Bass guitar consistency

While riding this will do the job, because it would be a lot of work in this arrangement, I would recommend a limiter instead as in this vid
YouTube
 
Hi Folks,
Have a listen to this bass guitar, the second 2 notes of each pattern is just getting lost in the mix.
I've tried compression and a dynamic eq but cant get the consistency I need.
Any advice please?
What are your compression settings on bass and on the the rest of the mix? Let the bass come through with a slower attack - add a second compressor or limiter if you're trying to even out the performance (or redo the track if possible).

If you're compressing *everything* you're also going to make it hard for things to get through, and make sure you're high-passing all but the bass and kick, so there's not other stuff (you might not even recognize as being there) causing later compression (like mix bus if you have that as well) push down the bass.
 
There's also manual editing...just go in slice things up and adjust as needed.
It sound like a "LOT of work!!!"...but really, it's not once you get comfortable with the whole process, and then it's just assembly line work.

IMO, it's good to get good at manual editing for a lot of things, rather than always just depending on some processing engaged across the entire track.
You always have that option anyway, but sometimes you can better get what you want with editing or a combination of some editing and then milder processing across the whole track.
 
First up it's the playing and the actual bass / strings / setup. I can hear by the playing you are hammering the first 2 notes then because of the second 2 note positions you can't hit it so hard.

If it's too late for that its all in compression, you need the right settings. Maybe try a faster attack and release. Smash the ratio and see if it works for you. The video using a limiter is a good suggestion also.

Alan.
 
I'm a bass player, and I doubt I could play it with the second note the same as the first, because of the tempo and the style, and the fact that I'm human and musical. I'm not a machine - perhaps the solution is to replace the bass player with a sample or synth and go back to the 80s? If you need consistency for the music you want to produce, then source an alternative. I don't think what you want is really a bass guitar played by a bass player, but a sequenced, accurate, repeatable attack sequenced track. Maybe even sample the first notes and dump the second ones, or cut out the seconds, and copy and paste the firsts. Rather like asking a guitarist to up strum exactly the same volume as the down strum, or play the down strum twice as fast. Real instruments and players have limits, but if technology can fix them, that's OK with me.
 
Hi Rob, there is more constancy to a decent bass player than a guitar player in that respect.
I'm looking for groove not machine, something like this.

YouTube
 
Thanks Guys, all good suggestion a few of which I've implemented.
I still feel there are notes popping out, especially the A.
....
I could play it again (I'm no bass player)
Well, at this point, I'd simply start automating the fader on that track if you're down to a few spots but otherwise feel like you're in the right spot.

Re-recording the bass track is good practice, too :)
 
Oh my, if the bass track can't be made to sound good with EQ and compression then there is something fundamentally wrong with it, Playing / actual bass / etc. How about strings, is the notes going missing played on a dead string.

OK how about this, if there are a note or 2 popping out, try using side chain compression, similar to a de-essor but with the frequencies selected for the notes that POP out. I have even used a multi-band compressor for this, selecting higher compression where the notes are jumping out, and less compression where the notes are lost.


Alan.
 
Hi Alan,
How do you use side chain compression on a bass sidechaining itself?
Thanks

I don't quite understand the question.

What I mean by side chain is that on some compressors you can select which frequencies the compressor responds to. For example in the analog world some compressors had an insert that you would plug an eq into, then you cut everything but what you wanted the compressor to compress. A de-esser acts the same way, the de-esser is in fact a limiter that only acts on selected frequencies.

As I was typing I thought that the easiest way to do this in software is to use a multi-band compressor and to by pass frequencies that you did not want compressed, or in other words compress the loud notes so that the soft notes appear louder. If you do have a software compressor that has a EQ side-chain option then use that.

Alan.

Found this.
 
Last edited:
I listened to the original again - and the actual level difference between the notes in the repeated riff are negligible, but the tone changes slightly between them, so I then discovered on Soundcloud the mix that I'd not heard - I do not think compression is going to work because the dynamics are actually quite narrow. I'd be thinking about some eq up top because there are HF percussive elements to the sound. Nails on some I suspect, fingers on the others, and the finger ones are the ones slightly lacking. I'd probably drop the level of the fundamentals a bit and bring up the harmonics. I don't think I'd waste any time on compression.
 
Alan, I get it now, I misinterpreted what you were saying.

Rob, absolutely, the problem is more to do with tone than volume.
I've approached it by trying to very narrowly eq the tones that are pushing out but even with a narrow Q it appears to affect other notes and therefore doesn't solve anything. I'm interested in the harmonic approach you mentioned, Could you expand on that a bit?
Thanks.
 
Actually you could try my other trick, you reduce the low end from the low mid down, try 200 to 250 first, and evenly not shelf, by a few dB then turn up the bass volume then compress. This stops the low frequencies hitting the compression hard and lets the compressor work better on all notes. By lifting the volume the bass is still there.

Often when you compress bass the low end increases anyway, or rather the preseption of the low end increases.

Alan
 
Are you rcording direct? Because its true the playing could be better but its also common with the bass to have notes get lost due to freq cancelling. Then harmonic notes like A and E with bloom. Trying playing the problem notes in a different spot. But if you really want to keep this (?) Copy the track and fix it so all the problem notes are doubled.
 
I think the main problem is in bass guitar (dead notes), partly maybe in a bass player. Some rare case it can be loudspeaker / enclosure / room - only if you are recording using a microphone(s). Check phasing / polarity if you are using more as one microphone, or microphone + direct line out (or direct-box).

If the bass guitar has dead notes - nothing can help (compression etc.), it provides spectrally different sound, less volume, less sustain, less attack, less pressure, less punch, added wrong harmonics, "wolf" tones etc. It simply sounds different and wrong. Reasons of such dead notes most case are hidden in the bridge plate's fastening to body. Especially in case of Fender type bridges. If strings / saddles / bridge-base have lost or weak direct contact with body (saddles through bridge base) such problem is warranted. Most case problem is hidden in overtightened bridge to body behind the saddles ANCHOR screws. It is a little bit different if strings are going through the body or just through the bridge, but results are similar. Release these anchor screws a little bit and check sound then. Can be better or different. The best is to add bridge plate to body screws directly UNDER saddles, in between (in the mid) height adjustment screws of approximately adjusted for octave intonation saddles. One screw per saddle/string. Use flat countersink head, stainless steel, approx 25mm x 3mm screws for it. Use reasonable medium tension for tightening them. Rear ANCHOR screws must be just lightly tightened, never tighten them too strong! This problem can persist even if the bridge plate is additionally screwed to body before the saddles. Do not tighten them to strong too. Bridge base can be deformed up just a little bit - but it is enough for lost or weak plate contact with body directly under the saddles! Please read one more time now - from the beginning - to understand all this "mechanics" :).
 
zeplan59 What is wrong with the bass playing? (serious question so I can improve)
It was recorded through a Kemper amp using a Fender jaguar bass.
How does the "Copy the track and fix it so all the problem notes are doubled" thing work?
Thanks.
 
If you look for the fundamental note area from the guitar - find it, but don't boost it. Lets say most of the energy is between 60 and 350Hz, then try boosting at around 700, and/or 1400. This picks out the harmonics and they often cut through much cleaner than boosting the fundamental low note. You might have to then use a HF roll off to stop the tinny noises right up top, but it can really help.
 
Back
Top