VF80/160 operation

[billisa]

How similar are these in terms of operation? They appear to be very similar. I have been toying with shifting from a VF80 to a VF160, essentially for more tracks, and I'm wondering how much of a new learning curve this will entail...

[LOPEZRECORDS]

I don't know much about the vf80 but i have the 160 i have had it for about a year and finally got around to it. With help of these forum's now it seem's very symple it's a cake walk. With your experience with a similar unit you should be set. Hardeware difference's who know's (IM HAPPY!!)

[Garry Sharp]

Bill - I'm thinking the same. Our band's going very well and I want to record 8 tracks simultaneously. VF160 or Yamaha AW16G?

[billisa]

Originally posted by Garry Sharp
Bill - I'm thinking the same. Our band's going very well and I want to record 8 tracks simultaneously. VF160 or Yamaha AW16G?

Hey Garry,

There's an aw16.com site that I looked at for a while. I did this to check out potential problems (what kind, how many). It might be worth checking there for a bit. Back a while ago I got the sense that the aw16 had a few consistent issues -- such that I've never noticed on my Fostex. (Freezing, losing data, preamps that had to be replaced, need to re-format the HD, back-up issues). When you go to aw16.com check out the "bugs" forum. You'll see what I mean. Stuff you just never hear about here... But then, forums may not present the most accurate picture of a particular brand on a wider level.

Personally, I imagine it would be hard to go really wrong either way. The Yamaha looks nice, but the VF160 (like the VF80) seems like it's tougher.

I'm not sure if the aw16 records @ 24bit (or even if that really matters). Part of me is biased toward a system I already know.

Because I don't record entire bands I may just stay with the VF80, and start freeing tracks up by bouncing, etc. But I also noticed the VF160 has a compressor you can use on individual tracks prior to mixdown.

[Garry Sharp]

Thanks for that Bill. I've just been to the shops to have a look. They're even on price over here (just below £800 with CD burner). The Yamaha looks nicer visually!!!

I'll check the site out.

Garry

[billisa]

Originally posted by Garry Sharp
Thanks for that Bill. I've just been to the shops to have a look. They're even on price over here (just below £800 with CD burner). The Yamaha looks nicer visually!!!

I'll check the site out.

Garry

Noticed on the newstand today that ProAudio magazine just reviewed the aw16. They also just did the VF160 last July. Positive reviews on both.

A quick glance seemed to confirm the aw16 records @ 16bit 44khz, though the effects are 32bit. On the VF160, the reviewer noted one potential issue: the inputs are rated to take up to +2dbV (not +4, like the VF80). He said some pro equipment with a +4dbV rating would be too hot for the VF160, even with the trim all the way down. I don't know what type of gear runs this hot and can't imagine how Fostex would overlook this, but with your application, maybe this is worth checking into.

Lastly, one thing about the Yamaha is it uses a 2.5" drive. not a 3.5" like the VF160. I've read comments that this causes some slow drive issues. I don't know why Yamaha chose the 2.5...

This is not to dis the aw16, but reading through the posts on the "bugs" forum is a little scary. There seems to be a lot of backing-up/reformatting going on.
Soon I would expect some of our full-time VF160 users to chime in...

[Garry Sharp]

Bill

Read the AW16 forum. On balance I don't think the buggy issues are any worse than some we have heard here on the Fostex. Trawling around the Yammie seems to get consistently better feedback on quality, although that is definitely anecdotal. I am so impressed with my new Yamaha mixer that also is an influence. Also the Y actually comes in £40 cheaper.

Interesting that at this price point and functionality there are only two choices. Once I've sold the VF80 I'm pretty sure I'll be getting the AW16G.

Would be nice if a VF160 user or two pitched in though - decision is not definite yet.

By the way why don't you use an outboard compressor - the 160 seems an expensive way for you to go just for that, and you'd get better control and quality with an outboard, even with an extra D/A A/D cycle.

[billisa]

Originally posted by Garry Sharp
Bill

By the way why don't you use an outboard compressor - the 160 seems an expensive way for you to go just for that, and you'd get better control and quality with an outboard, even with an extra D/A A/D cycle.

Actually, I am very close to getting an FMR-RNC (Really nice compressor). I haven't really needed a compressor, given what I do, but with my son recording vocals for his songs I think I should probably get one...

Right now I've got Studio Projects B1's running through their VTB1 preamps, so the signal is very quiet -- I've been loath to add more things to the chain, but the RNC is supposed to be pretty quiet, and the best compressor under a grand. (US$270.)

Yamaha obviously makes great, musical gear, so I can't blame you for shifting. I think "Axe4yahweh" (a VF160 owner) did a comparison on the two...

[Axe4Yahweh]

I was faced with the same choices when I bought my VF160CDR last Jan. The Fostex is expandable. You can record 8 Tracks at once out of the box and up to 16 Tracks at once with an ADAT add on mixer. You can use external effects with the Fostex. The Yammie is a closed box and can do neither. Just depends on whacha wanna do recording wise.

CR ><>

[Garry Sharp]

Well, the newly purchased AW16G is sitting downstairs as we speak

I did notice the expandability point before choosing it. I felt that if we ever went to more than 8 simultaneous trax we'd be moving into pro level anyway. (in other words a paid for studio) As it is, I'm planning 5 drum mics, guitar, bass and lead vox in one take. That would be done in the rehearsal studio. Capture the live feel that we are very keen on that way and redo vox plus overdubs and add BV's in our nice sounding front room at home.

Who knows. I'm sure I've screwed it up but finding out why is part of the journey

[billisa]

Originally posted by Garry Sharp
Well, the newly purchased AW16G is sitting downstairs as we speak

I did notice the expandability point before choosing it. I felt that if we ever went to more than 8 simultaneous trax we'd be moving into pro level anyway. (in other words a paid for studio) As it is, I'm planning 5 drum mics, guitar, bass and lead vox in one take. That would be done in the rehearsal studio. Capture the live feel that we are very keen on that way and redo vox plus overdubs and add BV's in our nice sounding front room at home.

Who knows. I'm sure I've screwed it up but finding out why is part of the journey

Does this mean you won't answer anymore VF80 questions? :-( Good luck with the new machine. :-) If you find any initial questions arise, I hope you also find someone as helpful/knowledgeable as you were for me. Your assistance made a big difference. Thanks.

By the way, one aw16G tip. If you want something saved, you must specifically save it -- don't just power down or the session will be gone.

[Garry Sharp]

Thanks Bill

I was hoping you all wouldn't mind if I hung out here from time to time anyway