TSR 8 studio?

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don'tkill kenny

New member
I'm new. Don't kill me. I just bought a Yamaha aw16g digital studio in a box and after studying the manual and turning it on and having it jam up on me after 2 minutes I'm thinking of ditching this thing and going instead with a TSR 8 which I talked myself out of in the first place. I have a Mackie cr1604 vlz and some mic's-Studio projects c1, senhieser condensors, d-112, a couple 57's and 58's-the usual suspects. I have a rock trio that doesn't really need more than 8 tracks (famous last words) and am wondering if this is enough to get me going in a better direction (talk me into it). I wanted a do-all that I could write songs on with the aid of a built in drum looper and blah blah blah, but I'm thinking maybe just a good drum machine (suggestions?)and the TSR would feel more like making music somehow. I was reading about inexpensive mic pre's here and most guys seem to think that the Mackies Mic pre's are already comparable to anything else that I could afford. Any suggestions are welcome as I am just a guitar nerd who can barely hook up my own damn stuff. I would need a pretty long snake to reach the basement where the drums sound best also. I am thinking I would eventually get somekind of Mac and Pro Tools set up and track with the TSR and then bounce in to the Mac for saving tape while writing and getting the benefits of being able to send tracks off to our producer who has all the "real" stuff--half inch Studer,Manley tube pre's and La2a's etc. to mix on. What thinkest you of this half baked plan and have you any priceless information and/or sweet ass tips for me oh noble dungeon masters of the knobs and sliders?
 
I dont think you are going to get too many people on this forum to argue with you on which way to go. I have been down the digital route and it was not pretty just fustrating and expensive.
I wont sit here and tell you that there are not draw backs to analoge but for me when i did come back to it, everything just made sense and was alot more fun.
 
We all think we need a longer snake, for one reason or another!

Yeah, that 2-min/lockup is very discouraging, when you've just gotten your new $1000 toy out of the box.

I'm not intimately familiar with all the bells & whistles of the AW16G, but I'm no big fan of the all-digi-LCD-menu-driven-type units, and therefore, am not inclined to recommend them.

The TSR-8 is simple, easy to use, and by all accounts, sounds great. It's good enough for hifi home recordings and most demo recording I can think of.

A separate drum machine is often useful, and I see no reason why it has to be integrated into the recording unit. That integrated design is just indicative of the faddish me-too-ism in the recording industry.;)
 
The TSR-8 is an outstanding machine. As you probably know you can get a used one for half as much as your Yamaha digital unit. The TSR-8 has excellent specs and is easy to operate, as tape units go. Most of the commonly replaced parts are still readily available from Tascam. There are many of these machines that were used is home/small studios that have very low hours.

There are many things to consider as you make this decision:

1. Getting a good one on the used market that has low hours and/or was well treated and maintained. Look for an original owner home-studio deal --Take your time.

2. The cost of ownership – although you can find them on eBay for around $500.00, you will likely have to replace a few things that wear with time or use, such as the pinch roller, capstan drive belt and maybe reel clampers (Altogether less than $75.00 shipped from Tascam). The labor fees are costly if you can’t do it yourself. You should also have the machine adjusted to the brand and type of tape you will use (Stick with Quantegy 456 or post 1995 Ampex 456). The tape is not cheap -- $35.00-$50.00 depending on your source. A tape will give you approximately 30 min recording time.

3. Unlike a digital hard disk system, an open-reel machine must be well maintained by you on a regular schedule – demagnetize, clean, protected from dust, etc. Your producer could check you out on that.

4. If you’re not familiar with tape systems expect a learning curve before you are making good music. I don’t know your background, but most people who have only worked with digital have to process a considerable amount of information to move up to analog. ;)



I’ve never been a fan of the “Studio in a box” concept. Corners have to be cut to put all those features into one system while keeping it affordable. However, you may want to check the Yamaha website for updates before giving up on the AW16G. Personally though, I would ditch it.

Tim :cool:
 
As much as I am trying to get into the whole analog thing more I just have to say that there is a lot more head ache associated with this stuff than the digital. I think it is easier to get a good sound off the digital and a lot easier to start recording as you have everything you need. But the analog seems more full-filling. Its just all the repairs that keep me from getting too deep into analog.

So just pick what you need.
 
:D You will enjoy being an analog dog like Muttley and the rest of us, It's easier to learn and master the basics when you have to hook up each individual phase of the recording process then try to figure out whats going on in an all in one box studio.
Keep it sweet and simple to start, then add effects, EQ's, compressers, etc as time goes along. A good music/guitar/recording/PA store can be of good help if the sales people working ther know whats going on.............



da MUTT
 
Thanks for the insights. A helpful bunch. What a cool site. I am getting my money back from the digi box and then I'm going to study up some more and ask annoying questions and try and make the right choice this time. Luckily I have a friend who has 2 TSR8's in good working order that will let me borrow one to give it a whirl.
 
Proper maintenance is essential for analog recording. You need to know how to align and calibrate your machine. You will need a voltmeter, oscilloscope, an alignment tape, a degausser. Noise reduction requires further adjustment. Last I remember I payed about $700 for my MRL tape. Someone must show you how to degauss your machine properly otherwise you can severely damage it. You must know how to clean the heads. You should do each time before you use it. You need to know how to lay tone on to tape. Tape is expensive. You need to know how to store tape properly. Tails out, vertically, don't put it on top of the fridge, away from heat, large temperature fluctuations, etc. Oh yeah the heads wear out after a while and a new stack is very expensive. If you are really willing to take the plunge into using analog correctly and investing in a decent machine you will severely open a can of whoop-ass upon your digital brethren.
 
:cool: Kenney; don't let the nubby one discourage you, yes there is a little work involved, but it's not all that bad.......



da MUTT
 
Tape is a much more durable format than Nubenheimer makes it sound. I know folks who bought a used tape machine and never did a thing as far as maintenence goes and are still recording great sounding music years later. A little cleaning once in a while is all you really need.
If you are living in a pro studio like nubbydick likes to pretend he does then you will need to calibrate and align often. Me personally, never have yet. Tape makes digital sound silly.
 
yeah the funny part is once your heads start going out of alignment and you try to play back your older tapes you'll get all kinds of dropouts, phasing problems, crosstalk, etc. because you are playing tapes that were recorded with your heads in position a, and now your heads are in position b. Your new tape you just recorded is now layed down with your heads in position b. Now if you ever recalibrate you will fubar your tapes that were recorded with your heads at position a. See the evil little cycle that can be caused? This is just one example of the evils that can rear their ugly head. Alignment and calibration doesn't have to be done often but it is essential. Oh yeah, you need to calibrate your machine for a specific tape formulation.
 
that is you will fubar your tapes that were recorded with your heads at position b once you recalibrate. m'kay?
 
I haven't had any significant head drift in years on my two TASCAM reel to reels because of the bottom plate mount design on both my 38 and MS16.

I used to get azimuth drift on my cassette decks and older A3340S but, those had overhead mount designs that were susceptible to that condition.

I don't think the TSR8 would be problematic either for alignment drift.

Cheers! :)
 
I also noticed, from my experience with the Tascam 38,...

that the headstack mounting/plate arrangement seems to be very stable, solid & well constructed, and not prone to having the heads drift out of alignment.

I've never worried too much about head drift, and the 38's I got off Ebay seemed to spec out just fine, in relation to alignment and calibration, even after enduring the rigors of shipping.

I think for home recording, [re: 38/TSR-8], if you have the alignment & calibration done once or twice during the lifetime of the machine, then that's sufficient, especially for a home-kept low-use deck.
 
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