Right to Repair

Of course they do. Which is why the unfixable crap needs an environmental tax (or something to that effect) to balance the situation a bit.

Thank you. How many 'king phones/cars/foodmixers/washing machines...does one need in a lifetime. My fridge freezer is at least 20 yrs old. Yes bits are bust but it could well see me out.

There is already eveidence that some of the ultra exotic and rare metal in phones are going to run out in a decade or so. Recycling is the only answer. Same goes energywise for Aluminium and Copper. Needs FAR more energy to win from ore than recycled parts.

I just missed WW2 (born '45) but I know the country was recycling like mad. Had to. This time "The War" is worldwide and there isn't another planet hiding behind the Sun!

Something like 1% of the worlds population are very comfortable and fucking things up for the other 99%.

Dave.
 
Thank you. How many 'king phones/cars/foodmixers/washing machines...does one need in a lifetime. My fridge freezer is at least 20 yrs old. Yes bits are bust but it could well see me out.

There is already eveidence that some of the ultra exotic and rare metal in phones are going to run out in a decade or so. Recycling is the only answer. Same goes energywise for Aluminium and Copper. Needs FAR more energy to win from ore than recycled parts.

I just missed WW2 (born '45) but I know the country was recycling like mad. Had to. This time "The War" is worldwide and there isn't another planet hiding behind the Sun!

Something like 1% of the worlds population are very comfortable and fucking things up for the other 99%.

Dave.

Recycling is not repair.

For rare metals it may make sense.

But for most stuff it costs way more than putting in the trash dump.
Even the ultra loonie leftwing New York Times admits that.
 
Of course they do. Which is why the unfixable crap needs an environmental tax (or something to that effect) to balance the situation a bit.

The situation does not need balancing.

The free market is the absolute best way to allocate scarce goods.

There is no need for an environmental tax except to make some nutzoid lefties happy.
 
There is no such thing as a "Free Market" or "Fair Competiton". The evidence piles in daily that markets are rigged and companies are tax dodging, lying, self serving bastards.

All of the economic models have failed the vast majority of people. I don't care whether people call themselves left or right wing, both extremes screw people.

But there is some light on the horizon? Up until now it has been manufacturing jobs that have been lost to robots and the work left is practically slave wages. Now, Robotics is climbing into "service", white colour jobs. When the chattering classes get threatened there might be a backlash!

I am no Luddite, I earned my living from "technology" but the world is a lot nastier and uncaring than in my day.

Dave.
 
There is no such thing as a "Free Market" or "Fair Competiton". The evidence piles in daily that markets are rigged and companies are tax dodging, lying, self serving bastards.

All of the economic models have failed the vast majority of people. I don't care whether people call themselves left or right wing, both extremes screw people.

But there is some light on the horizon? Up until now it has been manufacturing jobs that have been lost to robots and the work left is practically slave wages. Now, Robotics is climbing into "service", white colour jobs. When the chattering classes get threatened there might be a backlash!

I am no Luddite, I earned my living from "technology" but the world is a lot nastier and uncaring than in my day.

Dave.

So of course full government fascist control of everything would be so much better than what we have now. Even the socialists know that is crap but they push it anyway so they can have power to run things.
 
Thank you. How many 'king phones/cars/foodmixers/washing machines...does one need in a lifetime. My fridge freezer is at least 20 yrs old. Yes bits are bust but it could well see me out.

There is already eveidence that some of the ultra exotic and rare metal in phones are going to run out in a decade or so. Recycling is the only answer. Same goes energywise for Aluminium and Copper. Needs FAR more energy to win from ore than recycled parts.

I just missed WW2 (born '45) but I know the country was recycling like mad. Had to. This time "The War" is worldwide and there isn't another planet hiding behind the Sun!

Something like 1% of the worlds population are very comfortable and fucking things up for the other 99%.

Dave.

Technically recycling is not the "only" answer, just the cheapest at this time. Turns out the asteroid belt is full of rare metals. One researcher turned up a spectogram (?) analysis of a 8 cubic mile chunk of nearly pure platinum. Soooo we just have to go get it. You think the Space x people are playing, but they see dollar signs.
 
So of course full government fascist control of everything would be so much better than what we have now. Even the socialists know that is crap but they push it anyway so they can have power to run things.

And so we descend to the old fashioned name calling and divisions. You assume because I consider we are "consuming ourselves into oblivion" and I attack the monster global companies that I am part of the Looney Left. Outmoded thinking sir. I believe in personal freedom as much as the next man or woman but with freedom comes responsibility.
I have long been an advocate AGAINST gun control. Firearms exist and if a citizen is a mature, sober individual of good character I have no problem with gun ownership. Had I live in the states I would surely have taken up Benchrest and done a little hunting. I do not have a "Disnefyed" idea about animals. They must be treated humanely but can be harvested for comsumption where their survival is not threatened.
I do NOT agree with destroyng thousands of hectares of habitat for Palm Oil that no one really needs.

But this, my generation, is doomed. We cannot it seems escape the thinking of the last hundred years or so. Just tell your kids not to buy property too close to the coast.

Dave.
 
Technically recycling is not the "only" answer, just the cheapest at this time. Turns out the asteroid belt is full of rare metals. One researcher turned up a spectogram (?) analysis of a 8 cubic mile chunk of nearly pure platinum. Soooo we just have to go get it. You think the Space x people are playing, but they see dollar signs.

So, where do they get the thousands of tons of metal and plastic etc, the Tbytes of energy to manufacture it to build the damn rocket? Do you know how much electicity it takes to produce one ton of liquid Hydrogen/O2 and keed it there? I don't but I know it is a 'king lot.
No such thing as a free lunch.

Now, before the name calling starts again, I am NOT anti-space exploration. Science in all its forms is one of the few things it is worth spending scarce resouces on. There are some common aims humanity should strive for. Peace, a decent standard of living and, finding out WTF "it" is all about!

Dave.
 
The situation does not need balancing.

The free market is the absolute best way to allocate scarce goods.

There is no need for an environmental tax except to make some nutzoid lefties happy.

Yes, for scarce materials the free market is effective and will eventually drive the phone etc prices sky-high. I hope you'll be happy when that happens.

Where it doesn't work for materials which are cheap to produce but expensive to dispose of. Hello plastic! You need legislation to push the recycling cost back to manufacturers. Or is that facist control too? What about slavery, do you think it would be okay to reintroduce it to further cut back production costs in the name of free market? Think it's all for the goodwill of people and corporations that this doesn't happen? Guess why it's so popular to produce stuff in China?

Sad to see the discussion degenerate to hatred and name-calling so fast, for some reason I expected a higher standard here. Sure got my expectations set straight on that! Also this has gotten rather far away from the actual topic which I found interesting, politics less so.
 
Yes, for scarce materials the free market is effective and will eventually drive the phone etc prices sky-high. I hope you'll be happy when that happens.

Where it doesn't work for materials which are cheap to produce but expensive to dispose of. Hello plastic! You need legislation to push the recycling cost back to manufacturers. Or is that facist control too? What about slavery, do you think it would be okay to reintroduce it to further cut back production costs in the name of free market? Think it's all for the goodwill of people and corporations that this doesn't happen? Guess why it's so popular to produce stuff in China?

Sad to see the discussion degenerate to hatred and name-calling so fast, for some reason I expected a higher standard here. Sure got my expectations set straight on that! Also this has gotten rather far away from the actual topic which I found interesting, politics less so.

In many parts of the world robotics has taken so many jobs that all that are left are so hard fought over that people work for starvation wages*. You see it on Quest TV? Machines do 90% of the production but some poor sod is left packing. Presumably they can employ them cheaper than designing a packing robot! And, remember, robots don't pay taxes OR shop at the local store (or online for that matter!)

In the next decade or so we shall see taxi, truck and bus drivers joining the ranks of the unemployed and disposessed. Mind you! Roads will be safer and travel more efficient!

*Along with the clamour about RFI components and moulded mains plugs, the minimum wage here was predicted to cause the end of civilization as we knew it. No evidence so far.....

Dave.
 
Yes, for scarce materials the free market is effective and will eventually drive the phone etc prices sky-high. I hope you'll be happy when that happens.

Where it doesn't work for materials which are cheap to produce but expensive to dispose of. Hello plastic! You need legislation to push the recycling cost back to manufacturers. Or is that facist control too? What about slavery, do you think it would be okay to reintroduce it to further cut back production costs in the name of free market? Think it's all for the goodwill of people and corporations that this doesn't happen? Guess why it's so popular to produce stuff in China?

Sad to see the discussion degenerate to hatred and name-calling so fast, for some reason I expected a higher standard here. Sure got my expectations set straight on that! Also this has gotten rather far away from the actual topic which I found interesting, politics less so.

You are so confused. That has nothing to do with repairs.
 
Here's why the right to repair may hit a snag: a ton of formerly well-known brands are now "zombies."

Someone bought the name and slaps it on low-end Asian imports with NO repair facilities or spare parts. If something breaks, they give you the runaround, asking for photos or even video of the problem. Often they replace the item with another model, as the original is gone. The returns are bought up cheap by jobbers and "refurbished" -probably by canniblizing other units.

In order to supply you with any part, they would need to restructure their whole supply chain.
 
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