Finally got a bass, woot. But where did the guitars go?

bluesfordan

Member
had an interesting couple of takes the other day. new bass arrived, Squier VM Jazz bass. Immediately tried recording a couple tracks. Going DI with a compressor before the AI, I was getting some righteous bottom. Did a quick dub onto a cassette to listen in my car.

Bass that sounds just like a record, hallelujah. But where did the guitars go? It doesn't seem as simple as turn the guitar tracks up, I don't want to overdrive the overall level.

Do I want to low pass the bass track? I did high pass the guitar tracks around 250-300 Hz to make room for the bass, I just didn't expect them to fade away as much as they did. Is this where EQ and compressor plugins (or hardware if you have it) come into play to help the guitars have focus?

I should mention that I didn't do any panning, these are just "how does it sound" tests.

Sorry if these seem like dumbass questions, I'm in new uncharted waters here and learning to dog paddle.
 
would the smiley curve for bass be pulling the mids down vs raising the lo and hi, right?

Sometimes yes, cut mids up around 1k and the lower mids that guitars dont need and bass does but alot of times it means just boosting the bass around the tonic, second harmonic and then the fret area up around 2k slightly and pulling down wherever the mud is in the 2-400 hz area. It really depends on the arrangement and the genre. I might boost the crap out of 7-800hz if it's a featured bass run in a rock or metal type song, probably less boost and lower or higher for pop. The Pultec style eq bump and mid shift/high shelf are great on bass for just this kind of treatment.

I like to do the "conversation" analogy as in "if the song is the conversation what, as the listener should i paying attention to at this particular moment" . Might be the bass or the guitar or a drum fill then i automate volume, eq, compression, ducking or whatever it takes as the arranger/engineer to make sure the "listener" doesn't struggle know what is the main character at any given moment.

of course, at times you have to think of a song more as say a chord than a conversation when multiple instruments are working together as one "choral/chord" which is the easiest way to think of it for me to balance the eq/volume of each instrument as you would an actual chorus. Like this area is my bass this is my kick this is my guitar, snare, toms, keys equated to bass, baritone, tenor, alto ,soprano, etc.

So basic balance by genre then automate to change the feature from part to part as needed.
 
had an interesting couple of takes the other day. new bass arrived, Squier VM Jazz bass. Immediately tried recording a couple tracks. Going DI with a compressor before the AI, I was getting some righteous bottom. Did a quick dub onto a cassette to listen in my car.

Bass that sounds just like a record, hallelujah. But where did the guitars go? It doesn't seem as simple as turn the guitar tracks up, I don't want to overdrive the overall level.

Do I want to low pass the bass track? I did high pass the guitar tracks around 250-300 Hz to make room for the bass, I just didn't expect them to fade away as much as they did. Is this where EQ and compressor plugins (or hardware if you have it) come into play to help the guitars have focus?

I should mention that I didn't do any panning, these are just "how does it sound" tests.

Sorry if these seem like dumbass questions, I'm in new uncharted waters here and learning to dog paddle.


Start by doing some panning...level balancing...etc.
I wouldn't immediately start with LP/HP filters and EQ right out of the gate.
Finish recording any other tracks...and then try to listen to it as a whole, and not just one track at a time as you did when recording them individually.

With guitars and bass, you will have to eventually do a little separating...but it shouldn't be something crazy unless the guitars have a lot of LF boom.
Always consider the whole mix, and sometimes it takes awhile for that to gel, and for your hearing to adjust to it, rather than always focusing on individual elements, which leads to endless tweaks, because you nudge one track, then you have to go nudge another, then another...and then you're back where you started.
The goal is the mix...not the individual tracks...and sometimes you would think an individual tracks sounds a bit off or even weird on its own...but perfect for the mix.
 
Any idea what the low end of your cassette playback/recording system specs are? Maybe all you are really hearing are the bass harmonics (which would be in the guitar frequency range).
 
had an interesting couple of takes the other day. new bass arrived, Squier VM Jazz bass. Immediately tried recording a couple tracks. Going DI with a compressor before the AI, I was getting some righteous bottom. Did a quick dub onto a cassette to listen in my car.

Bass that sounds just like a record, hallelujah. But where did the guitars go? It doesn't seem as simple as turn the guitar tracks up, I don't want to overdrive the overall level.

Do I want to low pass the bass track? I did high pass the guitar tracks around 250-300 Hz to make room for the bass, I just didn't expect them to fade away as much as they did. Is this where EQ and compressor plugins (or hardware if you have it) come into play to help the guitars have focus? ..

Just to jump in late here with some questions and a wild ass guess'.. Might the previous 'mix and guitar's tones been set without a bass in there?
Now 'eq trimmed to share with the bass, previous tones might not have their old bold tone (..that may have been part of their previous strength?

In any rate, a mix should be worked up so that levels are still well below 'over driving the master bus. This leaves you the headroom while you sort this stuff out and dial the mix in. Then bring it up for the final level. ..And how it then fairs into master limiting or compression if that's the case.
 
Just to jump in late here with some questions and a wild ass guess'.. Might the previous 'mix and guitar's tones been set without a bass in there?
Now 'eq trimmed to share with the bass, previous tones might not have their old bold tone (..that may have been part of their previous strength?

you know, I believe you might be onto something there. Plus I'm so used to hearing only guitars and now I have the bass it's time to rethink my game plan. To the drawing room, Watson, we have much ground to cover, the game is afoot.
 
Bass that sounds just like a record, hallelujah. But where did the guitars go? It doesn't seem as simple as turn the guitar tracks up, I don't want to overdrive the overall level.
Welcome to the world of mixing.

Sit back and relax and use your tools, skills, knowledge and experience(EQ (complimentary EQ Techniques) Reverbs, Effects, pans, mid and side processing and dynamic controlled processing to build a great mix where you can hear each instrument clearly, as you hear it in your head.

FYI, if you lack skills, knowledge and experience, this will come over time
 
you know, I believe you might be onto something there. Plus I'm so used to hearing only guitars and now I have the bass it's time to rethink my game plan. To the drawing room, Watson, we have much ground to cover, the game is afoot.

Cool :>) Forty years in' pays off ever once in a while.. :>)
 
I've been trying to do smiley face and frowny face EQs and not having a lot of luck. In my DAW, I have the option of single band EQ or channel EQ. There's no drawing of any particular EQ curves. Any suggestions? The DAW is Garageband and that's probably the problem right there, isn't it?
 
GarageBand for Mac: Use the EQ effect

I see here there's a channel eq' has all you could need.
Step one is deciding the tone change or problem you are trying to solve.
(Not sure if 'smiley or frown is much of a specific target?

Pick an eq band to address the main tone issue you want to address first. Q' is how wide the curve will be. The picture looks like the low band there can be a Hi Pass (low cut) to trim that end of things.
 
No need to be shy, post your recording in the mp3 clinic (or the “mix this” topic if you just want to hear someone else try) and we can help you out better.
 
Could be the compressor depending on your settings--if you have one on the master out. Bass is a hog. It can trigger that comp if its too aggressive, the comp that is.
 
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