Need some help setting up a 4 Track Reel to Reel to a Tascam Mixer

J

Jzoha18

Member
Hello, I have an old Fostex A4 reel to reel and a bunch of pre recorded tapes and a few take up reels from the original owner and a Tascam M-208 8 channel mixer that was designed for Tascam reel to reels in the late 70s. I'm having great difficulty setting up a basic 4 channel multi track setup where i can record and overdub while monitoring previously recorded tracks. I have been using 4 track cassette units for years and was put off by this setup just due to the confusion. From reading lots online and the manuals for both the mixer and reel to reel i concluded the basic setup was 4 Rca cables going from the Fostex outputs to the tape in jacks on the first 4 channels of the mixer, and 4 Rca cables from the PGM OUT jacks on the mixer into the 4 inputs on the recorder. My problem is monitoring and clear audio. I followed these steps and with a pre recorded tape tested a microphone through channel one. I was able to hear what i was saying very clear and with the Fostex set to record could also see the recorders meters responding. The real problem is playback. Im convinced this is me not understanding something about the mixer. I get super faint muffled playback with the mixer channel set to tape and the reel to reel set to tape as well. Occasionally i will hear old demos fairly loud on the tape from the previous owner but nothing of that level of my own. What am i doing wrong? Im monitoring with active fostex studio monitors out of the main outs on the back of the mixer with no issue as advised from others i've seen using similar monitors with reel to reels. Am i not using the right switches or is something not panned correctly? Forgive my ignorance as this mixer has quite a few unusual features for me as i have experience only with more modern stereo mixers. I'm pretty sure the reel to reel heads are fine due to the louder playback on parts of pre recorded material. But i for the life of me cannot figure this out. My playback is all messed up and i can't understand this mixer. Ive included pictures of what i'm working with. Please help a guy out!
 
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Forgot the Photos of what i got, Here they are
 

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Hi there and welcome!

So...first of all, I'm not very familiar with the A2/A4/A8 machines...are they two head or three head machines? If they are three head, don't assume if it is playing back okay it should record okay.

Let's make sure you're connections are proper, then we can try to rule out any operational issues to the end of determining if there is something wrong with the equipment.

Your connections should be like this:

M-208 PGM OUT 1-4 --> A4 INPUT 1-4
A4 OUPUT 1-4 --> M-208 TAPE IN 1-4
 
Jzoha18 said:
Forgot the Photos of what i got, Here they are
Click to expand...

Welcome! Make sure that you inspect the tape head as well as the tapes for any dust build up. Depending on how they were both stored, you may need to clean both. Canned air, cue tips and a very soft cloth will do the trick if needed. If you have ever listened to an old stereo and heard the speakers crackling as you adjusted the volume, this is mostly due to dust build up. PS. GREAT LOOKING GEAR!!
 
Setup specific's

sweetbeats said:
Hi there and welcome!

So...first of all, I'm not very familiar with the A2/A4/A8 machines...are they two head or three head machines? If they are three head, don't assume if it is playing back okay it should record okay.

Let's make sure you're connections are proper, then we can try to rule out any operational issues to the end of determining if there is something wrong with the equipment.

Your connections should be like this:

M-208 PGM OUT 1-4 --> A4 INPUT 1-4
A4 OUPUT 1-4 --> M-208 TAPE IN 1-4
Click to expand...

I did not notice it when i first went to clean the heads but it is a 3 head deck. I noticed this morning the erase head looks grimey so i will clean them and post pictures tonight. I also found out something else. I was hearing a sqeaking on playback and the reels would get jammed up a few times. I have ruled out that as sticky shed reels from the old owner and will need to get new 1/4" tape for the machine.
My connection's follow exactly what you listed. Would i be able to post a video link on here of it hooked up and running and the problems im having? Im determined to get this right! Thank you for the response.
 
Will do a more in depth cleaning tonight and post a picture and possibly a link to a vid of it not functioning hooked up if the forum permits it!
 
If you were running sticky tape then that is your first suspect. Even the smallest particle can diminish or even eliminate the ability for signal to make it to tape. Use cotton makeup remover pads and 91% isopropyl alcohol to THOROUGHLY clean all three heads. Then try recording again with fresh tape. You may not need to post a video.
 
sweetbeats said:
If you were running sticky tape then that is your first suspect. Even the smallest particle can diminish or even eliminate the ability for signal to make it to tape. Use cotton makeup remover pads and 91% isopropyl alcohol to THOROUGHLY clean all three heads. Then try recording again with fresh tape. You may not need to post a video.
Click to expand...

Yea from reading up on it it appears the most common tape suffering from sticky shed happens to be the ampex 456/457 tape this machine was designed for and that the owner supplied.
Any rec's on new 1/4" tape?
 
sweetbeats said:
If you were running sticky tape then that is your first suspect. Even the smallest particle can diminish or even eliminate the ability for signal to make it to tape. Use cotton makeup remover pads and 91% isopropyl alcohol to THOROUGHLY clean all three heads. Then try recording again with fresh tape. You may not need to post a video.[/QU

Heres a shot of the heads i took when i was cleaning the erase head...i see quite a bit of gunk
Click to expand...
 

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I see a lot more than that. The wear looks pretty even, though. You might luck into some odd=ball heads that would work - and home re-laping is an option. The day I discovered sticky was with some Agfa and the whole machine ground to a halt. I keep meaning to add, clean the whole tape path - not just the heads
 
Jzoha18 said:
Heres a shot of the heads i took when i was cleaning the erase head...i see quite a bit of gunk
Click to expand...
Yuck! That is a lot of gunk, not just the record head but also the tape guides. Be sure to clean all of the guides as well as the heads. If you can find denatured alcohol or 99% Isopropyl alcohol that would be good - lower percentages of IPA contain more water. Post another photo when it's all clean.
 
Woah! That's ONE Mucky Ducky!

Heads, yes ISOPROPA. Take the pinch roller off, CAREFUL NOT TO LOSE ANY SUPER THIN WASHERS AND NOTE POSITION. Roller rubber can object to alcohol so clean it with a cloth and spit. Rub in the axis of the shaft not round and round.

The HF recording capability of record heads is not much affected by wear, unlike replay heads so a test recording at 400, 1000 and 10,000Hz (at highest speed and -20dB) should tell you how good the heads are.
Of course proper test tape is vastly to be preferred but them's 'spensive.

If you are going to keep the machine for serious recording, look for a workshop manual.

Dave.
 
garww said:
I see a lot more than that. The wear looks pretty even, though. You might luck into some odd=ball heads that would work - and home re-laping is an option. The day I discovered sticky was with some Agfa and the whole machine ground to a halt. I keep meaning to add, clean the whole tape path - not just the heads
Click to expand...

You mean the heads look worn out?
 
You are not getting any serious recording with those heads. I might be acceptable for the hobbyist
 
Jzoha18 said:
You mean the heads look worn out?
Click to expand...

Don't get distracted with that at the moment. *Nothing* can be determined from a picture unless there are obvious open gaps, and that's impossible to tell with all the shed on the heads. Just clean them up. All good advice above regarding no alcohol on the pinch roller, you can use water or a mild solution of water and window cleaner, but no solvents on rubber. Clean whole tape path *yes*. 99% iso alcohol is preferred to 91%, but hard to find and the latter is a good option. Do not use the 70% or 50%. Denatured alcohol is indeed a preferred option and readily available. Once it's all cleaned up try again with fresh tape. My money is on things working well at that point. Don't get wrapped up into other worries until you know you have to worry about them.
 
Jzoha18 said:
You mean the heads look worn out?
Click to expand...

I mean that is the snapshot of when the machine was taken out of service. They are marginal, for sure. The peak is missing from wear to the extent debris will collect there as there is no correct tape contact
 
garww said:
I mean that is the snapshot of when the machine was taken out of service. They are marginal, for sure. The peak is missing from wear to the extent debris will collect there as there is no correct tape contact
Click to expand...

Different heads have different profiles. Without detailed pics of clean lifters, guides or heads, or knowledge about whether or not the guides have been rotated, I don't see how you can see the wear groove or know what the tip depth is...let's let him/her clean up the machine and see if it works before worrying her/him it is unusable. This really seems presumptuous at this stage.
 
We'll see how quickly it loads up, again, and the poster can refer to those Nortronics ads from the '50s
 
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