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#1
08-14-2003
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antares atr1a
Does anyone have experience with these? I'm probably going to buy one and use it in conjunction with an aw2816. I wonder if it's best to use these live as you record, or lay down the track first and then manipulate it. Also, if you do the latter, wouldn't the "corrected" vocal have to go onto a separate track?
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#2
08-14-2003
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I'm looking at one of these units too. I use an AW4416. You do have to record on one channel and then loop it to another channel...... or go through it when you record.
I figure I can record the initial vocal on say track 1.....then loop it through the autotune to whatever.... and then record some other instrument on one of track 1's virtual tracks..... leaving the original vocal there just in case. I've done this with other outboard effects.
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#4
08-14-2003
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Thanks for the reply kjam, I kinda figured that's what I'd have to do. I know they say there's a 4ms delay and that's probably not noticeable, but if it is, then I suppose you'd have to time-slip the vocal track to match the original. I saw that price on zsounds also; thought it was funny that there's one on ebay for $350 not including shipping.
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#5
08-14-2003
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Quote:
 I'll let you know.
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#6
08-15-2003
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The hardware version is really useless... mainly because it only offers "auto" mode - which is very inflexible.
The software version features both the "auto" and graphical modes - the auto mode is equally useless in the plug, but the graphic mode is what makes this tool effective and is really the only way to use these properly without undue artifacts.
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#7
08-15-2003
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Quote:
That "undue artifacts" is going to be the key isn't it? I figure if I dont' like it I'll put it on ebay for a couple hundred bucks and tell my wife this wasn't a good birthday present afterall and I need to replace it
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#8
08-15-2003
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Just as an FYI -- taken from this thread, the topic was the Antares Vocal Producer....
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#9
08-15-2003
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Yeah..... the unit I bought isn't the Vocal Processor. I'm not trying to model mics. I just want something that will fix intonation in my voice when it ain't right. We'll see how good it works for that.
Like I say... if it isn't good... I'll sell it for what I can and minimize the damage.
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#10
08-15-2003
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#11
08-15-2003
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Quote:
__________________
"Nobody digs ya music, butcha self"
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#12
08-15-2003
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I have the precursor to the ATR1A and even thought it is auto you can set up any scale you want and eliminate notes you don't want acted on. This way you can fine tune to just the notes you need to have corrected.
It is a bit laborious but sounds a little cleaner with the hardware. The plug in is nice though. Very convenient.
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#14
08-16-2003
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Quote:
Listen guys - I'm not talking out my ass here... this is DIRECT EXPERIENCE .... I had to use the Autotune to fix up vocal tracks many times... I know what works well and what doesn't work. In auto mode, if the note is any more than a few cents off the mark, it doesn't work transparently - it leaves significant and obvious artifacts. So from what I've seen with many novice/hobby singers is that the "fixing" they need, far exceeds the Autotune's range of usefulness in Auto mode. This is what makes the h/w version so limiting. The s/w version allows you to home in on a specific note (or set of notes) and adjust those artifact-free (unless the note is more than 2-3 cents off - beyond that, you're still subject to the same chipmunk-effect that occurs if pitch a multitrack up/down excessively to record a vocal)... I'm trying to save you some effort here, but hey - the only way you'll know is if you buy it and try it. Don't be too disappointed with your experience though - you *were* forewarned!
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#15
08-16-2003
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Quote:
The hardware version that is due to arrive today is advertised as being able to pick specific notes within a scale to "home in" on. I'm going to run it after the fact in a loop. I don't plan on running it for the whole song. But I think I can punch it in and out in the right spots with it set for specific notes. In fact... it's advertised that you can midi in the exact sequence of a section of notes. But if it only works when the pitch is 2 or 3 cents off..... man that is a close tolerance. Lots and lots of guitar tunners don't even measure that close. I don't think my ears even hear it that close anymore. I'll probably run my voice through that and cause a power drain or blackout on the whole mid-west.
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#16
08-16-2003
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Too literal... I meant maybe 20-30 cents.... and it's not that it doesn't work - it's that it doesn't work without obvious glitching!
As far as "blah-blah-blah as advertised" - keep in mind that the marketing department writes the spec sheet and feature list, NOT the engineering department! Anyways - all I can say is - "you'll see what I mean...!" Good luck!
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#17
08-18-2003
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Well the update on my ATR1A is that I still don't have it. I paid extra for two day shipping ..... but 2 day shipping to Zzounds means you buy it Thursday and get it the next Wednesday.
I've bought from them before. But I talked to their customer service on the phone.... and it is apparent that they need the $7 dollars I paid in shipping much more than they need my future business. They do have a 30 day money back guarantee for "any reason". So Blue Bear.... if this thing is as bad as you say.... I'll gladly pay to ship it back and cut my loses.
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#18
08-19-2003
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Personally I've found that the graphical mode, though better than the auto mode is a huge pain in the ass! I want full screen directx plugins, not a 4x4 inch square.
Guys come in here do one vocal take and say,"so you have autotune right?" and they think they're done. It's a great plugin/effect to really lock up the vocal melody, but if you can't sing, autotune won't do it for you. Eric P.S. Anyone ever work with melodyne? It's a seperate pitch correction program, its got a really great interface but the pitch correction "engine" sucks compared to the one in autotune. Maybe they have a new better version, I haven't seen it in a long time. Also, If i remember it was very expensive.
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#19
08-19-2003
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I have Melodyne, and it glitches MUCH less than Autotune....
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#20
08-20-2003
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really blue? what version are you using? I haven't seen any of the newer versions, in fact I haven't seen the program at all in a couple of years. This was before autotune was an industry standard. When I tried to use the program I would get a lot of pops between two notes and occasionally i would get a "robot" note. Maybe it was user-inflicted damage, I only got to play with it for a few days. But as I said before, the user interface is SOOO much better than autotune.
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#21
08-21-2003
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Ok I'm gonna jump in here
I've used the whole Auto-Tune thing for a while. I have the plug-in, and it is OK (as long as you always hit the note). The silly thing about auto tune is that if you can already sing really well, then it will make you sound incredibly perfect. Using an attack time of 30ms or more makes the whole process fairly invisible, also (see below). However, if you can't hit the note, then auto-tune will only tip you to the closest note, which it may have difficulty determining if you waver a lot. On a side note, having auto tune actually forced me to learn how to sing better! Go figure. However, Antares does warble, even when you sing really well. Something wrong with their algorithem, I think. Even the best, most in-tune performance will usually have maybe one or two warbles for no good reason. Kind of ruins the illusion, if you know what I mean. Graphical mode is a massive pain in the ass. I have no patience, and would rather sing it again rather than spend an hour fixing the first take. I just got a TC Helicon Voiceworks. It (and VoiceOne) feature TC's answer to Autotune. I noticed right away that it is far more steady than Antares. My vocal takes no longer warble. It also has different parameters than Antares: a "Correction Window" where YOU control how many cents out-of-tune a note can be before it doesn't get corrected, and "Amount" which controls just how much a note gets corrected (measured in percentages. For example, if I set it to 80% then a note 10 cents flat will be corrected by 5 cents, and a note 50 cents flat will be corrected by about 40 cents. I don't understand their math, either, but it does cut down on that "too perfect to be real" sound.) The third setting is of course the standard "Attack" time. The nice thing about the "Correction Window" is that if you set it to about 75 cents, then you can still sing uncharted accidentals, and the autotune won't try to fix it (and warble because you are right between 2 notes). I really like tracking my vocals through the Voiceworks Autotune, maybe because I learned (from past experience with Antares) to sing very precisely, and now every time I record with Pitch Correction on it sounds really natural. The secret really is that Correction Window--it allows you some leeway before correcting you.
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#22
08-21-2003
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If you can sing, then there's really no need for the autotune.... and if you can't sing, then you have no business being recorded in the first place!!!!!!!!!!!
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#23
08-22-2003
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I think I'm going to start charging and extra and totally seperate auto-tuning rate, like $50 an hour for me to sit and draw out the melody that you just couldn't hit
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#24
08-22-2003
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Tell that to Madonna and JLo, Blue Bear!
I don't use pitch correction because I can't sing. I can, and I'm good. I use it to save time on retakes, and because I WANT that "too in-tune to be real" sound that is pop music right now. Pitch-processing a vocal that sounds really good to you already just takes it to the next level. Unless you want to sound like Madonna or Boy George (or Cyndi Lauper) in the 80's, pitch correction of some kind is a necessity. Back then, that's how singers sounded, so the public accepted it. Now the masses have realized that perfection is possible, and they don't want to hear the occasional off or "nearly there" note. Turn on the radio; everyone--punk, rock, pop, dance and electonica, R&B--everyone sonds perfect. Is it mass voice lessons or magic? My guess is magic.  To go Freudian on you, I guess my big personal issue is overcompensation--I record vocals in my bedroom, so I go overboard to ensure that the finished product is totally professional sounding, so nobody would ever guess. If pitch correction is overboard. I really believe it's the new standard; the rule, not the Cher exception.
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#25
08-22-2003
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Quote:
http://homerecording.com/bbs/showthr...threadid=96265
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