Guitar Amp Sounds Great But Records Poorly

cyberdaniel82

New member
Greetings! I have a question about recording a guitar amp, though it extends to other sound sources as well. At first listen, it may sound philosophical in nature, but I feel confident that there’s an objectively correct answer…

I have three really great-sounding electric guitar amps. I record using either a 1966 Blackface Bassman or a Special Edition Vox AC15. My best-sounding amp, however, is actually an updated Bandmaster. In the room, using my ears, it sounds phenomenal. Crunchy, mid-rangey, articulate. Recorded, though, it completely loses the magic and instead sounds flat and sterile. I’ve tried a couple of different mics and techniques with it, but I haven’t yet cracked the code to capture its wonderful live tone.

The Bandmaster uses 3 10” speakers, which is a rather uncommon configuration. My other amps both record well and feature 12” speakers. My best guess is that maybe 10” speakers, when tracked, don’t translate to my liking the way that 12” speakers do. Again, that’s entirely a guess.

This got me wondering: one of the following statements has to be true of my situation. Which one is it?

1. If a sound source (Bandmaster) sounds great to your ears, it should sound just as great recorded; you just haven’t figured out how to capture it properly.

2. Some sound sources (Bandmaster) simply don’t translate as well as others when miked up. There’s likely no magic bullet that’s going to suddenly make your Bandmaster record as well as your other two amps.

I’m sure a lot of you veteran recording engineers have encountered analogous situations. Given my anecdotal experience, I’m leaning towards answer #2. This is the first time I’ve ever had difficulty getting a sound to translate well/accurately when miked, so I’m fascinated as to whether the shortcoming is with me, or with the Bandmaster. Thanks in advance for weighing in!

- Daniel
 
The problem you're describing can have several causes. The cause most common to home recordists that I've seen comes from dialing in too much gain when recording crunch guitar. You didn't mention what general type of tone you're going for, so I couldn't say whether that is your problem or not.

The best thing to do, IMO, is post one of your recordings that you don't like in the MP3 Clinic forum on the site. Describe how the recorded sound differs from what you want. Say something like, "I want to sound like AC/DC and what I get is this...." or whatever your situation is. See what responses you get.
 
This got me wondering: one of the following statements has to be true of my situation. Which one is it?

1. If a sound source (Bandmaster) sounds great to your ears, it should sound just as great recorded; you just haven’t figured out how to capture it properly.

2. Some sound sources (Bandmaster) simply don’t translate as well as others when miked up. There’s likely no magic bullet that’s going to suddenly make your Bandmaster record as well as your other two amps.

You have not considered all possible hypotheses:

3. A setting that sounds great "in the room" will not necessarily sound great through the electronic ear of a microphone. Forget how it sounds in the room. Focus on getting a great sound through the mic. That may require totally different settings than you would use in the room. Those might even sound crap in the room, but that does not matter.
 
^^^This. Microphones are not ears. They don't hear what you do and CANT. Put on headphones with a long cord and monitor on the record end of the mic. Adjust amp and microphone to get to sound as desired. Almost always WAY less drive/distortion and WAY less top and bottom will sound better through a microphone. Even a 20k mic in the room with you still wont hear what you do.
 
Never heard of a 3-10 Fender cabinet! I had one of the big Bandmaster ones with 2-12s (one over the other, not side-by-side, which were smaller cabinets), a 1969. Sorry, off subject, but I just looked that cabinet up, and I swear I saw my old cabinet for sale on reverb.com - $200 more than I sold it for about 10 years ago! The cloth tears in the front grill sure look familiar!

But as others have said, experiment with mic placement and amp settings before giving up on it.
 
Hey Mods, forum is acting up again, I kept getting a 'do you want to leave this page' message and roll-y 'wait' thing happening and the post got duplicated.
 
Thanks for replying! I'm very appreciative to the four of you for weighing in. I'll take the tips to heart and I'll be conducting an arduous series of mic selection and placement tests in search of solutions. I'll eventually post some comparative audio files and ask for feedback if I can't resolve the problem. I have a lot to learn; I didn't even know, for example, that phase problems between different speakers was a prospective concern. I'll try two-mic combinations, too, which I've only dabbled with previously.
 
Is the sound you want to record, the sound you hear with your ear in front of the speaker, about where you would place the mic? Mic placement is key, as well as getting the amp in the sweet spot of the room, if possible.
 
I would not recommend putting your ear next to the speaker.

That's what I keep saying and people giving me shit for it. Lol :D
For a tube amp to sound good and be in it's 'sweet spot', it's usually loud. At least loud enough where I'd want my ear to be a few feet away. But up close to the speaker? Hell no!
No, it's much better to leave the aural beating for a mic.
Throw up a mic, record it, move it, record it etc. Playing around will let you know the best spot and mic for your needs
Best if you have an assistant positioning the mic while you're monitoring at your recording station.
If you got no one....well, you'll be walking back and forth.
It's good for you. Probably need more exercise anyway.
:D
 
The people recommending putting your ear next to the mic have never tried getting the cabinet out of the room where they are tracking.

As far as running back and forth adjusting the mic--five minute tops, the first time or two that you record with a new cabinet or guitar. After you figure it out, it takes no time at all.
 
The people recommending putting your ear next to the mic have never tried getting the cabinet out of the room where they are tracking.

Well isn't that the best way?? :D
Out of the room.
This way you're hearing through monitors or headphones what is actually being recorded.
No hocus pocus. When you're in a room with a Marshall and a 4×12 cooking on high heat, it can be very misleading. You got air hitting you, got guitar bouncing all around the room, you feel it chugging in your gut, and maybe most importantly....you have the emotional thrill of it all.

A mic has no emotions. A 57, which is the most common guitar cab mic, isn't going to pick up anything except what's right in front of it. Very clinical.

So, with the cab elsewhere, you're listening to what the mic can pick up.

Now that can be uninspiring compared to being in the room. You're also losing the pickup/speaker interaction you'd be getting if you're close to the cab.
The solution to that is to be in the room with your amp and have someone else engineer.

You can however, achieve that by yourself in the control room by having big monitors cranked up. Play off of those while having the cab elsewhere. Using this technique I've been able to get feedback from an amp as small as a fender champ.

:D
 
I didn’t mean crank the amp. I got this from recording at Chapman’s in Kansas City back in 1978. I was young, had what I thought was excellent sound ( because I kept hearing from standing room position). Using a 1972 Marshall with pre Rolla greenbacks( I mention this because if you’ve used this set up, you know it can sound great). I was fussing at Guido about the sound we were getting. He came in turned the amp down, said kneel down here and play. Crap was it too top end fizzy, and way to much distortion. Great learning experience.He made some tweaks, then things started to sound a lot better. Yes loud is good but, you can shape tonally at a softer volume.
Did the same thing with Ed Rose at Blacklodge. Shaped the main tone at a lower level cranked it up tracked a few bars, made some quick adjustments, sweet sounds after that. So no don’t kill your ear, but don’t be afraid to give your speakers a listen at a lower volume.
 
Last edited:
The point is - what you hear in the room, is not what the mic hears up close to the speaker. Gorge Martin preferred having the mic out several feet from the amp (of course in a quality-sounding studio) so the sound from the speaker had the chance to 'move some air'. Most of us don't have good enough rooms to do that.
 
i have to agree with this... most forget that every bit of processing, preamps,mic and it's preamp, on down the line have several processings going through a signal chain that can distort a really great signal...when i record my guitar parts i use either a Mesa Boggie or Fender both with 12" but one is different than the other ...but that being said if you use too much gain to start with it can become too distorted and thin from TOO MUCH initial gain... when i have either played live or run sound for another band i have often had to back my gain down if miced through a system for a large venue and have had to have other guitarists, clean up their signal slightly,. By the time it goes through a mic, a mixer, other EQ's associated with the system and then power amps to mains you can have too much gain at the beginning... likewise with recording...you can always add but you can not take away when it comes to recording... cut back any verb you maybe be using as well...can add it later unless there is a specific tonal thing you are looking for...but it ALL depends on genre, sound you want to get, and somestime "LESS IS MORE"... also it maybe the 10's...not a fan of micing a 10 for recording unless you try a large diaphram ( it does not have to be 3000 dollar Nuemann ) a few feet away as well as a good dynamic over the cone...what mic are you using also...if using say SM57 try a 58 etc. try the large diaphram say 3 feet away and up in the air slightly to get a "room" tone:guitar::listeningmusic:
 
I prefer the smaller Silverface amps for recording. Dont ask me why:

YouTube

This guy gets a lot out of this combination.

They always hit the mark for some reason:

YouTube
 
Last edited:
I prefer the smaller Silverface amps for recording. Dont ask me why:

YouTube

This guy gets a lot out of this combination.

They always hit the mark for some reason:

YouTube
Not just silverface, blackface, and tweeds. I had a Vox AC15 twin 10 that was a great little amp for studio. Run a Tumnus, or OCD/Tube Screamer in front of it, layering some guitar tracks, you’d have thought I was playing through a wall of Marshall’s. Excellent cleans too. I wish I still had it. It also sounded good by itself, especially if you turned it almost all the way up.
 
Back
Top