for the lead guitar, this is where I'm heading with it.)

Thanks for your time and opinions! :)

 
I'd say the only thing too predictable is the bass line - except where you go up the neck - because it's too close to the strum.
The beginning seemed familiar but not predictable.
The ending wasn't!
In fact I like the progression and most of the arrangement.
Oh, the lead line - being a quickie was - predictable to a degree but when you actually spend the time to work out something you really want I'd expect that to change.
Keep going with this one!
 
There's nothing new under the sun is the old saying. Keep going with this. I liked where it was going.

Yeah, the lead was predictable, but it was nice...
 
I definitely hear something in the works there. Nice basic structure, and if you work on the melody line a little, it'll even have a nice hook. Right after that part where it ended, you may try a key change for a blistering solo. Coming along nicely.
 
Sounds okay to me. There's nothing wrong with comfortable and a little predictable. I like the crunchy breakdown part. The lead is a little to wanky for me, but good playing. Keep going with it.
 
Nice tone....both the acoustic and the lead. I like the arrangement and playing...and the sounds gel together pretty well.
 
rayc said:
I'd say the only thing too predictable is the bass line - except where you go up the neck - because it's too close to the strum.
The beginning seemed familiar but not predictable.
The ending wasn't!
In fact I like the progression and most of the arrangement.
Oh, the lead line - being a quickie was - predictable to a degree but when you actually spend the time to work out something you really want I'd expect that to change.
Keep going with this one!
Click to expand...

Thanks! Ahh the curse of the guitarist who thinks he can play bass. I think I'll go back and mute the guitars and play the bass part with just the drums--get more in the pocket with the kit instead of the strumming.
 
Rokket said:
There's nothing new under the sun is the old saying. Keep going with this. I liked where it was going.

Yeah, the lead was predictable, but it was nice...
Click to expand...

Thanks Rokket. Yeah, I guess predictable's not necessarily bad--I'll keep going and work on the lead.
 
It wasn't that predictable to me because I expected it to sound like my song all the way through. Let's have a contest to see who can get famous with this chord progression first. Actually, I'm sure it's already been done.

Yours is the 4/4 acoustic version that I considered, but forced myself to record a 3/4 song.

 
bozmillar said:
It wasn't that predictable to me because I expected it to sound like my song all the way through. Let's have a contest to see who can get famous with this chord progression first. Actually, I'm sure it's already been done.

Yours is the 4/4 acoustic version that I considered, but forced myself to record a 3/4 song.

Click to expand...

Okay so we're both doing a I-V-IV with the tonic as a pedal tone--but I'm coming back up to the V before coming home and you're not. And when we get to the relative minors--well that's like a whole new zip code! :D

I guess what Rokket said is true--nothing new under the sun! (I don't have "natural pitch" but I'm guessing you're in E as well?)
 
Riffmaster said:
I definitely hear something in the works there. Nice basic structure, and if you work on the melody line a little, it'll even have a nice hook. Right after that part where it ended, you may try a key change for a blistering solo. Coming along nicely.
Click to expand...

Greg_L said:
Sounds okay to me. There's nothing wrong with comfortable and a little predictable. I like the crunchy breakdown part. The lead is a little to wanky for me, but good playing. Keep going with it.
Click to expand...

Thanks guys--I'll play with the key change idea--but I'll also try to make sure the lead has a point and doesn't just wank. I love a lead like a voice, but I also love to wank :-)eek::eek:) so I have to work at finding the balance...
 
WhiteStrat said:
Okay so we're both doing a I-V-IV with the tonic as a pedal tone--but I'm coming back up to the V before coming home and you're not. And when we get to the relative minors--well that's like a whole new zip code! :D
Click to expand...

eh, I think i like yours better anyways.
 
I like it - nice anthemic thing going on.

Playing the bass with the drums is a good idea - I suffer from the same bass-playing-guitar-player affliction. I like the bass sound (I got here via the discussion of direct v. mic bass recording) - I use my Digital MPA for smooth bass stuff like this, and an old Ashly preamp for edgier stuff.

Yes, redo the leads (acknowledging that it's a scratch track) - there's a lot more harmonic room to run around in with that progression.

Overall very good production quality for something you're pitching around.
 
antichef said:
I like it - nice anthemic thing going on.

Playing the bass with the drums is a good idea - I suffer from the same bass-playing-guitar-player affliction. I like the bass sound (I got here via the discussion of direct v. mic bass recording) - I use my Digital MPA for smooth bass stuff like this, and an old Ashly preamp for edgier stuff.

Yes, redo the leads (acknowledging that it's a scratch track) - there's a lot more harmonic room to run around in with that progression.

Overall very good production quality for something you're pitching around.
Click to expand...

Thanks, man. As far as the production quallity goes--I appreciate what you're saying, but the song took me one evening (yes, till about 3:00 am!), with the scratch lead coming a day later.

As uncreative as it sounds--it's kinda the factory approach to recording. I've got no outside projects in my studio right now, so I can have everything connected and dialed in the way I like. And there are certain things I just do a certain way--so assuming a song fits the basic rock & roll instrumental paradigm, I can record most anything in an evening. (But writing it and liking it--that's a different story.)

And anything beyond the basics (like an autoharp, lapsteel, or :eek: gasp--Vocals) and I'll have to play & tweak for quite a while...
 
Nice guitar work here Whitestrat!
Predictable??? WTF....just keep doing what you love! Recording sounds really good. I like the rythm git sound a lot. Is it a miced amp? Me, I'm still trying to find that sweet spot to place my SM57..... Make a complete tune out of this one, it's great!
Cheers
Joe ;)
 
joeym said:
Nice guitar work here Whitestrat!
Predictable??? WTF....just keep doing what you love! Recording sounds really good. I like the rythm git sound a lot. Is it a miced amp? Me, I'm still trying to find that sweet spot to place my SM57..... Make a complete tune out of this one, it's great!
Cheers
Joe ;)
Click to expand...

Thanks bro--yeah it's a miced amp. The whole thing grew out of me experimenting with a new Senn 421 (very old--but new to me) I think I found a good tone & spot for the rhythm part, but the leads not there for me yet.
Maybe I'll go back to the 57!

Thanks though--I'll keep working on it.
 
Nightfire said:
Sounds very good to me:D
Can you share you secrets as far as mics, guitars, and interface goes?
I really like the acoustic guitar sound you're getting.


Mike
Click to expand...

Thanks for the props. Sure, I'll spill the beans. I'll start with the acoustic and you let me know if you want to know about anything else:

I know people get sick of hearing this, but it really starts with the instrument. I've got a very warm cedar top Seagull acoustic that just records well. Because it's kinda warm to begin with, I can use a cheaper mic (which is likely to be hyped on the high end) and do alright. In this case I used a Rode NT5, but before I had them, I could get virtually identical results with an MXL 603.

It's about 8"-10" inches from the neck, at about the 14th fret, angled ever so slightly AWAY from the soundhole to reduce a bit of boom. That's going into a Symetrix SX202 Preamp, then into my TASCAM 1804 interface. The TASCAM has pres, but I use the line ins and bypass the its pres when using external pres (which is all the time anymore).

That by itself sounds pretty good, but there are two tricks that really bring it to life: First is double tracking. I play all the acoustic parts twice, and pan them hard left and right. (Same with the electric, but with variations on the panning when there are more parts.) I've tweaked the presets for my acoustic and my drum sound, but I use it as is for the bass.

The second "trick" is multi-band compression. I've got a multiband compressor plug in Cubase that I just love. Look, I'm gonna EQ a bit, right? And I'm gonna add some compression, right? I like the way the MBC does both. It's got some killer presets (yep, I used it on all the instruments--with different presets for each: drums, bass, electric and acoustic).

I like the big "radio" sound of some Mastering presets I have that I throw across the whole mix just to play around. Then I take it back off and try to get that sound by dealing with each instrument on its own.

After doing that I usually find that the whole mix only needs 5-10% of the polish that the mastering preset added.

The sound is better this way too, because slapping a heavy mastering preset across the whole mix necessarily compromises--making the drums sound bad to make the guitars sound good (or vice versa) etc,. With the right EQ and compression on each instrument, there are no compromises--I can make 'em all shine.

Let me know if you want to know more about the other tracks. In the meantime, if I have some time tonight, I'll post a snippet of the acoustic as it was tracked, and then after the multiband compression--you might be surprised at the difference.
 
Guitars as they were tracked:


With Multi Band Compression:


In all fairness--if this were a more acoustic song, I'd have gone without the MBC--but for this mix, I think it worked.
 
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