How do you cheat?

andrushkiwt

andrushkiwt

Well-known member
We learned to not mix anything in isolation - the listener doesn't hear anything that way, so mix it that way? - is the saying. But I'll admit the temptation to do so for some tasks is just TOO DAMN HIGH. :)

The most frequent break of this "rule of thumb", for me, is the bass/drum kit foundation. I'll frequently mute everything but these two tracks (SD channel as one track) and just listen, turn knobs, and try to get more of what I'm looking for. Of course, the high end of the guitars plays into the cymbal area, but if I'm going to unmute the guitars, then why not just unmute the vocals too...etc... so, I stick with drums and bass and work those together for awhile.

How do you "cheat"?
 
Tracking live drums here so part of my "housekeeping" is listening to the room, o/heads and kick mic's in iso to get them more or less in phase. Another rule I break all the time is the "distorted guitars don't need compression". I say : "Pffft. I'll compress any dang thing I want to"
 
Gtoboy said:
Tracking live drums here so part of my "housekeeping" is listening to the room, o/heads and kick mic's in iso to get them more or less in phase. Another rule I break all the time is the "distorted guitars don't need compression". I say : "Pffft. I'll compress any dang thing I want to"
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same. I'll compress my guitar bus as a whole about 2-3 db with the CLA76. As I add more guitars, I'll eventually need to turn down the compression, though. It gets to around 5-6 db after another set or two has been added... so, something I need to watch out for.

Is listening for phase-issues cheating? I don't use live drums (well, kind of), so what are you supposed to do? Listen in the mix for phase stuff? Is it that apparent in a big mix? I'd think it'd be hard to pin down, no? I don't know.
 
I think it's technique rather than 'cheating'. And all techniques are valid if they deliver satisfactory results.
 
I really wouldn't call any of those things "cheats".

There's a reason consoles have "Solo" buttons...and any kind of "rules" about how you should record or mix are usually broken a thousand times a day across studios worldwide.

Probably one of the reasons I spend more time on the editing chores is because I do "Solo" each and every track, and check for issues and do the housecleaning.
Sure, when you're at the final mixing stage, you can't *mix* while soloing just 1-2 tracks...but there's plenty of reasons why you would want to occasionally Solo things even when mixing.

I think many people are afraid about what they will hear when soloing each track...so they avoid it, and it gets lost in the mix. :p
 
I often solo inputs during tracking to make sure there are no problems that you can't hear with everything up. I do solo during mixing to set a starting point, but the final EQ of each track is done with everything up with a bit of solo just to check.

No rules whatever works for you.

Alan.
 
There are no rules in recording/mixing.

There are typical basic standards that those who have experience already know how to break. It seems many fresh to recording thing think that there is a magic/easy way to get from start to finish. There is no such easy way.

I feel that part of the beauty in the art of recording is that there is no right or wrong. Well, don't clip your guitar input channel at +29 dB and compress it to the point of muff and then... Oh wait, that might be cool... lol!

Do what works, just understand why it doesn't, if in fact it does not work.

To each their own. Only one persons opinion matters in music. The one creating it.

---------- Update ----------

Steenamaroo said:
I get Jimmy to mix it for me. :laughings:
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WTF?! LMAO!
 
Solo hell yes.. for all those various reasons. But I'll def do selected group soloing -kick and bass to sort out low freq questions. Guitars kit and bass, other combos to see where things might be piling up.
Sometimes you just want to highlight, like hear better to sort out all the harmony voices at once.
Maybe in that case it's 'dim everything else -sub groups! :>)
 
It's a basic technique. The mix starts with me soloing the bass and kick, followed by snare. Get those working together. Then add the vocals. Then the rest of the drums, keys, guitars, etc.

If there is lead and harmony vocals, those require a submix to get the right levels and balance. That gets mixed separately, with everything else muted.

Same with any guitar submix, such as doubled rhythms, harmonized leads, etc.
 
I think the big thing to remember about the do's and do not's of listening in solo is EQing. You don't want to EQ in solo because the only reason you should be EQing something is to make it fit in the mix as a whole. It doesn't matter if your Guitars sound "thin" solo'd if they sound amazing in the mix. The big trap people seem to fall into is listening to said Guitars in solo and hearing them sound "thin", so they feel they need to then make them sound "fuller" and so they mess with the EQ some more... and then they ruin their mix. No one says you can't "solo" tracks, in fact it's essential for listening for and fixing mistakes, just don't think that a solo'd instrument that sounds amazing by itself will sound great in a mix and vice versa.
 
Ujn Hunter said:
I think the big thing to remember about the do's and do not's of listening in solo is EQing. You don't want to EQ in solo because the only reason you should be EQing something is to make it fit in the mix as a whole. It doesn't matter if your Guitars sound "thin" solo'd if they sound amazing in the mix. The big trap people seem to fall into is listening to said Guitars in solo and hearing them sound "thin", so they feel they need to then make them sound "fuller" and so they mess with the EQ some more... and then they ruin their mix. No one says you can't "solo" tracks, in fact it's essential for listening for and fixing mistakes, just don't think that a solo'd instrument that sounds amazing by itself will sound great in a mix and vice versa.
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So much truth in that. But then once you get some experience, know what your monitors are telling you, it starts to be a bit different. I will often do some basic eq's on solo'd instruments because I know what I am expecting to hear and do a bit of surgery on them. I never rely on that alone tho, and I see why that messes with people. It messed with me for years....
 
I don't know if this is a "cheat" but I hardly ever record big guitar cabs anymore. I use little ones with 8-10" speakers and tweak the tone, mic's and the guitar to get the "massive" guitar sound. I can get little amps to do almost all the "heavy" lifting these days-though there are times when only a big speaker/cab will do. Also not a cheat but a bit lucky-I just upgraded from 2x 22" displays for my Windows desktop to 2x 27' displays for free, they were going to "recycle" them at my work(meaning trash them). So, of course the two 22's replaced the 17's that are on my old Mac G4 and G5. Score! Is a freebie upgrade a cheat?:rolleyes:
 
andrushkiwt said:
How do you "cheat"?
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I use automixing functions and AI algorithms for EQ matching. I also use visual readouts religiously. On top of that, I'm not embarrassed to say I pull out gimmicky plugins like Waves One Knobers and the JJP vocal processor if I think it'll get the job done. I really don't care how cheesy that is, if my clients are happy I'm happy lol.
 
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