A Broken Record, but.....

[coat2020]

Hey all,
First off, apologies if this is not the best place for this. It's applicable, but unsure of ideal location....

I've been off/on recording for years now, but still working with some of the equipment that I started with (see current setup below).
I'm happy with what I've produced so far, but I definitely think I have some room for improvement... specifically, recording vocals. I'm currently running an Audio Technica 2020 [first mic I bought for home recording like, 10 years ago?] and it's gotten the job done so far. But I know I could have better quality vocals in the tracks, whether it be from a new mic to better acoustic soundproofing... I want to share some experience with others who know what the heck I'm talking about to try and pinpoint the cause of lack-luster vocal tracks, and determine possible resolutions.

I would consider the genre singer/songwriter; folky acoustic pop. My wife and I sing together, 85% of the time it's sharing the vocal space with harmonies. But the other moments of solo vocals do have some range. We aren't screaming, but we're hitting the high ends strong. So I need something that is still going to capture a wide range.

The AT2020 is a condenser mic, so it's picking up a lot of extra noise. In certain situations, that would be ideal. But since I don't have a decently sound proofed room at this time, I need to cut some of that mud out. So I am looking at some dynamic options. Obviously, I could just scroll through top google results for "Best Dynamic Microphones 2020", but that's why I'm here; I would prefer recommendations from first hand users. Obviously, you get what you pay for, but let's stick to around $500 for now.

If there is anything else that you can think of to discuss or ask, please do! I'd love to hear from you and talk through some of this stuff.
Be safe out there and be kind to each other

Cheers!

_______________

AT2020 (vocals/space) - homemade reflection filter setup behind the mic, but no other form of sound proofing at this time; limited options in current room
Audix f15 (acoustic)
Shure SM57 (amps)

Pop and reflection filter
Fostex PMO-4n (not the biggest fan so far, but doing the job for now)
Sennheiser headphones

Epiphone SG
Epiphone Les Paul
Seagull Maritime SWS Acoustic
Fender Bass
Behringer U-Control midi keyboard - Currently utilizing midi drums kits, no access to full set

PreSonus AudioBox iTwo - highly recommend this btw
Mac Mini running 10.10.5
Logic Pro X

 

[Mickster]

A couple things before you spend much $$$. What you're listening to your tracks on may be affecting your opinion so be careful. Cheap monitors and cheap headphones are always going to throw you off a bit. (not saying your stuff is cheap.....I have no idea) Lots of people like the AT2020 so just maybe your issue is elsewhere. To be honest.....without some sort of sample track posted here......all of us will be shooting in the dark and we could lead you way off. So...when you can......go ahead and post a sample.

 

[coat2020]

Sample Clip

Great call #Mickster, attaching a clip here... maybe, let's see if I did it right haha

I would definitely agree with the quality of the equipment used to actually hear it, so maybe an upgrade to the monitors and/or headphones is the way to go first.

I think what I'm not liking in these recordings is HOW crisp the vocals are.... it's almost tinny. But I've messed with the EQ a bit, and this was the best I could land on. Maybe it's also just me, since I'm in the headphones for days at a time, and I'm being over critical. Thoughts?

 

[Chili]

What is the space you are recording in? How big is it? Can you move to a bigger room to record your vocal tracks?

I wonder why you are getting mud in your vocal recordings. To me, that indicates there is something else going on outside of a mic issue. Or maybe what you're describing is more of a boxy sound(?)

[Edit: you posted a clip as I was typing] It doesn't sound bad. Certainly not muddy or anything. I'm not really hearing it as tinny, but you can EQ some more lower end to give it a more beefier sound. Or leave it as is, sounds good.

 

[coat2020]

I'm in a basement corner (unfortunately, the only available free space) about 10x10, but open to the rest of the basement; it's basically "L" shaped, and I'm in the bottom right
I wonder if moving to the center of the room for the vocals would do the trick... it's definitely something to try, never know

 

[CoolCat]

that clip sounds really good to me...not sure the mic is an issue.
im on some cheaper headphones right now, but it sounds clear and crisp and well balanced.

my 2 cents is more on the production, i'd wonder what some added parts would do to the recording, some guitar -fills in some quieter parts etc.

thats a pretty good demo of a AT2020? If you want something more like what, more bass, mids, treble?
The room noise definitely didnt come through to my ears either. So you might be ok with Condensor but a SDC or Dynamic could be fun to try.

 

[coat2020]

Thanks CoolCat and Chili
I'm wondering if I'm just over analyzing a bit, "you're own worst critic" kind of thing.
If I manage to come up with more examples of what I may be hearing, I'll definitely share.
Thanks all for the input!

 

[PorterhouseMusic]

Maybe something to kill some of the reflections?

I use a couple of mic stands fully extended - looks like a "T". Then I drape thick quilts/bedspreads over them. And set them to form a makeshift "booth". Not ideal - but *definitely* helps .

 

[keith.rogers]

I don't know what you mean by "limited options" in addressing room treatment. IME that's going to give you better recordings with your existing mic, and a better mic without doing that is possibly wasted money.

The recording is not bad at all. Some noises can be managed by simply getting better at mic placement and just tracking/comping until you've really got the best you can, and editing to snip out every single thing possible that shouldn't be there, or figure out how to stop it from getting on the track.

The Presonus has limited gain for some dynamics - not sure if you've tried the SM57 on vocals, for instance, to see how it handles yours. Might be Ok, but the spec shows 52dB, which could mean you'll be pegged on the interface gain for some singers. (I'm sure it's fine for electric guitar amp!)

If you are bothered by the vocals, it might be worth posting just a dry vocal track so folks can hear the room. The mix can mask a lot of things, i.e., that you still hear, but anyone that hasn't heard the pieces won't know exactly what might be in there that would improve the mix if it weren't.

A 10'x10' room probably needs a lot of treatment, but I'd probably not get in the center.

 

[Mickster]

I don't see major issues with the sample. It sounds pretty good. As you mention....it could be that you're overthinking the whole thing. As someone else suggested.........have you tried the SM57 for vocals? I use one fairly often....depending on the song or the singer. Since most of us don't hear what you do.........I'm still thinking it could be your monitors or headphones or both. Not saying to run out and spend lots of $$$ on those..........just saying that most of us listen with pretty good monitors or headphones..........and we don't seem to hear what you do.

 

[coat2020]

Guys/gals,
Thanks so much for the feedback!
I'll definitely post an updated dry recording once I'm back down there.... unfortunately have to head back in to the office for a little while for coverage, but will hopefully be back in the swing of things after my rotation.
I'll absolutely be giving the SM57 a run for some vocals, I have not yet tried it! I went through every mic I have in a trial run to see which had the most clarity, but I think I'm just going to dive in to lay down multiple tracks with different mics to get a good overall comparison

Again, thank you all for the input and guidance, I'll report back with some findings!
Thanks all, stay safe!