DAW to Tape to DAW

J

joko38

New member
Hi,

Just wondering if there is any benefit to doing this for my songs.

I have mixed a bunch of songs and would like to give them that 80's touch that I've read, tape provided to songs. Natural compression.... Hiss.... Warmth... ect....

I'm not a pro at this so I'm just repeating what I've read.

Anyway would it be beneficial to run my songs from my DAW, into my Tascam 246 at high speed to tape, then back in to my DAW.

Just wondering if it's worth the experiment or if this is a waste of time. Trying to get all the benefits that tape has to offer if any, based on what I read on the web.

Looking for some expert advise.

Thanks.
 
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joko38 said:
Just wondering if it's worth the experiment or if this is a waste of time.
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Both.

The "tape" that "they" refer to (which pre-dates the 80s by a longshot, BTW) isn't just any old tape. They're talking about pro machines by Sony, Studer, etc. that uses tape with professional formulations that range in size from 1/2" to 2" in width.

Going from the Big Boy's stuff to a portable cassette deck - even a double-speed Tascam - is kind of like going from a network broadcast HD TV clip to a cell phone video; they're both digital video, and you can get useful stuff off the cell phone, but the quality and qualities between the two are of a completely different scale.

Add to that, "that sound" of high quality tape usage doesn't come from taking a mixdown and bouncing it to tape, it comes from tracking to tape from the beginning and using tape throughout the process.

In summary, you can't expect to get "that sound" by bouncing to a Portastudio. That, however should not stop you from experimenting and giving it a try. You never know what else you might learn from the exercise, and while you might not get *that* sound, you might find something else along the way that you do like. You never know unless you try.

G.
 
Glen,

I appreciate your time answering my question. Might I as what experiments you suggest?

Thanks.
 
Nothing specific. I'm just saying to play around with it on some nice rainy afternoon when it's a choice between doing that or messing around on Facebook. The best learning sometimes is in what you unexpectedly find and not what you specificly set out to look for.

Who knows? You might find a sound that you find useful for some situations. Or you might not. Either way, you'll come out better off than you were before you tried it.

G.
 
I mixdown to tape (not just bouncing a finished mix) and then go right off the PB head back to the DAW...but I'm using a pretty decent 2-track open reel deck with quality front-end electrocn ics, and good tape, running at 15 ips.

A cassette deck is mainly going to add some of the hiss you mentioned, and take out whatever upper-end clarity you had.
If you want to try it...go for it...but don't expect it to really improve things....it will jut sound different, and maybe "Lo-Fi" if that's what you are after.
 
SouthSIDE Glen said:
Both.

The "tape" that "they" refer to (are) pro machines by Sony, Studer, etc. that uses tape with professional formulations that range in size from 1/2" to 2" in width...

...you can't expect to get "that sound" by bouncing to a Portastudio.
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I recognize that as a true statment- edited so I can bring up a point of discussion:

Where are "places" in this tape width/machine quality continuum like the Sweet Spot, the point of diminishing returns (on the high end,) the point where quality is so low it's not worth the trouble? I know it will differ- lots of variables- but I think the point is good discussion fodder
 
I'm not sure how to answer that in terms that don't reflect one's budget. The largest machines are undoubtedly the best when maintained and calibrated properly. Whether one considers having to spend a couple of hundred dollars per tape as a diminished ROI depends upon who's doing the asking. Obviously for the average college HRer who has a hard enough time affording a couple hundred bucks for a single microphone, spending that much for one session tape is outrageous. Then again, back when I had my Teac 3340 and Pioneer RT 1020L, which used only 1/4" tape, a 10" reel of Maxell tape cost about $20 give or take (back in the 80s), which seemed like an awful lot at the time also. If one was just playing around, going out and buying a new tape for $20 was hard to justify.

But OTOH, if one is taking the care to use a studio and producer that they are already spending good money to rent, and the place has a nice 2" Studer deck surrounded by a desk and such of similar quality, it'd be kind of silly not to pony up for a session tape and get the most out of the situation.

As far as the in-between stuff like a 1/4'" or 1/2" multitrack, I'd probably put that in the "prosumer" range (though I'd shy away from more than 4 tracks on a 1/4"). Capable of producing pretty decent quality in good hands; not the same as the big boys by a long shot, but, with a quality, well-maintained deck, possible to get a somewhat distinct analog feel.

Cassette I honestly see little reason for these days, to be honest. I'm not being a snob; I started out with a friend's original model Portastudio, and also owned one myself for a while in the late 80s-early 90s as a nice portable sketch/scratch device. But in these days of thumb drives and flash memory and whatnot, a cassette is a rather obsolete and clunky medium which provides very little, if any, benefit sound-wise (unless, like miro said, you're going for a specific effect.)

The one exception I might make with cassette portastudios versus solid state portastudios is that there may still be some bargain solid-state devices who have some pretty cheezy-sounding A/D converters on them, in which case it may actually be an advantage to stay with the cassette just to avoid the converters.

IMHO YMMV ESDA ISBN ETC

G.
 
SouthSIDE Glen said:
I'm not sure how to answer that in terms that don't reflect one's budget.
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:)

Right.

Whenever people ask about "best this" or "best that" on typical home/project forums...even if they don't mention $$$, that's always the key factor in their question. ;)

I mean...if it as a pure "what's best" question...it would rarely end up being something other then the top-of-the-line gear and usually the most costliest....which tends to put off most home-rec types (some even get pissed that you brought up high-end, expensive gear). :D

So...you have to always frame the question properly when looking for the "best" in a given situation.

AFA tape decks...I don't think there's anyone on the planet that wouldn't say Studer decks are the cream of the crop.
Thing is...these days there's more to it than just brand name, seeing how there are no new tape decks to pick from, with the exception of Otari's last/final 5050 BIII 2-track (and just so happens the one I own).
When you consider a tape deck these days, the brand name is one thing...but the actual condition and functionality may be what really dictates which is "best" in a given situation.
 
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