Help! MD8 and a DMP3?

[COOLCAT]

So recently, i added a DMP3 pre-amp.
QUESTION???

1) will the 48V phantom hurt the unbalanced input/ 1/4" jack?
2) can I use a balanced cable from the DPM3 to the MD8 (how)?
would this be better.

i was surprised the DMP3 didn't have the three prongers on it..hmmm...

IMO/ Recommended....
I just added a pre-amp going into Ch1 Line In and a reverb in Aux 1&2 and it was a huge,huge difference to my recordings.
Much time wasted swapping mics with no change.

think I'm still missing a good compressor to tame down the incoming & final mix.....

[Son of Mixerman]

Originally posted by COOLCAT
So recently, i added a DMP3 pre-amp.
QUESTION???

1) will the 48V phantom hurt the unbalanced input/ 1/4" jack?

Nope, the phantom power is drawn from the preamp by the microphone at the pre's input. The output will be at the level the MD8 inputs are expecting as long as your preamp gain is down at zero when you plug them on. Make sure the md8 is off when you plug in the dmp3 into the md8 and make sure if you using the channel 1 and 2 that the phantom is off.

Originally posted by COOLCAT


2) can I use a balanced cable from the DPM3 to the MD8 (how)?
would this be better.

For short distances, unbalanced is actually a better audio connection, as cables get longer they act like an antenna reciever and the balancing help reject interference. If you only going a few feet unbalanced is preffered. Just plug the cables into the md8 inputs.

Originally posted by COOLCAT



i was surprised the DMP3 didn't have the three prongers on it..hmmm...

If you look close the dmp3 might have balanced TRS 1/4" connectors, looks like a headphone plug.

Originally posted by COOLCAT


IMO/ Recommended....
I just added a pre-amp going into Ch1 Line In and a reverb in Aux 1&2 and it was a huge,huge difference to my recordings.
Much time wasted swapping mics with no change.

think I'm still missing a good compressor to tame down the incoming & final mix.....

O good compressor is the RNC...$175 roughly and shames lots of more expensive ones for clarity. If your looking for something cheap with character..yet a little dirtier I use the DBX 166. I also have the 3630, but I think you can find alot better, you sorta need to now the ins and outs of compression before you delve into tweaking a 3630. (I feel a sousman flame).

I hope this helps answer your questions.

SoMm

[COOLCAT]

so thanks first, for the help.
no issue with the 48V...that's cool..

now, the DPM3 has balanced outputs.1/4" style.

the MD8 has balanced 3 prong/ and 1/4" unbalanced options.

which is better?

it's a home setup so I don't have the long cable issues.

yeah, i sold one 3630 to pay for my new SPB1.~&70
i still have another 3630 too, you know the 3630 does have the noise gate which is nice and as i've mentioned i have never compared compressors side to side....saving for a RNC...

i did have the Prsonus little mono- single channel tube pre-amp, while waiting for the DPM3 to arrive. It was a little noisier, with the shshhssshhhh sound....but it had a nice tone.
I'm still playing with the DPM3...and SPB1....it's a definite upgrade for me so can't complain..

Appreciate the info....long live gear heads!!

[jake-owa]

Son of MM, I have never thought that unbalanced connections could be better. I always thought that a balanced signal which is usually +4 gave you a lower noise floor and therefore is ALWAYS better.

Where am I getting it wrong?

[Richard Monroe]

Whether the connector is balanced or unbalanced has nothing to do with whether it puts out +4 or -10. The DI inputs on the DMP3 are high-z inputs, intended gor bass or guitar, and phantom power is not applied to those inputs. It doesn't matter whether the phantom power is on or off, it's only applied to the XLR mic inputs. The output is 1/4" balanced, outputs at +4, and will accept either a TRS or TS out. It probably doesn't matter whether you use TS or TRS cables, as long as the runs of cable are short. Just don't expect those 1/4" inputs to provide phantom power, because they don't.-Richie

[Son of Mixerman]

Originally posted by jake-owa
Son of MM, I have never thought that unbalanced connections could be better. I always thought that a balanced signal which is usually +4 gave you a lower noise floor and therefore is ALWAYS better.

Where am I getting it wrong?

Balanced is to reject interference over long cable lengths, once the cable connects to the board, the signal is unbalanced for processing. Most big boards and older equipment had a grounding bus bar where all the incoming balanced lines had their grounds commonized at he bus bar, just like your main breaker panel for your home or business. The lower noise floor is only an issue once youve' exceeded a certain length. An unbalance cable has a higher resistance as it gets longer, and the longer it gets because of higher resistance the more susceptable it becomes to noise from outside sources. Most Mastering consoles are entirely unbalanced connections because they are passive in nature.

The +4 -10 issue has some historical reasons. Most VU meters require a +4 signal to operate, the reasons were technical and was decided upon what I call and AES comittee. Mixer boards or devices that operate at +4 requires a heavier duty PSU, especially 72 and up input boards. The connection types are all interchangeable as far as +4 and -10, but balanced requires 3 wires. My Ramsa desk has switchable +4/-10 RCA connectors at the 8 bus's, all my outputs have both +4 RCA and -10 RCA so I can match just about any piece of gear to it. All my channel inputs are TRS +4, but the tape i/o are -10, everything is wired so I don't have alot of fussing. I have a bunch of line transformers to balance and unbalance signals to optimize every line. I hope this makes senss and may be could be said more clear and more technical.

SoMm

[COOLCAT]

So as I understand the posts....reiterate?

DPM3
CHANNEL1:
DMP3 INPUT/ SP-B1 w/ Phantom ON::::::NO PROBLEM/OK

DMP3 Output- 1/4", 2 conductor cable going to the MD8 IN 1/4":::::::NO PROBLEM/OK

So if I get this right, nothing will be gained by adding a 1/4" stereo plug(DPM3 Out) to a 3-Pin XLR (input MD8 board)?
My undrestanding is balanced/unbalanced won't matter on such a short cable.??? CH1 is as good as it gets?

Next problem arose........CHANNEL 2
DPM3
CHANNEL2:

So then I plugged in my SM57, XLR IN DMP3 CH2 and a 1/4" 2 conductor DMP3 Out the MD8 Board CH2 1/4" IN
..... but now there's little to no volume on the SM57 side

I swapped with the SP B1 and CH2 was fine...and if I plug the SM57 XL straight to the MD8 it has volume from the MD8 Pre-amp.
(so the mic and cables and CH2 inputs are working)

???why is the SM57 volume now disappearing??

[Richard Monroe]

Are you using the hi or lo output (the DMP3 gives you the option)? The output on an SM57 is waaay lower than a condenser. You will need to use the high output option and crank that sucker a bit.-Richie

[COOLCAT]

my sm57 went out!
i just tried all the combo's of connecting...

and the %^& SM57 is out of operation, defunct, no more....

does Shure have a lifetime warranty?.......

love the DMP3 and SP-B1....add a little TC M300 slapback with plate....mmmmmm...wonder what a RNC would do...oh baby..


I thought SM57's were indestructable?but this is not true.

[Son of Mixerman]

Originally posted by COOLCAT


Next problem arose........CHANNEL 2
DPM3
CHANNEL2:

So then I plugged in my SM57, XLR IN DMP3 CH2 and a 1/4" 2 conductor DMP3 Out the MD8 Board CH2 1/4" IN
..... but now there's little to no volume on the SM57 side

I swapped with the SP B1 and CH2 was fine...and if I plug the SM57 XL straight to the MD8 it has volume from the MD8 Pre-amp.
(so the mic and cables and CH2 inputs are working)

???why is the SM57 volume now disappearing??

Its possible that while plugging the 57 into the channel one and 2 xlr inputs that you blew the opamp on the phantom power circuit. Was the phantom power on when you were plugging and unplugging the mic's? Plug the 57 straight into a guitar amplifier and see if it works there, if it doesn't the 57 is gone. if it does then the phantom power opamp went bye bye. Mine did that last year while writing some songs, I had accidentally left the phantom on while plugging in various dynamic mics into channel 2. Slowly my signal went away. Until it was all but gone. If thats the case you can call Yamaha and get it repaired for a hefty price. Mine was free under warranty....I squeeked in by days literally. Bummer, check your cables to see if one of those aren't damaged..check everything three times before fixing or buying replacements mic's.

SoMm

[COOLCAT]

yea, I'll try, try, and try again...
but I think form my first troubleshooting the SM57 is gone?

never heard of that happening.
hate to admit it but I may have plugged and unplugged the SM57 with the Phantom on...as the SP B1 is in CH1 and there's only one Phnatom power switch.......

really pisses me off...i could have put $70 toward..something else.

can you fix a SM57 cheap?

[COOLCAT]

On the lucky side, my new DMP3 is in good shape.
Phantom power etc, SPB1 all is well...with everything.

except the SM57. its dead.

I called Shure they wanted $56 to repair it?
The tech on the phone said it's probably the element.

So how does an Element just go out???
I mean it was working fine one day, then the next day it went out?

Anyone have a good place to purchase these Elements let me know...no pun intended.