Problems with a mic'ing a metal snare

[alien]

Ok,

I've mic'ed alot of snares in my day, but this one is giving me fits!

It is a metal Sonor snare. Not quite as deep as the standard Pearl Export series, but more than adequate. The drummer has it tuned high for a very cutting POW!, but it also retains some low end depth.

I am using a known good SM57. I have tried top and bottom placement at various distances from the head and various angles. I have also tried it both with and without a compressor and gate as well. I have also disengaged the EQ on the console (Soundtracs Solo series) to no avail.

I will need the gate to keep a high level of leakage of the hihat into the snare mix.

I lose the depth of the snare when test recording. I receive a weak PONK! as though the snares were barely enagaged. It also hasn't any punch. If I mic from the bottom I get mainly the sound of the snares.

This is driving me nuts. I have a great kick sound (using an Audix D4 mic).. Nicely compressed, gated, and sidechained. The toms, hat, and cymbals all are crisp, clear, and defnitive.

Please, someone offer some suggestion before I claw my way all the way through the wall.

Thanks!

[Jblount]

If you got 2 57's put one on top and on one bottom (to get the actual snare sound). Hook your eq back up. Try boosting 250-300 hz range for depth, and try boosting anything from the 3k to 10k range for the crispness and attack. You will probably have to really play around with the eq.

[alien]

Thanks for the advice!

I had this problem before while running live sound, but was always able to conquer it. I was playing with it this afternoon & I finally got it!

There was ONE loose wire in the snares that was being pronounced in recording, but to the ear it was just fine. clipping was one option, but I took another route before taking a set of cutters to the drummer's snare LOL.

I took a 3 1/2" sqaure piece of polishing cloth. I loosely taped it over the snares with small pieces of gaffer's tape. Not only did it take care of loose snare wire, it also got rid of a small amount of lower head ring I was noticing.

I mic'ed the bottom head from the hihat side. I clamped from the top rim though. This allows some of the top head to make it into the mic as well via travelling thru the claw. I went steeper than a 45 degree angle, but I also am not going in at a straight angle on my azimuth either.

I'll take a pic and post it later.

Oh yeah, I did boost my mids in the EQ and that brought out the sweet spot! Thanks!

[MarkoPolo]

Did you phase reverse the bottum snare mic??

[alien]

No, no phase reversal.

Taking it one mic at a time actually. I try to get a good mix without reversing phases if possible.

So far it's working fairly well. This evening I will set the level for the toms and test the entire mix.

So far, the kick, snare, and hat sound really good

[MarkoPolo]

In most cases when using two mics on the snare one bottum
and one top mic you will need to phase reverse the bottum mic.
if you try it you will probably hear a big differance, I f you dont have phase reversal on your board or preamp you can take an
XLR cable and change the wireing on one side of the cable,
I think its switching pin 1 and 2 around but I havent done it in awhile and my diagrams are in my studio.
Make sure you lable that cable if you do this.

[alien]

I apologize, I guess I wasn't originally clear

I'm using only one mic on the snare. If I were using two, I would definitely try reversing phase

[MarkoPolo]

I just misunderstood when you said you tried top and bottum on
the snare.
By the way its pin two and three that get reversed not pin 1
pin 1 is the ground. I was wrong with my guess.

[alien]

No problem. I knew what you meant

On older equipment though, always check you ground pin!!!

Before it became standard for Pin 1 to be ground, many put it on Pin 3.

Really messed me up on an old EQ I had once. Hook it up and the sound would go bye bye LOL!

[alien]

I FINALLY GOT IT ALL DIALED IN LAST NIGHT!


Ok, sorry for shouting, but I finally got it lol.

That kit, as good as it sounds, has been an absolute beast relative to mic positioning.

[Track Rat]

Originally posted by alien

Before it became standard for Pin 1 to be ground, many put it on Pin 3.

Wrong. Pin one on an XLR has always been shield. In the states for the most part, pin two is hot and pin three is return. Some stuff made overseas had pin one shield, pin two return and pin three hot but now most everyone is on the same page.

[alien]

I will double check tonight, but I am almost positive that on that old EQ pin 1 was routed to hot via the PC board....not by wiring.

I'm double checking cuz I'm definitely not above ghetting my own wires crossed