Protools "phase" issue (while recording vocals with headphones). Need help!

roland.19

New member
Protools "phase" issue (while recording vocals with headphones). Need help!

Friends at Home Recording forums,

Really hoping you can help me here. I am running protools 7.4 Mpowered, with an MAudio fast track pro interface. I am attempting to record vocals, but it is extremely phasey, almost sounding like I have a chorus effect on my voice. I cannot seem to eliminate it. Because of it, my recordings come out sounding nothing like they do when I am laying them down. It is so strange. It sounds like my vox are doubled (only during live recording). Playback sounds okay. It is just really hard for me to get into my vocal performance when it sounds like that.

Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. I can provide further details as well if necessary.
 
Not familiar with M-Audio or PT, but sounds like you are monitoring the direct monitoring signal from the m-audio AND the track monitor in PT. Turn one off, most likely the PT monitor so you get realtime monitoring from the direct monitor.
 
Not familiar with M-Audio or PT, but sounds like you are monitoring the direct monitoring signal from the m-audio AND the track monitor in PT. Turn one off, most likely the PT monitor so you get realtime monitoring from the direct monitor.

Thanks Chili,

I will try that tonight and see. I just have to figure out how to turn that off ;). I would actually rather disable the Maudio being a monitor, because I like hearing a bit of reverb on my vocals while im recording (or some cool delay). It adds to what I am doing.
 
It's probably possible to set up the routing so there's reverb from Pro Tools without the dry signal while you hear your dry signal with no latency through the M-Audio. The reverb would just have a little extra "pre-delay" from the latency. Perhaps muting the channel and making the send pre fader would do it.
 
It's probably possible to set up the routing so there's reverb from Pro Tools without the dry signal while you hear your dry signal with no latency through the M-Audio. The reverb would just have a little extra "pre-delay" from the latency. Perhaps muting the channel and making the send pre fader would do it.

Hey I think I forgot to mention that I am pretty much a newbie when it comes to this stuff. Moved up to PT from Cooledit, never had any of these issues before ;).
 
If you're okay with a little latency (delay between the time you make a sound and the time you hear it) then you should be able to turn off the M-Audio's direct monitoring by turning Mix all the way to PB.
 
If you're okay with a little latency (delay between the time you make a sound and the time you hear it) then you should be able to turn off the M-Audio's direct monitoring by turning Mix all the way to PB.

That is actually something I have tried. I turn the knob on the Fast Track pro all the way to the right (for PT monitoring) and that is when it sounds strange. When I start to blend it more to the direct Fast Track monitoring (by turning the knob to the left) the "phase" sound goes away. That leads me to believe that it is a different issue.
 
That is actually something I have tried. I turn the knob on the Fast Track pro all the way to the right (for PT monitoring) and that is when it sounds strange. When I start to blend it more to the direct Fast Track monitoring (by turning the knob to the left) the "phase" sound goes away. That leads me to believe that it is a different issue.

What you're hearing is probably just the combination of your live voice in the room and the PT output with latency.

Put a 2048 ms delay on your track and sing short words to test. I bet it wont sound weird any more because the playback doesn't overlap with the live source.
Reducing your H/W buffer size will reduce the effect, but it will never eliminate it.
If doing that isn't good enough, the best solution is to go with direct monitoring.

If you need reverb on there, patch the headphone output through some hardware, or do what BSG suggested above with the reverb aux.
It won't matter much if there's latency on your reverb.
 
What you're hearing is probably just the combination of your live voice in the room and the PT output with latency.

Put a 2048 ms delay on your track and sing short words to test. I bet it wont sound weird any more because the playback doesn't overlap with the live source.
Reducing your H/W buffer size will reduce the effect, but it will never eliminate it.
If doing that isn't good enough, the best solution is to go with direct monitoring.

If you need reverb on there, patch the headphone output through some hardware, or do what BSG suggested above with the reverb aux.
It won't matter much if there's latency on your reverb.

Ahhhhh okay that makes sense. I will try that tonight and let you know if it works. Thank you so much! When you say "patch the headphone output" are you referring to patching it through PT, or through my FTP? Also, would you be able to provide a complete novice approach to the "reverb aux" suggested by BSG?
 
Sorry, I meant maybe a little mixer with effects or something like that.

BSGs method is handy enough and free. It just sounds complex.

Set up your audio track, pipe your mic into it : All is good.

Now, go to mixer view in PT where you would add plugins. Just below the 5 plugin points, there are five send points. (If they happen to be hidden, use the menu list at the bottom left to show them)

Add a new send to your audio track and set it to 'bus 1'. Now click on it and a single fader will pop up with a few options.
This fader represents your send amount and settings.

One of the options is a button that says Pre. Activate that button. (This means even if you mute the audio track, the send will still work).

Now, create a new track - Mono - Aux track.
Put a reverb insert on it and set the input to bus 1. Keep the verb 100% wet and adjust the length and type to taste.
A nice short plate might work.

Now your mic will go where it always went AND it'll go to this aux track through the reverb.
If you mute the mic track, it'll still go through the reverb.

Now, tweak the monitoring knob on the front of your interface to balance between 'live' direct audio, and the reverb from the computer.

I'm fairly confident that will work.
 
Thanks Steenamaroo! That sounds like something that would work, I will try it tonight and let you know! Thanks so much.
 
That is actually something I have tried. I turn the knob on the Fast Track pro all the way to the right (for PT monitoring) and that is when it sounds strange. When I start to blend it more to the direct Fast Track monitoring (by turning the knob to the left) the "phase" sound goes away. That leads me to believe that it is a different issue.

Hm, that sounds like there may be a dual path within PT. If you have a reverb going make sure it is set to 100% wet.
 
That is actually something I have tried. I turn the knob on the Fast Track pro all the way to the right (for PT monitoring) and that is when it sounds strange. When I start to blend it more to the direct Fast Track monitoring (by turning the knob to the left) the "phase" sound goes away. That leads me to believe that it is a different issue.

You only get that weird sound when recording though, right?
Try the delay thing I mentioned to prove if it's just latency vs real voice bleed causing the issue.
 
when we track vocals we mute the recording tracks of audio. so only thing in the phones or monitors is everything else. pull one headphone off so you can hear your actual tone. eliminates latency of tracking alongside and hearing whats being layed down. if your throwing presets and inputs/plug ins onto the vocals just toy with it till you hear the effect you desire. then roll into the track. criticize me for spelling, punctuations, etc. but fact is this works ten fold for me and all the artists i work with. granted you wont hear yourself other than your true vocal, but if you disagree , retake it. but 98% of the time, you'll get the best track when the artist singing/tracking is hearing their true self. and its way better than hearing the effect per say and thinking it was a keeper and down road hearing a screw up. - my 2 cents of the hours ive spent polishing vocals up
 
when we track vocals we mute the recording tracks of audio. so only thing in the phones or monitors is everything else. pull one headphone off so you can hear your actual tone.

But then you're not hearing what the mic is hearing. So you won't hear if you do something that matters to the mic like get off axis or change your distance.
 
Hm, that sounds like there may be a dual path within PT. If you have a reverb going make sure it is set to 100% wet.

Could it be that you may be playing back and simultaneously recording everything to the same drive?

Not sure what type of computer you have, but if you process on one computer running protools from that hard drive and record to a different external hard drive that may clean things up for you.

I am not an expert, but for some reason this just popped into my head.

Feel free to hate all over me :)
 
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