Not sure about being a nut but you're definitely a conspiracy guy despite you saying you're not.
Las Vegas
- Thread starter Mick Doobie
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Not sure about being a nut but you're definitely a conspiracy guy despite you saying you're not.
Mick Doobie
Resist We Much
Eh, I understand where you're coming from. But I consider a "conspiracy guy" as someone who comes up with off the wall theories such as false flags, crisis actors and shit didn't really happen, inside government job, etc. Coupled with the guy's quote, i'm just using logic, imo.
I usually don't say "they" when I mean to say the singular, "he". I very rarely do. Yeah, pretty much never. I always say "he" when I mean to say "he", when I am referring to a single person.
I'm glad we are putting things in the past, if that is what we are doing. Honestly, I was just kidding around, I apologize if I was acting an ass. I try not to take a lot of this seriously and maybe in that sometimes I forget or fail to consider that there is actually another honest to goodness real person on the other end. I don't think I am alone, the net can be that way sometimes. That is no excuse, I should do better.
anyway..
Done. It's all good.
---------- Update ----------
I honestly wasn't trolling you. I was COMPLETELY joking and having fun because I thought I could and you'd get a laugh out of it.
Mick Doobie
Resist We Much
Yeah, that is kind of what I was thinking. Maybe he came to that conclusion on his own, based on all considerations, and let slip. If there are more pictures of the hotel room(and i'm sure there are), it would be interesting and possibly quite telling to see the placement of the laptops and monitors.
It was kind of odd that none of the other journalists on the panel didn't question further on his use of "they", or seek a clarification/correction.
kickingtone
New member
Me? I have zero doubt that there is a conspiracy going on, and I make zero apologies.
A conspiracy theory is just a theory that people are conspiring. That's what people -- humans -- tend to do! Start with the planning of the shooting. That, in itself, is a conspiracy. It's only a matter of who and how much conspiracy there is. In these kind of cases, if your theory doesn't contain conspiracy, there is something wrong with it!
People will conspire to cover their azz after messing up, or cover up corruption or incompetence. Yeah, at the other extreme, there are world government conspiracy theories, but bundling all conspiracy theories together is kind of wack.
Then, there is money and big money, which can make institutions and groups of people act in ways that appear to be a conspiracy, even though there is none. The system itself -- the common money objective -- "conspires" to make most people follow the MINIMUM requirement of the law, employ the MINIMUM ethical standard and social responsibility, etc. in pursuit of keeping their job and helping to maximize profit. Competitive systems "weed" out goody-two-shoes people who don't comply. Then people cover their azzes when the sh1t hits the fan. It all ends up smacking of conspiracy, but nobody is sitting in a smokey room figuring it all out. It is just common human nature at work.
Mick Doobie
Resist We Much
I think one thing is a given: The hotel initially tried to investigate and handle the situation themselves rather than involving the police. They didn't want to alarm guests with police rushing in, bad for business. The guy supposedly fired upwards of 200 rounds through the door at the security guard(s). This allegedly was roughly 6 minutes before he began shooting out the window. Based on the police scanner recordings i've heard, the first recognition by the police that they were aware of an active shooter situation was after he began firing from the window.
For the record, the hotel has released a statement saying the timeline may not be accurate. Mitigate, mitigate mitigate. It would have been much better had the initial timeline been the narrative, security guard shot after shooting on the crowd through the window, hotel security guard a hero for distracting the shooter, likely saved many lives, ect.
A lot of money is going to change hands. Lawsuits a many. It'll never go to court, optics. MGM will have to settle.
For the record, the hotel has released a statement saying the timeline may not be accurate. Mitigate, mitigate mitigate. It would have been much better had the initial timeline been the narrative, security guard shot after shooting on the crowd through the window, hotel security guard a hero for distracting the shooter, likely saved many lives, ect.
A lot of money is going to change hands. Lawsuits a many. It'll never go to court, optics. MGM will have to settle.
Mack Caster
Banned
This thread is cracking me up. You want conspiracy, here you go. Last week I took my car into Jiffy Lube. When they drove it in, I noticed the 18 year old kid, eyeballing my drain plug on the oil pan. After he looked at it for 5 min, he called his supervisor over. This is where I think the conspiracy started.
Common sense would dictate that this kid had no clue it took a 1/2" extension to remove the drain plug. That is what most people would think. Not me. In my mind, both this kid as well as his supervisor, were conspiring to steal my drain plug. At this point, I kept an watchful eye on both of them. I even called my wife to inform her of their dastardly deed. She said I was just being paranoid.
20 mins later after they were done, I confronted both of them concerning my issue. They quickly pulled me to the side, out of view of my auto. They assured me that they had no intentions of stealing my precious drain plug. While other customers were there as this conversation, and most of them backed the young kid and his supervisor, all I could think about was, they knew I was on to their scheme.
Please notice I said "most of them". It was only after I retrieved my auto in their parking lot, that some of the customers that were present during our conversation, wanted to know if I would like to start a meet up group, concerning the ever growing crisis concerning the theft of oil pan plugs.
I simply declined their offer and to all of you that are so bent out of shape over this situation in this community, just ask yourself how would you feel if you had to bury your loved one, due to this horrific incident? Would you really be on a Home Recording Forum posting your conspiracy thoughts? Do you really have that much hate that someone needs to be crucified over human error? My post to most of you is just about as silly as yours! Like I said, "Just about". GTFUAMO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Common sense would dictate that this kid had no clue it took a 1/2" extension to remove the drain plug. That is what most people would think. Not me. In my mind, both this kid as well as his supervisor, were conspiring to steal my drain plug. At this point, I kept an watchful eye on both of them. I even called my wife to inform her of their dastardly deed. She said I was just being paranoid.
20 mins later after they were done, I confronted both of them concerning my issue. They quickly pulled me to the side, out of view of my auto. They assured me that they had no intentions of stealing my precious drain plug. While other customers were there as this conversation, and most of them backed the young kid and his supervisor, all I could think about was, they knew I was on to their scheme.
Please notice I said "most of them". It was only after I retrieved my auto in their parking lot, that some of the customers that were present during our conversation, wanted to know if I would like to start a meet up group, concerning the ever growing crisis concerning the theft of oil pan plugs.
I simply declined their offer and to all of you that are so bent out of shape over this situation in this community, just ask yourself how would you feel if you had to bury your loved one, due to this horrific incident? Would you really be on a Home Recording Forum posting your conspiracy thoughts? Do you really have that much hate that someone needs to be crucified over human error? My post to most of you is just about as silly as yours! Like I said, "Just about". GTFUAMO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I would feel HORRIBLE! But knowing they were buried with a snow globe would help a little, honestly.
Mack Caster
Banned
It's funny how humor can turn to anger with the click of the mouse. Your response is typical of a "snow flake". Maybe you should just follow your avatar and do the world a favor. I am quite sure if one of your loved ones were a part of this massacre, you would still hold your same thoughts. You just seem to be that type of person. You will be the first person in this community, I will place on the "Ignore List". I don't scrap communities I am a member of and I doubt our paths will ever cross again, as I will no longer see your post. Peace out!
kickingtone
New member
So, how did you find out that the kid had no clue that it took a 1/2" extension to remove the drain plug?
I'm guessing the supervisor told you that the kid wasn't sure. Or did they tell you, "no, he was only looking at it for 30 seconds.....wait, no, 2 minutes... and he knew what to do, but he was hungry and thinking of lunch".
There is a difference between somebody giving you the facts and you deciding that they don't add up, and deciding before they have given you any inkling of their version of the facts.
Mick Doobie
Resist We Much
Mack Caster said:
"Cracking up" aside, I don't think most of us are being insensitive, making sport, expressing hate, or laughing. ymmv
Let's try not to turn this thread into something it is not.
andrushkiwt
Well-known member
I think the issue is that they don't have all the facts yet. It seems some are taking errors as being facts, and like I said, the quicker they push to get "facts" out, the more likely they are to get them wrong.
kickingtone
New member
"All the facts, yet" is sophistry, my friend.
You'll never have all the facts.You don't actually need all the facts to know if they conflict. If somebody is in Timbuktu and Moscow at the same time, no number of additional facts is going to square that. Identifying such conflicts helps, not hinders, your acquisition of the facts.
And pushing for facts is not the same thing as pushing for conclusions. The more you push for facts, the sooner you'll get facts.
Mack Caster
Banned
The only true part about my story was the kid not knowing how to remove the drain plug. The rest of the story was simply a metaphor on how any situation, can turn into a conspiracy depending on a persons line of thinking. Kinda like the beef between the people who support either the Reps or Dems at this time in the US. Once someones mind is made up, even cold hard facts will be ignored and most of the time, this is what leads to the conspiracy theory.
As far as the kid goes, it was when he had a 2# hammer trying to force a 1/2 straight blade screw driver into the recessed oil pan plug, so he could use the vise grip pliers to turn the screw driver shaft counter clockwise to remove it. I figured it must have been his first day or something. Kinda like ordering a plain cheese burger and getting it home to find out, it was just a hamburger. I guess I got what I asked for maybe. After all, it was most definitely plain.
With all do respect, I never called anyone else out or commented on them being insensitive other then the person I placed on my ignore list. IMHO, I think this thread deals more with how conspiracy starts, than what happened in Vegas.
I am glad you made the post as it is interesting to see how others judge what happens when facts are given immediately, verses being withheld or revised days later. All human beings have different methods of when and how, they except or perceive what is or is not true, due to their own beliefs as well as experiences.
Now, my wife thinks JFK was killed by an order given by the Church. She thinks this way due to his willingness to pass new laws that would limit their power/authority as well as their finances. She also believes that Marlin Monroe was killed over what she heard while banging the staff in the White House. It would not matter what facts were placed in front of my wife, this is what she believes and that will never change.
Myself, it really does not matter to me what happened or why as my opinion would carry very little weight. The simple fact remains that they both died and people were, and have always been suspicious, of the information that was and has been, and still is being released to the public.
kickingtone
New member
OOOOkay then ... metaphors.
We are only trying to find out who is telling us facts and who is telling us "metaphors". I sense that we are being told quite a few "metaphors", so far.
See, I think that it is legitimate to ask questions in order to clarify a story, just as I questioned your story.
A line of thinking is not a theory (an hypothesis, maybe). Investigators generate lines of thinking all the time for elimination or corroboration. The line of thinking is not the problem, it is how some people tend to deal with it that is the problem.
kickingtone
New member
This is interesting. Do you vote, at all?
It is a curious position to take, that it is not worth having an opinion unless it "carries considerable weight". Isn't the "danger" in all this the amount of weight people want their opinions to carry getting out of control?
Anyway, a conspiracy theory means a theory that a conspiracy was involved. It does not mean a theory that takes no account of facts. You need to find another word for that kind of theorist.
Remember the Oscar Pistorius case? I read the evidence that was available in the media at the time and my opinion was that he was guilty of murder. A lot of people were saying that you have to "wait and accept the opinion of the courts". I said that there is a difference between agreeing with an opinion and accepting an opinion. "Accepting the opinion of a court" means that you DO NOT PREJUDICE somebody based on your personal opinion. It does not mean that your personal opinion MUST change and align with the court's.
When the judge delivered the sentence, I still disagreed with it BASED ON THE FACTS. I said that I thought she had misinterpreted the law. I pinpointed what I thought was the error. (The case related to whether Pistorius firing 4 shots into a tiny bathroom was likely to kill whoever was in the bathroom. The judge only took into account whether it was proven that Pistorius knew that Reeva Steenkamp (sp?) was in the bathroom.)
Of course, people were saying, "What? Are you a judge? Are you from South Africa? Shut up!"
They wouldn't answer the point I made!When the case went to appeal. The appeal court came up with the same argument I had made -- that the judge had misinterpreted the law for the reason I had given.
So, my opinion carried little weight. So what? I can still hold it. No harm done, and it doesn't mean that it is wrong.
Mack Caster
Banned
I respectfully disagree with the letters in red above concerning your statement and as far as I know, both words can be interchanged as well. But it has been years since I stepped into a class room and since Pluto is no longer a planet, maybe this has changed as well. Either way, it really don't matter. Peace Out!
The·o·ryˈTHirē/
noun
noun: theory; plural noun: theories
- a supposition or a system of ideas intended to explain something, especially one based on general principles independent of the thing to be explained.
"Darwin's theory of evolution"
synonyms:
hypothesis, thesis, conjecture, supposition, speculation, postulation, postulate, proposition, premise, surmise, assumption, presupposition; Moreopinion, view, belief, contention
hy·poth·e·sishīˈpäTHəsəs/
noun
noun: hypothesis; plural noun: hypotheses
- a supposition or proposed explanation made on the basis of limited evidence as a starting point for further investigation.
"professional astronomers attacked him for popularizing an unconfirmed hypothesis"
synonyms:
theory, theorem, thesis, conjecture, supposition, postulation, postulate, proposition, premise, assumption; Morenotion, concept, idea, possibility
"his “steady state” hypothesis of the origin of the universe"
- Philosophy
a proposition made as a basis for reasoning, without any assumption of its truth.
- Philosophy
Mack Caster
Banned
Yes I do vote and have done so since I turned 18. Even when I was in the Milatary I always submitted it through the proper process. From my local county up to the state and national elections.
See, that is your opinion and since we do not know each other, it carries no weight with me, therefor, it means nothing to me. Not trying to be disrespectful at all, just the way I am and I see no reason to change.
If I understand your statement correctly, I would say no. People are always going to have opinions and the higher up the ladder you are, the weight it will carry. Now, I am going to jump off this thread and leave others to express their own opinions. I need to pack a feild bag and go do some recording at my local GC. Peace Out!
andrushkiwt
Well-known member
Well, my friend, considering that they can only be in one place at a time, knowing where they ACTUALLY are is the fact. So, having the FACT is what tells you what's actually going on. If someone says they are in two places at once, then those cannot both be facts. The issue is trying to figure out which is, indeed, a FACT. I am not sure you understand the definition of the word, or you would not have suggested that both can be facts.
And no. The sooner you push for facts the sooner you will get less accurate information. This is true in nearly every field. Please stop spreading false information. And pick up a dictionary.
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