Looking for a USB Audio Interface for Windows under $1,000

BoneDigger

New member
I am currently using a 1st Generation Focusrite Scarlett 18i8. I generally get pretty good recordings with it, but I have some extra money and would like to invest in a better USB interface. I have considered the RME Babyface but I don't really need portability. I just want a good desktop USB interface. I am using a pretty good desktop computer and my room treatment is good. I don't really have any latency issues with the Scarlett. Like I said earlier, the recordings from the Scarlett aren't horrible, but I think I can do better.

So, given the above, what would you recommend?
 
"So, given the above, what would you recommend? "

Honestly? Better monitors (and then more room treatment) unless you have already spent $3k+ on a pair (AND they are PMC or Adam, or Neumann or one of only a VERY select handful of makers of accurate monitors) !!

Get me not wrongly! The Baby Face is a super bit of kit as is all the RME range and I would be the first to tell you to go RME if you wanted THE lowest latency and THE best support and future proofing but. I think most "in the business" would agree that the Focusrite preamps and converters give little or nothing away to RME? That is, both are excellent.

IMHO you would have to move up to Hilo/Prism/Benchmark gear to get a PAPER specc' better than your F'rite and even then I doubt you could hear the difference (especially if you DON'T have impeccable monitoring!) but even 2 in 2 out would cost $1000+ and more channels functioning limbs.

Post some of you best work and let the Top Blokes here have a harken. If guys like Massive M tell you to get a new AI, get one. Not going to happen IMHO.

Yes, we's all seduced by the Shiny and New but you must resist unless you can make a good case for it.

(BTW. YOU do as you like in your own gaff but I shall keep my kit on of you don't mind!)

Dave.
 
Just thought. Simple test that might demonstrate shortcomings in present monitors?

Set up for a normal session and play a track at your calibrated level*. Now turn the AI's output to zero. Can you hear any noise, hiss from the monitors? If so, pull the XLRs/jacks out of the monitors and listen again. Still a faint hiss? Note you might have to sit quietly for some minutes for ears to recover from the music and of course you need a very quiet room/time.

I will bet your monitors do NOT have subjectively zero self noise and therefore THEY are the limiting factor in the whole output chain. NO MATTER how good the mic amps or converters be, your monitors are deciding the replay noise floor.

Ok, VERY stringent test and most of us most of the time have noisier surroundings than even modest monitors "pollute" but do you see my point? You are looking at a very tiny improvement in something that may not matter or even be discernible?

*Monitors NOT calibrated? For shame! Do that before anything else!

Dave.
 
Thanks for the great reply! My monitors are Yamaha HS8s. I know there are much better on the market, but these seem to work fairly well for me. I do have my room treated and it seems to be pretty good, at least to my novice ears.

Below is a link to some of my songs. It's an ecclectic mix of music. The first one I tried to record to sound 50s, so it probably isn't the best example, but the next few are okay. After about 5 or 6 songs you start getting into my older stuff and it is noticably worse, but all of it is with the Scarlett.

https://www.mcmakinmusic.com/all-songs
 
I had a quick listen to some of the songs and I think you are doing fine with your existing audio interface.

The biggest issues I heard were some slightly odd panning in most of the songs - I wonder whether your studio might be a bit lop-sided? I would also say that there were mixing issues with most of the songs - one had the vocals obviously ducking everything else while another simply had the vocals far too loud. This leads me to think that you either need to work on your monitoring/room treatment a bit more so that you can hear the issues or, if you've already noticed them, you just need a little more mixing practice. Maybe it would be worth posting some mixes up for comment?
 
There you go, James has given you some very constructive advice and, if I might comment on that slightly?

"Panning/ placement" issues. The HS7/8 is not THE lowest cost monitoring system out there and I don't think James is saying it is at all bad but it is a fact that as you go up in monitor quality, greater attention is paid to things like L/R driver matching and treble dispersion, all things that affect stereo imaging.

Again, if I might paraphrase James? "You are doing well and a even a $10,000 interface would not let you do better"

I will say again, get those monitors calibrated so you come to them each time with consistent levels. Never know that could throw up the reason for the imbalance James spoke of?

I will have a listen to your stuff later but I am NO judge! I don't have a proper studio and am very deaf. I am a retired electronics tech with a lifelong interest in music and recording/repro.

Dave.
 
Thanks guys! As for panning issues, I think my monitor calibration is off. I've tried working through that with the Scarlett Mixcrontrol and I'm not getting much good results. I'm going to try downloading a DB meter and delve into this in more detail. I have noticed that if I set my recording to stereo,one side is always louder and I have to manually try to adjust it to something more even in the DAW. If I can figure out the calibration issue, I think it would help immensely.

My mixing skills still need a lot of work. I think using a reference track might prove very beneficial for me but I've not done so yet. That'll be my next step.

I've got my HS set up about as good as I can right now, so I'm trying to train myself to overcome any issues that still remain. The studio monitors generally get good reviews, though I agree that a nicer set might make it easier to mix.
 
Calibrating Your Monitoring Chain | Blog | The Rants and Ravings of an Audio Mastering Engineer

I do not condemn the Yamahas. The start of this thread was about spending money on a new "better" interface. IMHO that is not needed and would deliver marginal improvements if any at all. What I went on to say was, IF you have money to spend on your recording "system" put it into the "back end". Monitoring and room. I did not know the speakers when I said that but now I would say you are unlikely to make a big improvement on the HS7s unless you spend many times their £400 ish cost. Others may have a different view.

Regarding your balance problem? Tackly it systematically. First job: swap the speakers around.

Dave.
 
Yo Tod Good thread...cool responses

At all levels of ability try and avoid "GAS" GEAR ACQUISITION SYNDROME.. Use it up, wear it out, make due or do without...that simple

Recording can be tedious work and needing to get some better equipment is a great excuse not to press record and just work with what you've got...Though a pristine well mixed and mastered recording is really a super cool thing, the absolute best of best recording, mix and master of a shit song gives you nothing more than a a really awesome recording of a shit song. Certainly the majority of folks here at HR.com are musicians trying to get their tunes recorded at home rather than a studio and it is always because of funding and the time required. With an average 2018 computer and less than $1000 in equipment we can have a home studio capable of producing a product superior to most mega dollar studios of the 70's. If you have written a really fantastic song and it is recorded as well as you have recorded the songs in your collection it is absolutely good enough to get the attention of the average listener and record labels.

All of us would love to have one or several of our songs put us on the map as a REAL Professional songwriter, or performer or singer or whatever but the truth is it is but by the grace of God and shit load of hard work and luck that such a thing will happen.

From an input and recording quality perspective your stuff is really good as it is and as someone else noted, $10K in more investment isn't going to make it that much better. You definitely can work on your mixing and some of your singing is great some is a little off...For sure if I was sitting at a pub listening to you I'd be enjoying it...it's good stuff. It is a lot easier to buy equipment than posting your tunes for others to examine and nit pick...my advice is don't worry about improving your equipment it is "good enough" go spend some time at the MP3 clinic and take a horse whipping there. Remember opinions are like assholes, everybody's got one and they all stink...You may get some criticism that is erroneous but for sure you'll get some that is really helpful and that is what the clinic is about...spend time not money and keep em coming! :guitar:
 
Great responses guys and very helpful! I'd like to point out that in the group of songs on my website that I posted to, I wouldn't worry with anything past the 6th song. I need to delete the rest and redo them. Most of those were done in the distant past with a different recording setup and different environment/room. Also,my mixes on those are way off, including mixing in vocals.

I've gained some great input so far and definitely have some homework to do.
 
One other thought - do you have any headphones? Checking your mixes on headphones would be a good way to gain a different perspective on how they sound and may help with the panning issues (provided your hearing is balanced). I was listening to your work on a pair of Sennheiser HD25's which are great for all kinds of uses.
 
Actually, yes, I usually listen on multiple sources, including a Sennheiser pair. That's where I first identified the panning issues. The headphones really bring that issue into focus. I need to figure out what the issue is with the panning.

If I have the panning slide set at dead center, it has an obvious left bias, so I have to slide it slightly right to even it out. If I could figure out the issue with the setup, it would help immensely but the Focusrite software is a bit tedious.
 
...I have noticed that if I set my recording to stereo,one side is always louder and I have to manually try to adjust it to something more even in the DAW. If I can figure out the calibration issue, I think it would help immensely...

It may be that when you set your recording to stereo (when you record the track), it's routing
the input to either LEFT or RIGHT, depending which input channel you've selected. Recording
MONO would set it in the center, allowing the pan knob to operate as it should. Just a WAG.
 
"Focusrite software is a bit tedious. " Have you got the generation 2 software? Apparently it is less "dense" then the G1 and works for some G1 hardware. But.

Where is the pan control for a commercial CD and not running the software? On cans then speakers. Then copy the CD to a track and play that out.

And Google for Massive Mastering's blog on calibration. I found it yesterday but for some reason this post did not "post".

Dave.
 
i am very fond of my MOTU 828 mk3... it can be hooked up both USB or Firewire 800...plus if you need more than the 8 channels it has 2 ADAT ins for additonal 8 channel preamps to give you a total of 24 channels ... i am using it with Windows 7 Proffesional on a quad core 3.2 w/8gig ramm with great success still using SONAR 8.5 Producer... i will eventually get another DAW ( either presonus Studio One Pro or Digital Performer )but SONAR still works. :guitar:
 
i am very fond of my MOTU 828 mk3... it can be hooked up both USB or Firewire 800...plus if you need more than the 8 channels it has 2 ADAT ins for additonal 8 channel preamps to give you a total of 24 channels ... i am using it with Windows 7 Proffesional on a quad core 3.2 w/8gig ramm with great success still using SONAR 8.5 Producer... i will eventually get another DAW ( either presonus Studio One Pro or Digital Performer )but SONAR still works. :guitar:

Yes, MOTU seem to be the "Marmite" of the upper end of AIs? Some folks love 'em and they work very well. Then you read of incompatibilities and reliability issues (but in truth I dare say no more than most other AIs?)

When I began my interest in computer audio, well over 12 years ago, the name "MOTU" was just on a page in a magazine and all my attempts to get a user manual, even a specc' sheet failed. "Snotty bastards" I thought! The gear was also very rarely reviewed? All that seems to have changed and the company are now IMHO, up there with the top end F'rites, Presonus, Audient and others. Not quite in my view scaled the RME cliff!

Dave.
 
I have no problems with drivers from Focusrite, Presonus, Motu or most of the others.

It's the support that's different. Focusrite gets good points from me cause their support is in-house. MOTU gets good points for a fixed repair price. You can send any MOTU interface back and get a recycled one for 175 € (for the 828 IIRC).

I don't know why Presonus is often considered a bit less. Is it because they are not as expensive? Their hardware is solid, drivers are good.

If you want the most stability possible, go RME. None of the others are comparable. RME even develops their own USB ports, right inside the FPGA that handles the interface. Up to 60 I/O over USB2.

The one company I don't like for their drivers, is Tascam. Good hardware, nice price and if you're lucky, they'll provide updates. Lucky means you got one of their best selling interfaces. Maybe it's understandable as they don't develop the driver in-house.

And the one company I don't like for support, is Steinberg. Hard to reach, hard to get straight answers. I really hate to get the runaround. "We'll call back". Yeah, were have I heard that before?
 
I have no problems with drivers from Focusrite, Presonus, Motu or most of the others.

It's the support that's different. Focusrite gets good points from me cause their support is in-house. MOTU gets good points for a fixed repair price. You can send any MOTU interface back and get a recycled one for 175 € (for the 828 IIRC).

I don't know why Presonus is often considered a bit less. Is it because they are not as expensive? Their hardware is solid, drivers are good.

If you want the most stability possible, go RME. None of the others are comparable. RME even develops their own USB ports, right inside the FPGA that handles the interface. Up to 60 I/O over USB2.

The one company I don't like for their drivers, is Tascam. Good hardware, nice price and if you're lucky, they'll provide updates. Lucky means you got one of their best selling interfaces. Maybe it's understandable as they don't develop the driver in-house.

And the one company I don't like for support, is Steinberg. Hard to reach, hard to get straight answers. I really hate to get the runaround. "We'll call back". Yeah, were have I heard that before?

Nice to hear MOTU have a "service exchange" fixed price policy. I am of the opinion that this sort of idea should be made EU law? Almost nobody fixes stuff anymore and lot of stuff is very hard to fix. SMT does not help but schematics are withheld and spares are hard to source.

Anyone catch the news today? We are running out of planet and time. We HAVE to stop making so much shit and FIX the good stuff we already have AND design gear and systems that can KEEP it going for decades at a time.

Steinberg are Yamaha. Might be worth a "back door" approach?

Dave.
 
So, aside from the drivers and their stability, is there any real difference in the CLARITY of the recordings from the major manufacturers? If you were to compare a recording from the Scarlett to that of the MOTU or RME interfaces, would the latter two provide a clearer, better recording? Or, are they all generally about the same? This is assuming that you were using the same room treatment and same microphones.
 
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