Small vs Large condenser for instrumental acoustic guitar

I can't agree with the idea that there aren't a lot of mic capsules sold. In addition, I wasn't talking about surface mount components.

Look at the inside of a U87, there are a handful of very common components. The only custom component is the capsule, and even that is made of basic components. Machined brass, gold sputtered mylar film, plastic spacers, machine screws. The headbasket is a wire mesh component.

There's nothing unique or proprietary .Quite the contrary, everything can be measured, from the component values and physical dimensions to the actual circuit. It's something that could easily be built and sold for 1/4 the price of a Neumann model. Having worked with Chinese factories, I know that if you give them a target, they'll meet it. They were just as capable as the Germans, Japanese or Koreans at making products. A CNC machine works the same in Beijing or Sydney as it does in Berlin or Willis.

Granted, if you just want them to provide a cheap copy of something that looks like a high end product, someone has it. I'm not talking about knock off Chibson guitars for $100. I'm talking about actually engineering and building a quality component such as companies like Eastman do in the guitar market. They are quality products, although their designs are not necessarily direct knock-offs or exact copies of other products, they play and sound just about the same as their target designs.

I don’t know where to start. You vlearly haven’t tried to work with chinese manufacturing Industry. They, simply put, have a different manufacturing method if you will. They will work a given assignement and try to make it as costeffective as possible. They will have lower cost playing their employees, but I am sorry to say, that said workers do have different work ethics when compared to for instance german employees. If you’ve been to China and Japan, you’d know what I was talking about. There is a World if difference even there. The Japanese generally take personal deapfelt pride in everything they do - not the same case with the chinese people. It’s a cultural thing.
Well you know it already, that’s why you wonder why it is not possible to do the same thing in China that it is in Germany - or Japan or Dennark for that matter.
I know for a fact, that all miniature microphone capsules in the Danish DPA Factory goes through up to 50 individual tests until found suitable for the Microphones - and here I am talking about Microphones that cost as little as 300 USD. Then take the capsule in a 4011 for instance. Perhaps DPA will produce a couple of hundred of these per year. That’s a VERY small quantity, if the machine used to produce them alone costs, say a million dollars. That is not something you would ever get a chinese manufacturing department to do. Way too little money to make on such an investment.

And you do say, that there are many large disphraghm capsules produced? Say over a ten year period 1/100th of the worlds population will purchase said capsule in a microphone. Then perhaps there is, let’s put a low number on it, 50 different capsules in the World. That’s somewhere around 100.000 of each capsule Per year IF the one Factory could be deliver ALL capsules of this type, which is rather unlikely. Now compare that number to an Intel i5 processor (or whatever they are called these days) - they will be in every other living persons possision. That’s 3.000.000.000 - and two years later there will be a new current model to produce. That’s mass-production.
It’s the same reason a lot of tubes are now made of unobtainium. Small quanities is just not profitable to produce. And even worse as more and more people don’t want to pay the price that quality products inevitably costs.
Bla...bla...bla...
 
Sorry, I haven't been here for awhile...I don't use DAW...I use a TASCAM DP24 Digital Recorder

STEVE!

So those DP24 's are the real deal? The bass is nice and strong.

In the sellers comments , the Tascam owners are selling them to go move to a DAW.

Personally I was working with UA support and found computers too hard to set up.

Turning DEP on / off and processor throttling.

I could not figure out where the places were . So they had me use run command lines with HKeylocalmachine....I had no idea how to switch it back, when nothing worked. So I sent back my laptop to be restored. Its free with the service plan.
 
You find an original VHS of Star Wars yet?


Next you'll be telling us that "Sex and the city" was really called "Sex in the city" which may or may not reveal some of your watching habits....:D

Not that this has anything to do with condensers, small or large or acoustic guitars !!
 
Next you'll be telling us that "Sex and the city" was really called "Sex in the city" which may or may not reveal some of your watching habits....:D

Not that this has anything to do with condensers, small or large or acoustic guitars !!

Grim, you went off topic to reply to me, then you reprimand me for doing the same? Looks like it. haha

Choose a side. Either elitism through spelling, grammar, and topic... or free speech all ways.

I'm going free..All ways. Just let it fall out. Dont think too hard. Communicate. Let it happen.

Be the ball. Game on. Go forward . Come what may.
 
I use both large and small diaphragm condensers on acoustic guitars and I can't tell the difference !

You know thats not right.

For $76 the DP24 has some nice features. I am excited. It seems a low risk investment. Something that records the same for everyone with one button. Perfect. I have suspected my DAW setup was incorrect and there was a USB bottle neck. We shall see.
 
Yeah....if it’s new and not a return then it’s a very good deal. I have one that I stopped using a number of years ago. Too limited compared to even a very basic DAW. Editing is very tedious and limited. The effects are extremely basic and limited in use across tracks. Some of the buttons are very iffy sometimes. On the plus side.....very solid pleasing / warm sound. I use mine now as a mixer and additional headphone amp.

Mick
 
On the plus side.....very solid pleasing / warm sound.
Mick

That s what i want.

If you record an acoustic guitar and you cannot hear big differences when switching microphones, there could be a problem somewhere.

I notice a major difference in room listening to DAW . The DP24 will confirm my suspicions. Most of the midi controlled VSTs sound ok. I think its only what comes through the USB. Through a mixer and an 1/4" tape 8 track the listening can be leveled to sound equal from monitors to the room.

You know, I think they are used for that price. But I notice over 100+ orders so, I don't know.

Hoping its not a cheap plastic kids toy. A 24 track recorder for the price of a distortion pedal, what is not to trust?
 
Too limited compared to even a very basic DAW
I have an even more basic craft than Tascam's DP24. But I love it ~ at the moment.
Editing is very tedious and limited
I was thinking about this the other day and the only thing in the editing stakes that I might possibly want that I can't get with my basic Akai is backwards recording. But I can do that with the Zoom MRS 8 which I bought specifically for that purpose, if I need that facility and then just fly it in. All the other editing bits, even a more basic than basic DAW should have. There's nothing I've wanted to do that I can't and it's certainly better than a razor blade. In fact, some years ago, before "If only for a moment" was my strapline, it was "Digital is my razor blade." Sometimes it is tedious. But knowing it has a purpose keeps me going.
The effects are extremely basic and limited in use across tracks
They are kind of basic on these standalones from a bygone era.
But that's had 2 important effects on me {no pun intended}. When I first used to record, particularly on my 8 track portastudio, I used to overdo it with the effects, as one does. Much of the time, it was only when I could hear the effects that I was happy and instead of backing off, I'd up the ante ! Many years on, some of those songs are, well, not exactly unlistenable, but just slathered in awful sounding reverb {much of which I'd never use today, certainly not so it was obvious}, chorus, phasers, flange, wah~wah etc. To this day I can't stand chorus on an acoustic guitar. It has to be subtler than subtle.
The other effect the limitations have had on me is that I've learned how to combine external effects with the internal ones and I've really learned about subtlety. It used to strike me as daft that you'd apply effects only to then back off. Surely the point was to hear the effect, right ?
Now I know differently !
Some of the buttons are very iffy sometimes
After many years, they can get somewhat iffy, I'll give you that. But so can mice and keyboards.
 
You know thats not right.
I wouldn't say it if it wasn't right. I record acoustic guitars with dynamics, condensers, small and large diaphragm, dual, singular, over the shoulder, pointing directly at the sound hole but 4 feet away or pointing at the wood, just under or to the side of the sound hole in just about every configuration possible.
The result always sounds like acoustic guitar to me and unless I made a note of the mic I used, I couldn't tell you and I couldn't tell you the mic position either.
 
I have an even more basic craft than Tascam's DP24. But I love it ~ at the moment.I was thinking about this the other day and the only thing in the editing stakes that I might possibly want that I can't get with my basic Akai is backwards recording. But I can do that with the Zoom MRS 8 which I bought specifically for that purpose, if I need that facility and then just fly it in. All the other editing bits, even a more basic than basic DAW should have. There's nothing I've wanted to do that I can't and it's certainly better than a razor blade. In fact, some years ago, before "If only for a moment" was my strapline, it was "Digital is my razor blade." Sometimes it is tedious. But knowing it has a purpose keeps me going.They are kind of basic on these standalones from a bygone era.
But that's had 2 important effects on me {no pun intended}. When I first used to record, particularly on my 8 track portastudio, I used to overdo it with the effects, as one does. Much of the time, it was only when I could hear the effects that I was happy and instead of backing off, I'd up the ante ! Many years on, some of those songs are, well, not exactly unlistenable, but just slathered in awful sounding reverb {much of which I'd never use today, certainly not so it was obvious}, chorus, phasers, flange, wah~wah etc. To this day I can't stand chorus on an acoustic guitar. It has to be subtler than subtle.
The other effect the limitations have had on me is that I've learned how to combine external effects with the internal ones and I've really learned about subtlety. It used to strike me as daft that you'd apply effects only to then back off. Surely the point was to hear the effect, right ?
Now I know differently !After many years, they can get somewhat iffy, I'll give you that. But so can mice and keyboards.

Yup...different strokes....different needs...different views....different evolution....but nothing is right or wrong if you get to where you wanted to go. I absolutely loved the DP24 while I used it. It's just that once I started using a DAW (Reaper) I was hooked. I often wondered why there's no stand alone that can import effects and also wondered if there are stand alones that can be connected to at least a screen for viewing the wav...etc. Perhaps there are?? I might still be using the Tascam if that was the case.

As for mice and keyboards going "iffy"......yup....but they're not a big deal to replace or cost as much as a DP24.
 
Yup...different strokes....different needs...different views....different evolution....but nothing is right or wrong if you get to where you wanted to go. I absolutely loved the DP24 while I used it. It's just that once I started using a DAW (Reaper) I was hooked. I often wondered why there's no stand alone that can import effects and also wondered if there are stand alones that can be connected to at least a screen for viewing the wav...etc. Perhaps there are?? I might still be using the Tascam if that was the case.

As for mice and keyboards going "iffy"......yup....but they're not a big deal to replace or cost as much as a DP24.

Some Allen & Heath digital mixers can use Waves plugins, Via Dante IIRC to Waves hardware. Most digital mixers have the capability to record to USB 3.0
 
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