cubase records midi early

Opivy

Opivy

Nova Police
I've seen this issue addressed on a lot of forums, but no one has any kind of solution.

I've seen one person say it's only m-audio controllers that do this - anyone have any knowledge of this?

I'd hate to have to get a new keyboard... Ofcourse I could always just record, and slide the file right a little bit - I like to be able to rely on my finger timing and not my eyes/ears.
 
the same problem that these guys have

http://forum.cubase.net/phpbb2/view...ghlight=&sid=3ef228f2da81f70f9d06484d36767503

I think it's only with VST instruments.

I'll load a vst - and play a melody to the metrenome - with good timing (not trying to toot my horn) and when played back it will end up being played about an 8th note early. (i can physically slide the event over, but it's an inconvenience)

what's strange though, is if I turn the volume off of the VST instrument - and play a melody on the keyboard (without being able to hear it) it seems to work out fine. I believe one of the fellas at the cubase forums said it had something to do with sound card latency? Would a new sound card help?


(The post made by Dup on the first page of the thread i linked.)
 
mm, could it be that you are using the quantizing wrong?

Here is my quantize setup.

1275885966.jpg
 
hmm, thanks for the reply - but mines set up the same =(

I noticed though that mine was set to 1/16 instead of yours as 1/8 - what does this function even do?
 
That's the quantize number, if your quantize is set to 1/8, the grid for 1 tempo will be separated into 8 peaces.
Play with this (go from 1/4 to 1/16) watching the grid with a good zoom In, you'll get it.

Anyway that number shouldn't make any difference with your problem, i thought the other setting would be different.

Try setting "OFF" the "Auto Q" and make a recording. See what happens.

Is your "Input" for the Midi track Set as your Midi Controller?

I'm getting out of options here.

Maybe there's a problem with your soundcard drivers... Are you able to record audio without problems?
 
yup, audio is no problem. I don't know what kind of sound card I have - think that could affect it? I know "Duc" in the cubase forums said something around the lines

"that is latency from sound card buffering - totally normal". I don't want it to be normal! It's frustrating.

I noticed, that in my "Quantize" pull down menu - I can select "Nexus VST" instead of a type of note - which is the main VST I've been using.

still doesn't seem to change a thing though -
 
Hello everybody,

i'm experiencing quite the same problem with my Axiom49 Masterkeyboard an cubase 5/64 on Vista.

I still have no solution but as it appears, the Internet hat no useful suggestions on this issue and everybody ist guessing what could .. or might .. So i want to share my findings.

It seems NOT to be a Latency Problem emerging from the MIDI or Sound card Drivers. I've done a couple of tests with different Keyboards and MIDI Interfaces and the negative Offset for a certain VST Instrumeent remained static at 55 to 60 miliseconds.

I think it is an erraneous attempt of Cubase to correct the intrinsic Latency ot the VST Chain itself. In Detail:

When you play a midi note to a VST instrument it takes a while until the Sound is present on your Output. This is the combined Latency of the instrument itself and the VST processing chain (Effects etc).

When the Note is played from a MIDI Track cubase compensates for this automatically and plays the note by exact this amount early. So you never get aware of this Issue.

Now when you deliver a note from a Keyboard cubase doesn't recalculates this displacement correctly and places the Note wrong. So the placement is correct but cubase is somewehere else in the Future :-)

I've tried to correct this with a Logical Editor script to move all notes by 55 ms to the right but unfortunatly my cubase doesn't processes the fractals of seconds correctly :-(
So this seems useless for me. Maybe your cubase version is smarter.

Alternatively you can move the play offset by a couple of miliseconds but this doesn't helps in my case as i need Quantising to correct my (Guitar Players) Keyboard arts. But keep in mind, this amount is changing when you add effects etc.

I will continue to search for a solution and keep you informed. Keep tuned :-)
 
Last edited:
Now here is the Update:

after some hours of investigating i managed to solve the Problem.

To assure latency stability i took a Fireface UC and looped MIDI out with MIDI in and recorded four quarter notes played from a midi track. Timing was exact.
Then i sent the notes to halion (Drumkit Sidestick) and looped the analog master out (that what i hear) back to an input. Again recording and again eveything was in place.

That didn't change with with different latency settings so the correction of cubase was OK. But the erraneous recording displacement grew linear with greater latency configuration.
That seemed to be proof for my suspect and so i went to look for a configuration checkbox that might help.

I finally found it in theDevice Setup -> VST Audiosystem settings. That is the place where you select your ASIO Driver and the latency is displayed.
In the lower half of the window on the right there is a section named like "Advanced Options" (mine is German so be creative).
There is a Checkbox there named like "Adjust for Recording latency". Uncheck it and everything is fine.
I repeated the upper tests and nothing was wrong. And as i use direct monitoring there's nothing to worry about.
There is a help button below which unveils some information you won't find in manual.

By the way ... The (early-) dispacement ist also effective on audio recordings. So if you ever wondered why nothing was tight ... Be my guest :-)

Greetings from Munich
 
Wow! I really hope this works Jorga - Can't try it out now, but gonna give it a shot in an hour or two. This is the first time I've heard of someone figuring out how to fix the issue.

I'll report back =)
 
by damn! That worked Frank!!! You will be praised in the cubase community!

Thank you so much.

Now I have to get used to playing on this weird Oxygen 8, damn the keys feel weird. Now it's me having trouble keeping timing LOL


Thanks again!
 
New here but went through this for a while when I first started. Latency sucks, and for those that do the above and don't solve the problem, most times it's simply due to lack of a proper audio interface or usb/midi reader from your board.

My solution was to finally grab an m-audio 4/4 card and uno usb midi reader, and my whole world was better :). Latency time extremely low, audio/midi bang on re timing, and I've never looked back.

**Don't get cheap soundblaster pro types of cards either no matter how cool or hi-end they look, they are not exclusive to pro recording at all no matter how great your mic or other gear might be.

N.
 
Fix for early MIDI notes

Thanks to Frank's fix for this where he suggests using the Logical Editor function to fix the issue of Cubase recording MIDI notes too early. I have set up a keyboard shortcut to automatically shift midi notes forward by 58ms. All I do now is press "Y" after I have recorded a MIDI part on my keyboard. Not too much hassle really, one button! Here's how I did it:

Frank is correct, it doesn't work in seconds in Cubase 5 (it only works in samples for some reason despite giving a box in logical editor for milliseconds..), and nor is it logical to use ticks (fractions of a note) because you want to shift by a set amount of *time* (milliseconds) regardless of what tempo your project is at.

So you must do it in samples. It's easy:

44100kHz = 44100 samples per second. Therefore (44100/1000)x58ms = 2557.8 samples (rounded up to 2558) = 58 milliseconds.

Record a MIDI part and open Logical Editor from the MIDI menu. Open a preset from the drop-down menu and set Parameter 2 to "Samples" and enter the number of samples you want to shift by into Parameter 1. Use positive numbers to shift notes forward. Save the logical editor preset and open Key Commands (below Preferences) to assign a shortcut key.

It sure beats buying new hardware, just pressing a single button after you have recorded a live MIDI part and hearing it in perfect time (well, as I played it at least!)

FYI I tried these fixes previously:
- changing to System Timestamp checked/unchecked for both Windows MIDI and Direct Sound (after dragging 'ignoreportfilter' from the MIDI Port Enabler folder into the main Cubase folder)
- checking/unchecking "Adjust for Record Latency" and entering positive and negative values (eg. plus or minus 11000 samples) and seeing if it affected note position (it didn't for me)
- changing ASIO latency compensation in ASIO4ALL (it was a long shot I know, ASIO is only audio, not MIDI but the delay is x2 of the total latency of my ASIO input and output.. Clutching at straws really..)

Anyway good luck to anyone else who is trying to work around this somewhat annoying issue!!! ;)



Frank Jorga said:
Hello everybody,

i'm experiencing quite the same problem with my Axiom49 Masterkeyboard an cubase 5/64 on Vista.

I still have no solution but as it appears, the Internet hat no useful suggestions on this issue and everybody ist guessing what could .. or might .. So i want to share my findings.

It seems NOT to be a Latency Problem emerging from the MIDI or Sound card Drivers. I've done a couple of tests with different Keyboards and MIDI Interfaces and the negative Offset for a certain VST Instrumeent remained static at 55 to 60 miliseconds.

I think it is an erraneous attempt of Cubase to correct the intrinsic Latency ot the VST Chain itself. In Detail:

When you play a midi note to a VST instrument it takes a while until the Sound is present on your Output. This is the combined Latency of the instrument itself and the VST processing chain (Effects etc).

When the Note is played from a MIDI Track cubase compensates for this automatically and plays the note by exact this amount early. So you never get aware of this Issue.

Now when you deliver a note from a Keyboard cubase doesn't recalculates this displacement correctly and places the Note wrong. So the placement is correct but cubase is somewehere else in the Future :-)

I've tried to correct this with a Logical Editor script to move all notes by 55 ms to the right but unfortunatly my cubase doesn't processes the fractals of seconds correctly :-(
So this seems useless for me. Maybe your cubase version is smarter.

Alternatively you can move the play offset by a couple of miliseconds but this doesn't helps in my case as i need Quantising to correct my (Guitar Players) Keyboard arts. But keep in mind, this amount is changing when you add effects etc.

I will continue to search for a solution and keep you informed. Keep tuned :-)
Click to expand...
 
Workaround with Ableton Live as ReWire

Guys, I came up with a useful solution.

Check out this video:
http :// youtu.be / yOZw4znOPEQ

I basicly use Ableton Live to record midi but playing VST loaded in Cubase. Then I extract MIDI from Live to Cubase and there is a visible difference - not only with the latency, but also with a consistency in comparison to audio.
 
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