Scale Theory Question:

M

Mr. Bert

New member
I spent years in cover bands and learned to play most of the leads note for note, with no knowledge of scales and their progressions. I could play the song, but I couldn't tell you what the notes were.

I believe this greatly hampered my lead playing and creativity because I bypassed so many important aspects of musical theory. I was totally self-taught. My only saving graces are good timing and a good ear.

I recently started taking music lessons to learn the theory behind the compositions and man, is it ever intimidating sometimes. However, I have been able to understand more than I ever did before about music in general, even though I still have a long way to go.

I recently started playing again after having been out of it for 12 years. My leads are good and melodic, but I am trying to increase my speed and play lots of harmonic minor scales as opposed to the old pentatonic blues scales.

I do very well on the older SRV and AC/DC leads, but I am having a hard time getting the pattern and speed down on some of the more pyrotechnic styles.

This leads me to a question. What was the one thing (or things) that 'unlocked the door' to your ability to combine scales and increase your speed?

I appreciate your input...Bert
 
Practicing with a metronome helped alot.Practicing 6-7 hrs. a day didn't hurt either.Wish I still had the time to do that.
 
Turn on the radio, go to a station you don't normally listen to, and try to play along with every song that comes on. You'll have to figure out the key and appropriate scale for each song but that should be easy since you've played by ear for so long.

Geting comfortable playing with various types of music and different meters should improve your improvisational skills and dexterity immensely.

As far as speed, it comes with time, don't hurry it (no pun intended).

As far as practicing 6-7 hours a day, don't do it. That's a recipe for tendinitis at the very least, especially if you're getting older.

Increase your amount of practice very gradually and be watchful for the warning signs of overuse.
 
Phyl,

Thanks for the tips. You know, I like to play along with some of the classical and jazz stations and the technique, as you stated, does wonders for your ability to improvise. The only problem is many of the songs are in non-standard tuning.

Grinder,

I remember those days as a youngster... living at home and having nothing to do but play all day long. I used to play until I could no longer make a fist or bend my wrist without it hurting.

Now I find I am not bothered by that at all and I can spend a great deal of time devoted to practice without discomfort. But 6-7 hours just isn't practical anymore.

In April of 2001, I lost the tip of my left middle finger (just behind the nail) in an accident. It was reattached and I had little feeling in the tip for what seemed like the longest time.

After about a year and a half, it began to feel just like it always did and the discomfort in the first joint stopped completely. The only finger that seems to have 'a mind of its own' now is the pinky.

Sometimes, it 'slaps' down on the fretboard instead of a nice, gentle downward motion. It is definitely getting smoother and I work it out everyday.

The most amazing thing for me is when I listen to old recordings we cut back in the 1980s. I now find some of my own work incredibly difficult to play.

I wish I would have stayed with it these past 12 years!!!...Bert
 
For fast picking, the things that have helped me are:

Practice slowly, and with a metronome.
Keep your wrist stiff and pick from the elbow
Pay close attention to your pick angle and depth
Learn to alternate pick well
Fret just hard enough for the notes to sound, and no more

And most importantly:
Really anallize the lick you are trying to learn and see what you can improve, rather than just blowing through it time after time.

For harmonic minor stuff you should, of course, study guys like Randy Rhoads and Yngwie Malmsteen.

Aaron
http://www.voodoovibe.com
 
I would try going for some triads instead of the harmonic minor scale.

They give you a much more melodic sound (IMHO) when tied to the tension/release equation.

And I wouldn't worry too much about speed - it comes along on it's own after a while - once you have flawless execution, speed is a natural byproduct.

Also - Pink Floyd's Dave Gilmour is one of the tastiest players you will ever hear in the 'Rock' world - and he rarely (if ever?) goes above an eighth note.
 
^^^ What he said!

Like you, I am a self taught. I took lessons for about five weeks as a teen. I got bored with single note, fairy tale songs fromgood ole Mel Bay's Book 1. Wish I woulda stuck with it though.

I am now the guitarist of a progressive band. My wife, the keyboardist, has theory knowledge as well as the bassist. The two of them are very powerful together. I have picked up on modes and it's unlocking doors.

The greatest thing about leads is there are usually two ways to fret most leads.

Understand your modes and become "at one" with the fretboard. By that, I mean knowing what each fret is as far as what note it is. Learn it by feel. You'll be surprised at how many different approaches you can then take to the same phrase.

I'm far from where I want to be and wish I had more time to practice, but I'm getting there.
It's difficult due to an injury i sustained at 16 yrs of age. Left arm went thru a double plated glass window. Opened my wrist up from the palm a 1/4 of the way up my forarm. Over 50 stitches inside and out. My wrist can now bend back only half as far as it used to as the tendons themselves had to be repaired and scar tissue really doesn't stretch well lol. But, if I can get damn near close, you should be able to nail it once ya get the modes and the fret board down.

All modes are scales, but not all scales are modes. But, when you play a scale, you will know what mode you are in and then transitioning to another phrasing becomes alot easier.

Timing for the speed comes from playing something over and over. Come up with excercises to coordinate your fret hand with your pick hand as one nornally wants to outrun the other. Practice with a metronome as stated above. Find your limit and then work to push it further.

Good Luck!
 
I've been playing for almost 11 years now, started when I was 14. Took (and i use the word took lightly) lessons of once a week for a month, but the guy was nothing more than some guitar store hesher that wanted to teach me cover songs. Funny, I still remember what he looked like and how he talked. Lost interest in all of that.
I had played trombone for three years in junior high, and been into music that was making a good impression on me since like 4th grade, bands like The Cure, The Smiths, Depeche Mode, U2, when other kids were listening to, well, I don't even know. Bon Jovi or something.

When I started playing guitar, all the stuff I'd listened to for years was what I wanted to hear. So, I guess over time I just learned on my own. Had a good ear for music, playing trombone helped that alot.
I had a band in high school for three years, playing guitar, that ended our senior year and that's when I consciously began making an effort to evolve away from the Nirvana/Green Day type of stuff my band did and go for the sound that I wanted, learn to sing and play at the same time.
Spent 5 years in college working on music, singing, doing my own thing. I'm now playing solo acoustic shows in Chicago and getting my band going, we've been working towards this in some capacity or another for more than a year. I'm glad we have not rushed things, I think I'm writing things now that are much more how I want them to be, thanks to buying an MR-8 and having a much better approach to putting songs together.

Things I admit to:
Only recently made an effort to remember the names of the strings on a guitar.
Don't know the names of any chords, I used to but it didn't matter much.
Can't think of any cover songs I know. Used to pick them out by ear and play them, occasionally used tab but there's too many songs to write to bother with someone elses.
I can hear scale patterns emerge if I'm playing something, but no idea what they're called.
I could care less about "The Middle Eight" and anyone who says it's some neccesary part a song needs to be good.
I have no idea how to read music.

Luckily my other guitarist is a music major in school here, so that keeps it easy for me to just create songs, write lyrics (which I obsess over, but that's another story) and whatever complications there are with things he can work out and such with our bass player.
But it's exciting, I've waited years to get the band going that I'm working on now. And I've never felt hindered by not knowing that stuff above. If you've let certain things be an influence to you sound wise, and you have a good blend of making it your own, then personally I can't see getting bothered because you don't know scales.
But on the other hand, there are people who do learn all of that because it's how they write music, I guess it's easier to do it by some guidelines than to just make it up. To each their own, I guess. :)

mg
 
I have embarked on a great study of music lately. The modes seemed very intimidating at first, until I started thinking of them as a 'mood' as opposed to a 'mode.'

They are nothing more than a series of scale patterns that project a certain feeling or mood in a musical sense. This has unlocked an incredible amount of creativity for me.

I am , personally, obsessed with knowing the names of every chord I play and have memorized all the individual positions on the fretboard. It has helped me a great deal.

One of the greatest things I learned was the natural minor for a given chord progression. It has enabled me to play a lot of music with a limited amount of movement on the fretboard.

As I progress with this learning project, I am reminded of some of my early influences. I greatly admire Rhoads and I find his work the most dificult to play. Not because of the scales and modes, but the speed at which he plays.

I find SRV, Angus Young and Gary Moore to be closer to my natural style in terms of progression.

Recently, I had the opportunity to sit in with a local band and I was aksed to play 'Crossfire' by SRV. I had been messing with this song for a few weeks and had it down pretty well. I used a Standard Strat on the middle pickup and took off on it.

As I played, I kept envisioning SRV wearing that poncho. I remember how he milked so much emotion out of a very few notes. I decided that I needed to bring the emotion to a boil with my rendition of his song and I kept most of his signature flair, but I added a few licks here and there and it really brought down the house.

I had more compliments on my performance that night than I can ever remember. It was very rewarding to say the least.

My ability to learn now (at 37) is so much better than it has ever been before and I am taking full advantage of it. I recently started taking some lessons on theory and scales/modes and it has been very interesting, even though it is a lot of stuff to remember.

I just wanted to share these thoughts and offer my thanks to all who posted. Best of luck on your musical projects...Robert
 
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