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Thread: TEAC 80-8/Scotch 206 shedding?

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    TEAC 80-8/Scotch 206 shedding?

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    Just jumped back in to recording today and fired up the 80-8 with a reel of used Scotch 206 1/2". I had other reels of 206 and 207 available but wanted to test with a used reel first as it had recordings on it from a prior band (not mine). A friend of mine recorded some vedic mantras, and we were just laying down tracks as we went.

    Everything was going pretty great for maybe 3-4 hours and we had three tracks, all high quality with no dropouts. We took breaks to let the machine rest, and I was pretty gentle with the tape. When we got to track 4, a percussion track, I was rewinding the tape back to the beginning and heard the tape scraping through the headphones (not in them). What was more concerning was the amount of what looked like shed flying down on to the machine, and piling up quickly. We had this issue on some 1/4" NOS 203 on my 2 track, but it resolved itself after several minutes of use. After loosening the tension on the tape and putting it back to normal, it lessened, but didnt fix it.

    My best guess after inspection was that the tape had degraded over the years, and its edges were scraping on the take up reel. So maybe we worked an old tape too hard on one section of the reel for too long. The amount of flaking is concerning, but I dont think its sticky. How should I proceed?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roozter View Post
    Just jumped back in to recording today and fired up the 80-8 with a reel of used Scotch 206 1/2". I had other reels of 206 and 207 available but wanted to test with a used reel first as it had recordings on it from a prior band (not mine). A friend of mine recorded some vedic mantras, and we were just laying down tracks as we went.

    Everything was going pretty great for maybe 3-4 hours and we had three tracks, all high quality with no dropouts. We took breaks to let the machine rest, and I was pretty gentle with the tape. When we got to track 4, a percussion track, I was rewinding the tape back to the beginning and heard the tape scraping through the headphones (not in them). What was more concerning was the amount of what looked like shed flying down on to the machine, and piling up quickly. We had this issue on some 1/4" NOS 203 on my 2 track, but it resolved itself after several minutes of use. After loosening the tension on the tape and putting it back to normal, it lessened, but didnt fix it.

    My best guess after inspection was that the tape had degraded over the years, and its edges were scraping on the take up reel. So maybe we worked an old tape too hard on one section of the reel for too long. The amount of flaking is concerning, but I dont think its sticky. How should I proceed?


    buy brand new tape is what i would do

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    Quote Originally Posted by mr average View Post
    buy brand new tape is what i would do
    Are these really the type of responses people are giving on the forum now? I was actually worried about getting back on here because of this type of crap, so if this is where the forum is now, I'll go somewhere else for help.

    Hopefully a knowledgable long time analog poster who actually read my post can chime in with some real constructive information.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roozter View Post
    Are these really the type of responses people are giving on the forum now? I was actually worried about getting back on here because of this type of crap, so if this is where the forum is now, I'll go somewhere else for help.

    Hopefully a knowledgable long time analog poster who actually read my post can chime in with some real constructive information.
    That was constructive information.

    And that is what I did back , way back, when I was still using tape.

    What else you going to do with old degraded tape that is shedding but toss it and replace it?
    Or don't you mind fighting needless problems not to mention drop outs and fading on your recording.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roozter View Post
    Are these really the type of responses people are giving on the forum now? I was actually worried about getting back on here because of this type of crap, so if this is where the forum is now, I'll go somewhere else for help.

    Hopefully a knowledgable long time analog poster who actually read my post can chime in with some real constructive information.
    Well...he's kinda right, buy some new tape and get on with your recording.

    The shedding thing is not going to be fixable. You could go the tape baking route, but the tape that's already shed, will not be repairable, and even after baking, a different tape that also has shedding potential, you wouldn't really want to use that tape as though it's new once you bake it.
    Baking is quick-fix that allows you to maybe transfer tracks off it to something else (new tape or the computer) but not meant to allow you to go on using that bad tape as though it's now fixed permanently.
    That said...there are some people who bake and the still use their tapes, and keep an eye on them to see if/when they start to shed again, so they could quick bake them once more (you can potentially bake them a bunch of times)...but IMO, that's a real PITA way to work, and it's risky if the tracks you are laying down are spontaneous/jam tracks that would be hard to redo again later on.

    So yeah...buy some new tape.

    You can find decent NOS tape around...even sometimes on eBay you can find sellers who are not trying to push crap on people, where the tapes are sealed and they can show you the year of manufacture...etc...or just buy some of the new manufactured taped from RMGI or ATR.

    There is also a "sticky" at the top of this forum that extensively covers the tape "SSS" thing...with all the info you could want.

    Oh...nice to see you pop back in here...it's been awhile since you posted.

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    Searched the archives on another forum and found all the information I needed, and sure enough my theory on the issue was correct. Following your advice would have wasted my money and tape. The tape is not sticky, the machine is fine, the edge shedding is normal given the circumstances, and all I need to do is inspect my heads to be sure.

    I really loved this forum at one point, but if I'm going to get lazy answers with minimal thought put in to it, I'd rather not waste my time trying to contribute to this forum at all. You guys are pretty much just trolling, and its obnoxious. Clearly it was valid question that went beyond "just get new tape", and an experienced tape user could have easily answered it with the information I gave. So I'd really appreciate if you avoided my threads completely, miroslav, and I'll give you the same courtesy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roozter View Post
    Searched the archives on another forum and found all the information I needed, and sure enough my theory on the issue was correct. Following your advice would have wasted my money and tape. The tape is not sticky, the machine is fine, the edge shedding is normal given the circumstances, and all I need to do is inspect my heads to be sure.

    I really loved this forum at one point, but if I'm going to get lazy answers with minimal thought put in to it, I'd rather not waste my time trying to contribute to this forum at all. You guys are pretty much just trolling, and its obnoxious. Clearly it was valid question that went beyond "just get new tape", and an experienced tape user could have easily answered it with the information I gave. So I'd really appreciate if you avoided my threads completely, miroslav, and I'll give you the same courtesy.
    Dude...you are WAY overreacting.

    Point is...what solution did that "other" site give you...please share.
    Also...what's inspecting your heads going to do for the tape that is shedding...???

    You can inspect your heads all day long, but if you are getting squeaking and drag on the transport from the tape...that tape is not worth using.
    So back to the original advice. Get some new tape, or risk using the shedding tape and getting dropouts in your record tracks, and/or gumming up your heads and transport constantly.
    There's nothing "lazy" about the responses you got.
    It just seems like you want to avoid buying new tape, yet it's obvious you have bad tape.

    Scotch 206 is one of the tapes known to have SSS issues...but you do whatever they told you on the other site.
    Sticky-shed syndrome - Wikipedia

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    Quote Originally Posted by miroslav View Post
    Scotch 206 is one of the tapes known to have SSS issues...but you do whatever they told you on the other site.
    Sticky-shed syndrome - Wikipedia
    Thread hijack: I thought 206 was safe? (I have a handful of NOS reels, I've not yet used.) 226 was the one according to that old thread by Beck.

    Also, Splicit has a new tape out called "Capture" I believe they are rolling out 1/2" as well. It's allegedly from a Zonal factory.

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    No tape is safe tape, unless brand new.

    How old is it
    How used is it
    Where was it stored, dry, cool, etc.
    What brand
    what batch (some were very bad)

    I have some brand new in the carton 15 year old tape and would still be reluctant to use it.

    Alan.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue Jinn View Post
    Thread hijack: I thought 206 was safe? (I have a handful of NOS reels, I've not yet used.) 226 was the one according to that old thread by Beck.
    If you do enough Google searches, you will find some folk saying they have problems with all that Scotch tape, including 206...and then others say they never had problems.

    Bottom line here...the OP specifically HAS a shedding problem...which he apparently thinks is solved by checking the heads occasionally.
    I can't figure out what one thing has to do with the other....???
    The issue is the tape shedding...not the heads or checking them for any crud buildup.

    So the question is...how much do you value whatever it is your are recording on tape that is already shedding...?
    If there is little value and you don't mind the risk of dropouts and potentially the whole tape becomes basically useless at some point...then go on and keep using it...otherwise, throw it out and get some good tape.
    I find it odd that anyone would balk at the idea of buying a couple of reels of good/new tape, when it is readily available...and consider that a "waste of money".

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