CD Replication

zip said:
Misterqcue...

It called an accelerated stability program. We used them at my old job all the time to check the stability of hair care products.

Basically the products are put in a series of controlled environment constant temperature/humidity rooms. Not sure what they do for discs but for our products the temperatures ranged from 5C to 49C with an ambient control. Other samples were put in high and normal humidity rooms to simulate humidity conditions.

Over a period of years products are pulled out of the rooms and checked against standards for various attributes vs control products. After all the data is collected it is evaluated for differences via mathmatical calculations and the shelf life is predicted. This method is "industry standard" and is amazingly accurate.

Aren't you glad you asked?? :p :D

zip >>
Click to expand...

Like they say, you learn sumthin' new everyday!! Thx
 
"Why is a commerically burned CD more robust than a computer-burned CD?"

A commercial CD is more robust because it is pressed into a metal foil - not burned. It's then covered in plastic...which is why it is more scratch resistant. A CDR on the other hand is created when the laser melts a dye layer...which is not resistent to scratches. In addition the dye layer is more suseptible to burning errors as well as changes from excessive heat, cold and sunlight.

MQ....

Happy to share my very tiny little piece of expertise with the board... :D

zip >>
 
Check out http://www.discmakers.com

We have one of those stores down here in Puerto Rico, and they do runs of 300 CDs. I haven't checked the prices, but most bands over here use it (maybe becuase they are the only one down here), but everyone says they are very profesional.
 
In the past few years I've sold a fair amount of CD-R's of my own work and lately a lot of short run orders for others in my area that want a whole package, which includes printing directly to the media, layouts, artwork, graphics, shrinkwrapping, etc. After the price for recording, mastering, and graphics is settled on I usually charge $5 a copy up to 50 and $4 thereafter. Hopefully they only want 10 or 20 or so cause it gets to be like arts and crafts and not music. The point is is that I don't want them coming back.

Before I started doing this I studied the process of CD's and CD-R's as much as I could and was suprised by what I'd found. First, CD's are not the great replacement for tape and records I thought they were. Under normal conditions you can expect a properly manufactured CD to begin to have read errors in about 20 years. Premium CD-R's on the other hand can last 100's of years (Mitsui claims 300 years for it's gold media) by comparison. With the cheap stuff you can expect 5 years or so. You get what you pay for. I think it's CD-Recordable (a US manufacturer) that has a very informative site worth looking into.

Zip makes this comment:
"A commercial CD is more robust because it is pressed into a metal foil - not burned. It's then covered in plastic...which is why it is more scratch resistant. A CDR on the other hand is created when the laser melts a dye layer...which is not resistent to scratches. In addition the dye layer is more suseptible to burning errors as well as changes from excessive heat, cold and sunlight. "

The metal foil is aluminum in an organic material and coated with plastic and it is less resistant to scratches and direct sunlight. But the aluminum relaxes over time.

Then there's the whole red book and orange book and orange book II thing, and TAO and DAO, and it's late.
 
Philboyd...

I didn't know about the foil relaxing. I learn something new everyday. :)

When I said more robust I was talking about the rigors of wear over time. Sure a Mitsui Gold will last 300 years as proven by accelerated stability but that's it you don't touch it - AT ALL!

I love Mitsuis' but even with the most careful handling I start to see scratches after about a year of heavy play. One thing I can say about em' is they seem more scratch resistant than most CDR's I have tried...

zip >>
 
I was rather miffed too at hearing CDs don't last, but it's more like minor read errors that are often corrected in the reading process. I have noticed a few 20 year old CDs that just don't play right and it's not from handling.

Another strange thing I heard was that in equtorial rain forests they get a fungus that eventually gets into their CD's and goes after the organic materials. Shouda saved that info, it was pretty weird.
 
Maybeeeeeeee.....

.....It's part of the GREENING process....:D:D

(I donno if you were around for that post!)

I guess the moral of the story is nothing lasts forever..............

lata...

zip >>
 
I run a small record label, and I have this to say about CD duplication.

DO NOT PAY OVER $1000 FOR A 1000 CDS! (and that includes the printing costs)

If you just want bulk CDs you can get them for about $350 for 500 from www.dualplover.com, or $460 for 1000 from a place called Mob CD Replication.

I have gotten CDs duplicated from three different factories, and the sound quality from all three was indistinguisable from the masters. In other words, in my experience, sound quality is equally good every place you go, so just go for the best deal.

And another thing, Diskmakers are so f@#*in' overpriced, it's a wonder they haven't gone down in a series of accounting scandals. I would never, ever recommend going with them, unless you want to pay twice as much for no real reason.

www.cdman.com is a good canadian company. Their service is top notch. Haven't used Mob CD yet, so I can't vouch for their service. Dual Plover is cheap, but their service is less than exquisite. For the deal they gave me, though, I was willing to put up with their confusing emails and unhelpful website.

Anyway, that's my CD replication ramble. Hoped it helped some of you.
 
Re: Re: Well...

MISTERQCUE said:
how does any-1 know if Mitsui
c/d's last for 100 years when the c/d rec'ing process is only been out, what 30-35 years!!?? Just curious! [/B]
Click to expand...

Thank God! This means there is a chance I can still listen to my Britney records when I'm 150!!!
 
Either that, or the cds could get buried and perfectly preserved for a long period of time in which the fall of man occurs, and the cds are recovered by the apes and they play Britney Spears and say, "Ahhh, so THAT'S why they didn't survive."
 
sjoko....

You would waste a Mitsui on Britneys' music???

Shame shame...;) LOL

Maybe on naked Britney pics but...........
 
Let me share some info on good CD duplication places i have found.



Best prices for printing of CD inserts and tray cards:

http://www.amtechdisc.com/

I have also found them to have excellent customer service.


Best Price and quality for CD duplication -

http://www.cdsonic.com/

They also have flexible packages - you can get anything from raw CDs on a spindle to full shrink wrapped package. They also have an option where they will assemble the CDs with inserts and traycards provided by you.


A good part of the cost of printing art work is in the creation of film negatives from your graphic files. It's a one time cost though.
 
CD replication with perks

Oasis is the ticket for sure. Discmakers is also very
good. The great thing about using one of these
companies is these perks:

- Marketing through Amazon.com and Orchard
- They send one of your songs to many college radio stations.
- Free UPC code
- Spline sticker tape
- Graphics that can't be beat



:)
 
Chuck, I'm sorry to dissillusion you, but if you think Oasis is going to help you sell CDs, you're horribly mistaken. #1 - No radio station with any kind of listener base is going to give airplay to music from an Oasis sampler. #2 - anyone can get distribution on amazon. This won't help you one bit unless you are getting some kind of promotion. The barcode many places offer (including cdsonic). Finaly, their prices aren't competetive when you consider that the package prices they list do not include the cost of film processing (add at least $200-$300).

Oasis tries to lure people in with the promise of distribution and promotion - this is a publicity stunt - there is no value in what they offer. (Also I seem to recall something about them forcing you to put their logo on your CD)

As far of as their graphics, I'm not sure what you mean. They ask that you provide the design and they charge $75/hr for any additional graphic design work they have to do.
 
http://www.iloveimprint.com/

http://www.iloveimprint.com/

Great prices.

just a sneak peak:

1000 CD's
includes three colors screened on cd
includes glass mastering
65 cents each


that is JUST CD's - they also have packages where they will print full color inserts, and shrink rap with hard cases, etc. check out the website its all pretty much self-explanitory.
 
Hi bdemenil,

Thanks for your reply above. I used
Dismakers on my first project, and was
very pleased with much of what they
did for me. I would not have known
about Amazon, unless they told me.
They don't directly sell CDs for us, no,
they provide marketing avenues for us
to pursue.

The college radio stations don't have a big
listener base, but it is a start, something
the large FM stations rarely give independents.

Something else that many people don't know
about the smaller duplicators - they often don't
tell you your getting CDRs, instead of commercial
CDs. There is nothing cheaper than that kind
of product. I can make CDRs in my own
studio.

And finally, Oasis and Dismakers are a higher in
cost. Quality always costs more. I've seen what
other companies have done to musician friends,
and it really has taught me to stick with those
who have the reputation.

One last example - There is a well know Jazz
band in Pittsburgh Pa named "Trio Grande".
They ordered 5000 CDs from Dismakers. Well,
a popping noise appeared in one of the tracks.
Discmakers checked the master for the noise.
It wasn't there. They realized it was their
mistake. They replaced all 5000 CDs, no questions
asked. You just don't have that guarentee
from these other companies.


Thanks again for your reply.

Chuck:)
 
They replaced all 5000 CDs, no questions asked. You just don't have that guarentee from these other companies.
Click to expand...
You're joking, right? You really think that you have to pay triple to get a guarantee? CDman has a warantee on their work, and you pay about half as much as discmakers. Every company I've ever worked with has a guarantee. Discmakers have duped hardworking bands into believing that the only way to get good sounding CDs with good customer service is to pay them through the nose for it. It's insane. :mad:

DOWN WITH DISCMAKERS!!!!!!!
 
As I said before - check out http://www.cdsonic.com - their prices are better than all above mentioned (1000 bulk CDs - 4Color - glass master - $0.58 per CD) . Their quality is good. Their packages are flexible. Same garantees as anywhere else.

Duplicaters will always specify if they are giving you CDR or real CD. You might want to look into CDR if you are doing a small run (like 50 or 100). Earlier in the thread I posted a good company for doing small CDR runs - http://www.globaldisc.com

Finaly, I have worked at college radio stations, and can tell you that if they have any kind of quality and listenership, they are never going to pay attention to an Oasis sampler. As their is no quality control over what makes it onto an Oasis sampler, no one is going to bother to listen to it to see if perhaps, by some miracle, there is a good song on it.

Besides, college radio stations - in general - are much more comercial than you might imagine. Many DJs do not actually have much latitude over what music they can play - especially in the Rock genre.
 
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