Acoustic Critique Wanted

B

bpoco

New member
I'm micing my acoustic for the first time (historically I've just recorded direct). This is just a 30-second snippet and I'm looking for feedback on the sound (no pun intended) before I go for the whole song. This is the chorus progression.

A Travis picking piece.

Thanks - BPOCO

See "Acoustic Test"

http://www.nowhereradio.com/bpoco/singles
 
bpoco, I am struggling with acoustic guitar tone my self. See in this forum SRV-NOT from last week. I can only tell you what I hear. There seems to be no punch or drive in the lows. the whole sample sounds somewhat distant. The tonal characteristics dont emulate an acoustic "Being there" which is what I am searching for but have found elusive. You can look at some of the suggestions Ive been given over the past months by doing a search on me. These guys have been a lot of help.
where do you have the mic placed and what type is it? for starters
 
Holy shit. YEEESSSSS!!!!

Okay, now somebody else is gonna' come along and tell you it sounds over-compressed...You can respect their opinion, but if this were a track that I was gonna' use IN a mix, it needs to be this way. Crap, what a huge guitar sound. Excellent man. (also, in a mix you'd take some of the lows out, but you know that...lol).

THUMB RAISED AND POINTING IN YOUR DIRECTION.
 
Hmmmmm ..... in general, some pretty positive feedback .... all that is, except for YOU wfaraoni !!! LOL. So, of course, I'm going to focus on the negative. wfaraoni, this is for you.

First - the background:

1) Taylor 410ce.

2) One mic at the 12th fret (an EV N/D257B - I have no idea of it's quality). That's the mic in the right speaker.

3) 2nd mic over my right shoulder (a Rode NT1). Plus, I used some light compression on this mic while I tracked. That's the mic in the left speaker.

The distant sound you refer to may be due to the reverb I added. I experimented and only added some light reverb to the right channel (the EV mic).

I did some heavy compression on the whole thing but favored stuff at 5KHz and 10Khz with a sidechain. I love compression - but don't have a good instict for this beast yet!! I screw with it until I get a sound I like.

Just for fun, I posted the same snippet without the reverb and sidechain compression at 5kHz and 10kHz. I named it "wfaraoni special". Let me know what you think. Does it sound any more intimate? Any warmer?

Thanks all for listening and posting - BPOCO
 
bpoco, Thats funny wfaraoni special :D now that sounds fuller, richer and more realistic to me. Hmmm, so reverb and compression made this dramatic difference. Exactly what I think it needed. Much more like you there in front of me. definitely better than Ive been able to achieve myself to date. when I listened to the left mic by itself I thought it was slightly too boomy or flat or however you describe, but in the mix with the other it fits well and adds to the fullness. I will have to try recording with 2 mics. :D Heck It could not hurt.
I must tell you that I do not have the best ears, (closer to the worst),anymore and what sounds good to me is usually not what the average person likes. This is part of my own tone struggle and theres not much I can do about it :(

All in all I prefer this recording easily over the other, but you'd be better off taking the advice of others in general.

I'm VERY curious to see what others say about the difference.

By the way, nice clean playing, I could hear the string noise but its definitely NOT as pronounced as mine. someone told me to move the mic back to minimize the noise , I have not tried it yet.

The mic at the 12 fret is how far away in inches and facing where exactly on you recording?

And the one over the shoulder?

Just a note: my comments on the first post where not really intended to be negative but rather not as positive as possible.
After all theres always room for improvement and sound tone quality will never be all things to all people.

I enjoyed this
Bill
 
I must admit I prefer the wfaraoni version over the first one...but I believe the ideal might be one with less reverb than the first example but more reverb than the second...if the track was to stand alone that is. The string noise was bothersome but I guess this was mostly a test track for micing technique (?) Which brings me to a question...where was the NT1 placed in relation to the guitar?
 
I think I screwed up somewhere on a download. The first one I listened to (I thought) was one guitar; this one sounds like more, and it's heavy on the left.

did I get the right file(s)?
 
MAC2 said:
where was the NT1 placed in relation to the guitar?
Click to expand...


Answer:


bpoco said:
3) 2nd mic over my right shoulder (a Rode NT1). Plus, I used some light compression on this mic while I tracked. That's the mic in the left speaker.
Click to expand...
 
wfaraoni

wfaraoni sounds really good.

WWWWAAAYYYY better than the more effected sample, but i am sure you could tell that for yourself already. :)


thats the thing about taylors.. you just gotta' let em sing. they have perfect tone.

-alex
 
bpoco, hey ,Just a suggestion; If you want to know for sure which comes over better according to the masses why dont you edit the initial post to include the second sample as a choice cause some people just skim through the posts and realize won't theres a column B

I went back and tried them again,, nocontest is my vote, the second one is wonderful!
 
wfaraoni

The "12th-fret" mic was as close to the guitar as I could get it while playing. The "Over-the-shouler" mic was level with my head, but pointing back down towards the body of the guitar. It was probably 14" from the guitar. I did that to try and reduce string noise - but, honestly, I don't think it helped that much.

Also, I don't consider anyone's comments "negative" - it was a bad choice of words. I really appreciate anyone who takes the time to post and listen. If you hadn't of posted, I would have never tried the version without the reverb/sidechain. It's making me rethink my approach.

[edit] I tried to implement your suggestion of alerting readers to the second sample, but the BBS won't let you edit posts after 767 minutes (???).

chrisharris

Yep, you got the right files. Interesting. I swear, execpt for reverb and sidechain compression, the two files are identical. You didn't mention which version you prefer.

[edit] I went back and A/B'd the two again. This made me review my sidechain settings and it looks like that in addition to 5 kHz and 10kHz, I also compressed below 75 Hz. This would explain why the first one is less boomy and the 2nd one is a bit heavier.

alexspetty and kramer

Hey you guys .... you're not making my life any easier with your contrasting opinions. LOL. It just goes to show how subjective mixing really is.

MAC2

String noise. I was concerned about it. For the life of me, I can't seem to reduce it to any great extent, much less get rid of it. I may restring with some Elixers and see if that helps, but I'm beginning to think it may be related to the Taylor's personal characteristics.

Thanks for all the input - I think I'm going to go with the more intimate "wfaraoni special" ..... string noise be damned !!!! ...... pending any additional thoughts from chrisharris.

BPOCO
 
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Actually, I liked them both. I think it's just gonna depend on what else you add to it in the final mix, and what you want for your overall sound. Yes, the dry one is more intimate. For some reason, it also seemed to have more content in the left channel than right, which I didn't notice on the first one. I'm listening on phones right now, and there's definitely more on the left. String noise doesn't really bother me. It's part of how a guitar sounds. I would try to minimize it, but unless it's really obnoxious to you, I wouldn't worry about too much.


Twist
 
twist said:
Actually, I liked them both. I think it's just gonna depend on what else you add to it in the final mix
Click to expand...
Bingo! Give that man a cigar.

Sorry BPoco, I was so wrapped up in my confusion that I forgot to say that they're both very good. If you were to use the second version in a mix with drums and bass, I think it'll get totally lost and wash out, but maybe it only would in one of *MY* mixes. Regardless of which sounds "better" to my ears, they're both about 1000 times better than any direct sound I've ever heard, lol.

Take it easy, but take it.
Chris
 
sound lurvly and live

I prefer the live feel you get when you just record the guitar with the mic. Cool
 
Chrisharris:: Chrisharris: Ive got a lot of nerve dont I. The Headlines should read:

Half Deaf man dissagrees with recording engineer GURU!!:D :D :D

I have been so intent on getting a rich guitar tone that I failed to consider the ramifications of putting it in a mix with other instruments. Thats why Im a newbie with a lot of posts:o listed as a senior member.

I've noticed that when I get a particular sound of an individual instrument which I like, It tends to change timbre and volume when put in the mix depending on what its mixed with. Its kind of like when you get something out of phase isn't it? you can almost completely cancel out the sound!

Since this is an unknown variable, what, if any, are the rules of thumb for preliminary adjustment. is it just plain experience and experimentation or is there a good starting point?

My biggest problem has been that very thin guitar tone Id get on my earlier recordings. They sound a lot beefier on an individual track. I used simple logic and figured that I had to boost the beefyness to get the proper final result. thus this insatiable quest for more BEEF! Its not really that simple is it.

This probably deserves its own thread

All responses are appreciated
Peace
Bill
 
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