This aint personal...(personal note)

[jake-owa]

This place is a tool. You will get all kinds of opinions from people here, many will tell you that your song is killer because they want you to do the same for them.

I have to post this as a disclamer to all you with soft feelings. Recently I have made a deep enemy by reviewing a song. to be fair the poster wasn't posting a finished mix and I was quite harsh on the song. I tried to reconcile with this pubescent momma's boy but he has sworn to hate me for being his best friend.

You aint on american Idol and I aint Simon.

I do to others what I want done to me. I want honesty and first impressions from listeners. Negative is good, if I hear all the negative comments from people now I can do something to change the ones I happen to agree with. Sometimes I will go through five songs and rip apart everyone but then add a couple of those to personal playlists. I give opinions only.

If you want someone to tell you how great you are then go play your song for your mommy or girlfriend. If you want brutal honesty then post your song...I am waiting. I try to tear away the superficial issues and look through the song to find what's holding it back. If anyone here has the nads to do the same for me I would appreciate it.

Thank you all and may we together bring better music to the internet,
Jake

 

[scrubs]

Hooray for Jake!!! You're the best!!! My hero.





















Seriously, good post. I agree completely. There should be a sticky to this effect at the top of this forum.

 

[Supercreep]

Get 'em, Jake. It's a clinic for god's sake.

 

[KonradG]

This place is a tool. You will get all kinds of opinions from people here, many will tell you that your song is killer because they want you to do the same for them.

I have to post this as a disclamer to all you with soft feelings. Recently I have made a deep enemy by reviewing a song. to be fair the poster wasn't posting a finished mix and I was quite harsh on the song. I tried to reconcile with this pubescent momma's boy but he has sworn to hate me for being his best friend.

You aint on american Idol and I aint Simon.

I do to others what I want done to me. I want honesty and first impressions from listeners. Negative is good, if I hear all the negative comments from people now I can do something to change the ones I happen to agree with. Sometimes I will go through five songs and rip apart everyone but then add a couple of those to personal playlists. I give opinions only.

If you want someone to tell you how great you are then go play your song for your mommy or girlfriend. If you want brutal honesty then post your song...I am waiting. I try to tear away the superficial issues and look through the song to find what's holding it back. If anyone here has the nads to do the same for me I would appreciate it.

Thank you all and may we together bring better music to the internet,
Jake

I completely agree with pretty much everything you posted. I also think that you shouldn't focus 100% of the critique on the parts you don't like of a sample. A logical method of criticism is focusing on the parts you do and don't like. So if you are just trying to help the person like you say you are, then give them a complete analysis.

 

[jake-owa]

Nah, if I really can't find good things why should I blow smoke? I am not an elementary school teacher that is coming to class to make everyone feel good about participation.

There are plenty of other people here to do that. Dontcha ever get tired of reading "ditto" about a song?

I do.

If something seriously grabs me musically I will say so and I do.

 

[Rokket]

Nah, if I really can't find good things why should I blow smoke? I am not an elementary school teacher that is coming to class to make everyone feel good about participation.

There are plenty of other people here to do that. Dontcha ever get tired of reading "ditto" about a song?

I do.

If something seriously grabs me musically I will say so and I do.

I for one, appreciate you, Jake. Sometimes I get lost in my little creations and can't see the turd I polished for what it is. Plus I have a tendancy to start mixing right after I record, and that's never a good thing.

Of course, the whole last year the CD I was making was for my mom...

 

[mixmkr]

One thing I have to tell you Jake, you are late to the party with being "frank" and "upfront" with your replies. The board used to have some great talant, and was pretty brutal to those that submitted stuff that was glossed over. I have always said...for PETE'S sake, have the courtesy to make sure your instruments are in tune, the singing is ON PITCH, the drums are in time, etc.. So many excuses..."well, I'm going to go back and fix the bad notes and the timing of the drums...yadda yadda." Have the courtesy to FIX that stuff before you submit it for others to SPEND THE TIME to listen to it. If you need help on a mix and/or you are stuck were to go next....FINE!! no problemo. But get the performances down, OR THE STUFF YOU KNOW YOU CAN FIX>> eh?? Now... granted, everyone on the planet isn't a Neal Pert or a VanHalen..or WHOEVER. But bad recording is just playing over your limits too. Listen to some Fleetwood Mac...great, EASY songs. (I guess if you like that stuff )

What I have seen over the last year plus in the clinic is A LOT of patting on the back. People that REALLY suck telling someone slightly better that they are great!!... That and other reasons, I believe has lead to a BIG SATURATION of the clinic. So many people with 10 posts, put up a song, could give a rat's butt about commentting on others, just looking for that ego stroke...someone to tell them their stuff is good.

The post Jake alluded to...the music really sucked. Compare it to ANYTHING on the radio nowadays. It was BAD in MANY catagories... mix, performance, recording, songwriting, chops... on and on. Was it dog doo?? no...but it was BAD. The poster got all defensive, and rather than prove his point with an improved mix, went about trying to win his argument in ways other than being modest and showing his IMPROVED mix and skills.

Man...I want to write pages on this... especially want to get back into reviewing in the clinic, as for a couple of years, I thought this was BY FAR the best place on the internet. But, it is a whole new crowd, and I am not trying to say..."hey I was here when it was..." as there were plenty before me. But the attitude has really changed, and the quality, imo has really dropped. Excuses that...hey we are just doing it for fun...hobby...blah blah.. That's fine. but don't set the bar so low that a chihuahua can step over it without jumping.

There ARE some selected people here NOW that are good, but I generally find that their expertise is WASTED with watered down reviews...the kind that Jake refuses to get. I am NOT defending Jake, but feel the dude has stepped into my shoes..
If you want an ego stroke...play your stuff for your girlfriend, mother, little brother...or the 10 year old kid down the block just learning guitar.

Phew... aw.... stimulating posts... It's good to be back...I think!

End rant...

 

[mixmkr]

One last thing... I have heard IN MY OPINION, only a handful of songs that I would consider truely pro.. Some REALLY great players, but their recordings lacked in some way. When they are THAT good, you naturally RAISE the bar to critique them. Otherwise...why waste the time and tell them they are the best in the clinic??? But compared to Pink FLoyd, Metallica... or whoever is your current cup of soup... there is still a BIG difference ....mostly in songwriting I want to think.

I think those that have been around for a year, and had the courtesy to give over 100 reviews to their lonely 5 submissions (as a ratio off the top of my head), know who some of these players are.

Chris Harris is good
Bsabbath is good
Slucie is good
Emser is good
Giles is good
Crawdad is good
(sorry if my INCOMPLETE list differs from yours)

But...put these guys in a REAL studio, a REAL engineer, some REAL mastering...you'll hear a major difference. The thing is, these guys have the talant...just need to milk it out completely because it isn't there yet. Their home brew stuff is great...but you gotta admit, it still sounds home brew. But, I put them on a higher level to critique...otherwise a waste of time

Phew...now I suppose the asbestos suit comes out of the attic

 

[jake-owa]

Yeah, I am not late...just took a break for a while.

Search my posts in the clinic, I have always been this way.

Anyhow, here we is, let's get it on!


Mixmaker, I haven't always agreed with you but it's definitely time to raise the bar around here...all around.

Songwriting
Musicianship
Recording


Get it right and post for help. Were here for the group, let's not turn it into a big suckfest please!

 

[mixmkr]

Yeah, I am not late...just took a break for a while.

no..I am not commenting on your consistancy..but I remember when you first came around... maybe you were here before with another name I forget. But then, many probably would like to forget when I came around... The dreaded Sonusman(your new girlfriend?! ), Bvaleria, Sjoko, etc. ...some people I admittedly had some hot debates with.

but;
4+ years ago or so, it was MUCH easier to basically review EVERYTHING, because the front page would be there awhile. Now...look, the front page gets a 100 replies an hour. (exaggeration, but get the point) You pretty much KNEW everyone that posted, and it was a pretty tight, helpful community. New people were ALWAYS welcomed with open arms... Now.. the place is flooded.. But that is OK, infact great. But, everyone by now has a computer and a Delta 1010, the place is overwhelmed with crap.

Phew..!

 

[noisedude]

So now your pussy is aching too, Jake?

Seriously ... I have no idea who this is all about, but when I'm in the mood I enjoy your bitching very much. I suspect if we were to meet in real life we may get on a lot better ... we are more alike than you realise ... ! (Perhaps you are the version of me that is not reserved in speaking my mind!!!!)

Post me a link to the shit who started on you ... he will feel the full force of the Nice Brigade.

 

[noisedude]

everyone by now has a computer and a Delta 1010, the place is overwhelmed with crap.

I don't think the computers or the Deltas are the problem ... I think people having tools that are beyond their capability to use are. But the alternative is to sell every beginner a Portastudio till they understand basic electronics and bussing. Which way would we have it?

 

[mixmkr]

So now your pussy is aching too, Jake?

Seriously ... I have no idea who this is all about, but when I'm in the mood I enjoy your bitching very much. I suspect if we were to meet in real life we may get on a lot better ... we are more alike than you realise ... ! (Perhaps you are the version of me that is not reserved in speaking my mind!!!!)

Post me a link to the shit who started on you ... he will feel the full force of the Nice Brigade.

I'm not going to jump your stuff...but seriously, rather than drag up the dead cat...post some of YOUR good stuff instead. Sorry if I have missed it.... I have been sick!!!.. no...the dog ate my homework... no.. this is just a ruff mix... I'm gonna repost it... no.... the bass player is a dork...no....

 

[jake-owa]

Oh, it's not needed noisefag...(quick critique please thread) but go for it if you like.

Dogpiles are always fun. I dig teasing many people for many reasons but this one is actually kinda boring. I guess it's the faggy English anger, it seems so non-rock and roll. "I drink tea and my mum wanks me off but you wouldn't understand" kind of thing.

Yeah, I know, you're a cockney too.

Yeah Mixmkr, I hope we can raise the bar even a little. That 'other place' beats this place to shreds recently.

 

[mixmkr]

I don't think the computers or the Deltas are the problem ... I think people having tools that are beyond their capability to use are. But the alternative is to sell every beginner a Portastudio till they understand basic electronics and bussing. Which way would we have it?

the computer and the Delta 1010 IS the beginners portastudio NOWADAYS. or the soundblaster and moms PC...whatever.

 

[jake-owa]

I'm not going to jump your stuff...but seriously, rather than drag up the dead cat...post some of YOUR good stuff instead. Sorry if I have missed it.... I have been sick!!!.. no...the dog ate my homework... no.. this is just a ruff mix... I'm gonna repost it... no.... the bass player is a dork...no....

Yep, that's the real point here...

 

[noisedude]

I'm not going to jump your stuff...but seriously, rather than drag up the dead cat...post some of YOUR good stuff instead. Sorry if I have missed it.... I have been sick!!!.. no...the dog ate my homework... no.. this is just a ruff mix... I'm gonna repost it... no.... the bass player is a dork...no....

What good stuff? Have I not made it clear that I know shit?! Seriously - I'm a total beginner really, my ears are ok but in terms of actually writing a song, arranging it and still having enough brains space left to make a half-decent recording of it ... I'm miles off.

I should spend less time writing and more time reading - but I won't pretend I'm something I'm not. I hope no-one takes my post-count too seriously!!

 

[noisedude]

I guess it's the faggy English anger, it seems so non-rock and roll. "I drink tea and my mum wanks me off but you wouldn't understand" kind of thing.

Yeah, I know, you're a cockney too.

I don't think you know too much about England. I'm from the other end of the country (and cockneys are intensely annoying ... my mum is one).

I love your quaint little picture of my quaint little country ... one of these weeks I'll fix my computer, buy some new guitar strings and see what I can come up with. Until then - I am no fake because I admit my craptitude

 

[mixmkr]

What good stuff? Have I not made it clear that I know shit?! Seriously - I'm a total beginner really, my ears are ok but in terms of actually writing a song, arranging it and still having enough brains space left to make a half-decent recording of it ... I'm miles off.

I should spend less time writing and more time reading - but I won't pretend I'm something I'm not. I hope no-one takes my post-count too seriously!!

Sorry...I really didn't know. Thanks for the honesty.

Now..don't you belong back in the cave

 

[David]

One thing I have to tell you Jake, you are late to the party with being "frank" and "upfront" with your replies. The board used to have some great talant, and was pretty brutal to those that submitted stuff that was glossed over. I have always said...for PETE'S sake, have the courtesy to make sure your instruments are in tune, the singing is ON PITCH, the drums are in time, etc.. So many excuses..."well, I'm going to go back and fix the bad notes and the timing of the drums...yadda yadda." Have the courtesy to FIX that stuff before you submit it for others to SPEND THE TIME to listen to it. If you need help on a mix and/or you are stuck were to go next....FINE!! no problemo. But get the performances down, OR THE STUFF YOU KNOW YOU CAN FIX>> eh?? Now... granted, everyone on the planet isn't a Neal Pert or a VanHalen..or WHOEVER. But bad recording is just playing over your limits too. Listen to some Fleetwood Mac...great, EASY songs. (I guess if you like that stuff )

What I have seen over the last year plus in the clinic is A LOT of patting on the back. People that REALLY suck telling someone slightly better that they are great!!... That and other reasons, I believe has lead to a BIG SATURATION of the clinic. So many people with 10 posts, put up a song, could give a rat's butt about commentting on others, just looking for that ego stroke...someone to tell them their stuff is good.

The post Jake alluded to...the music really sucked. Compare it to ANYTHING on the radio nowadays. It was BAD in MANY catagories... mix, performance, recording, songwriting, chops... on and on. Was it dog doo?? no...but it was BAD. The poster got all defensive, and rather than prove his point with an improved mix, went about trying to win his argument in ways other than being modest and showing his IMPROVED mix and skills.

Man...I want to write pages on this... especially want to get back into reviewing in the clinic, as for a couple of years, I thought this was BY FAR the best place on the internet. But, it is a whole new crowd, and I am not trying to say..."hey I was here when it was..." as there were plenty before me. But the attitude has really changed, and the quality, imo has really dropped. Excuses that...hey we are just doing it for fun...hobby...blah blah.. That's fine. but don't set the bar so low that a chihuahua can step over it without jumping.

There ARE some selected people here NOW that are good, but I generally find that their expertise is WASTED with watered down reviews...the kind that Jake refuses to get. I am NOT defending Jake, but feel the dude has stepped into my shoes..
If you want an ego stroke...play your stuff for your girlfriend, mother, little brother...or the 10 year old kid down the block just learning guitar.

Phew... aw.... stimulating posts... It's good to be back...I think!

End rant...

Wow, good post mix. I for one am glad you're back, you've alway's been a fav of mine. I've read tons of your reviews (some on my stuff) and your alway's honest and up front. Jake is the same, he tells it like it is..and I can appreciate that. It's all good, keep up the great work..