handheld mic for classical singer

[Freeform]

I'm mainly a classical bass/baritone, but sing other styles as well. Do you guys have any suggestions for a mic thats best suited for my voice, or particularly classical singers? Idealy I'd get a Neumann KMS105, but it's not in the budget right now. Maybe a Shure Beta 87? I'm in a range of up to about $300.

[Innovations]

You might be able to buy a used Sennhieser MD441 on ebay for that price, otherwise you could get a MD421.

[chessparov]

The issue with most hand held microphones is that for live performance
they usually have a presence peak, whereas for classical recording,
normally a microphone with a flatter response (like DPA or Schoeps)
is used.

Some other microphones worth a try;

1) Oktava MC-011 from www.oktava.com
2) The two new AT microphones that have AT4033 & AT 4050 elements
(forgot specific model #'s)
3) Electro-Voice RE16
4) Sennheiser 431
5) Sennheiser e855
6) Beyer M88 and/or M69
7) Shure SM57 (w/Shure's foam pop screen)
8) AKG C535 EB or C900
9) Audix OM5/OM6/OM7
10) Beyer Soundstar MKII (also called M400)

That should keep your busy!
BTW, nothing magical on whether it's a condenser or not, the Beyer M88TG
has beaten out the Neumann U87ai in an informal shootout on my voice,
and the Shure SM57 or RE16 is "comparable" to it on a high level pre.

Chris

P.S. The 441 and 421 don't do well with handling noise.

[Innovations]

Originally posted by chessparov

P.S. The 441 and 421 don't do well with handling noise.

I stand corrected. I presumed that as dynamics they would have been okay.

[chessparov]

If you look at pictures from the 60's, people were using 421's hand held,
but it was on a typically loud live rock and roll stage.
And the 441 is such a nice microphone too, so it would be a shame to
ever have it get dropped/damaged.

Chris

[Innovations]

Frankly I have a hard time seeing a classical singer giving a microphone a rough rocker treatment. Actually come to think of it I have a hard time seeing a classical singer using a handheld microphone at all.

[Richard Monroe]

The real question is- why do you want a hand held mic? Most classical singers don't use them. In fact, most classical singers that are any good don't *use* mics at all. Mics are used *on* them by engineers. I haven't seen Pavarotti swallowing a beta 58 lately. Why? Bel Canto is all about projection, clarity, and purity. The average opera singer, and this goes for most Broadway singers, who are often classically trained, aren't the least bit interested in using proximity effect, or any other tone shaping tool. Usually, they mic them like drummers, with overheads. Not surprisingly, when classical singers do get up close and personal with a mic, they tend to profit from mics with less pronounced proximity that handle high SPL's well, in other words, a good drum mic. I would say- put the mic on a stand. Also, I would suggest you try some dynamics, paticularly Sennheise MD441, Shure SM7B, and oddly enough, AKG D112, a kick drum mic that works on baritones quite well.-Richie

[Freeform]

allow me to explain. i'm an entering freshman at berklee college of music, using voice as my principal instrument. as a requirment, you must bring your own microphone to use in perfomance. i completely agree that most music of this style is done with out a microphone, and i prefer to sing it that way. the mic takes away a lot from the performance, but a requirement is a requirement, so i was just curious to see if anyone had any suggestions for my type of voice.

[chessparov]

Those selections I gave you were based upon you're recording at home. Much depends on the home's acoustics, not just your voice.

The first microphone I'd suggest, based on this new information, is the Beyer M88 (or M88TG). You can pick up a used one in good or better condition typically for around $220 or less.
Eight to ten inches away or so is a good starting distance.
They have incredible room ambience rejection, more than even a 441, and it's also a hand held microphone.
If you get it, I'll give you more tips.

Per Bob Ohlsson, on many people's voices they sound comparable to the "expensive" Neumann's (better than KMS105!).

Chris

P.S. The "TG" version is more ruggedly built for stage use.

[ozraves]

I'd try the Shure Beta 58. On a lower male voice, the mic would give a nice sonic representation. But, I wouldn't let a soprano use one.

[Innovations]

Interesting. Berklee college of music (the place in Boston, not California, right?) is very oriented toward contemporary music.

So you will need to be carrying this around to various practice and performance spaces. Anyhow, most of the mics mentioned here would be fine choices. one thing about the Beyer 88 is that its cardoid pattern is very tight, so your mic technique will need to be good.

[chessparov]

ozraves, I think the Beta's are more useful in a dense rock mix.
It's going to make his voice sound brighter than it really is.

If you sing straight down the barrel of a M88, and back off it to
avoid proximity effect, it sounds very natural.

Chris

[Light]

Well, Berklee (I am an alum) is very much oriented towards contemporary music. I assume, from what you say, that you are not planning on being a performance major. If you are, to be honest there are many schools which are more appropriate if you want to be a classical singer. Boston Conservatory and New England Conservatory (both in Boston) are both good classical schools. If you want to get into a more contemporary style, then Berklee is great.

Whether you are a performance major or not, I would actually recommend either a SM 58 or a Beta 87A. The 58 is the most common live vocal mic in the world, is a great mic, and it would be wise to be familiar with it. If you get into the Berklee Performance Center (the big hall) or you do a recital in the Friend Hall (mostly just used for school functions) you will probably be singing into a Beta 87A. The lead live sound guy there prefers 87s (or was when I was last there), and so in the "prestige" halls, that is what is used. The 87 is a condenser, however, and I do not know if all the rehearsal rooms have phantom power, so it might not work. In the two recital halls you are most likely to work in, you will be singing into SM 58s, so again, it would be good to be familiar with them.

Do you know what hall you are staying in yet? I hope, for your sake, that you are not in the 150 Mass. Av dorms. They are stinky little holes. 270 Comm. Av has much better rooms, but the last time I heard anything, it was peopled by cretins. The best is, by far, the 98 Hemmingway dorms. Not great if you want to party, but the best place to stay if you want to be serious about you studies. If you end up moving out of the dorms, Allston and Brighton are great, but get a place close to the C line, cause the B line goes right through Boston University, which sucks.


Oh yeah, do the crew a favor and learn to eat the mic, whatever anyone in here tells you. Trust me on this.


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi

[ozraves]

Originally posted by chessparov
ozraves, I think the Beta's are more useful in a dense rock mix.
It's going to make his voice sound brighter than it really is.

If you sing straight down the barrel of a M88, and back off it to
avoid proximity effect, it sounds very natural.

Chris

Well, he needs to try it. I stand by the rec. I'm pretty well tuned into legit voices from my minutes, hours, days and weeks locked in my practice cubby at the University of North Texas School of Music. You'll note I limited it to a lower male voice.

I'd also give a try to an SM58.

Steve
www.mojopie.com

[chessparov]

Maybe I've just ID'd the Beta 58 too much with Bono!
(the "other" Bono-not Sonny)

Chris

[Freeform]

Thanks for all of your help guys. Does anyone know any major differences between the Beta 87a and Beta 87c?

[Light]

Originally posted by Freeform
Thanks for all of your help guys. Does anyone know any major differences between the Beta 87a and Beta 87c?

The 87A is a Hyper Cardioid pattern, and the 87C is a Cardioid mic.


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi

[Freeform]

which pattern do you guys reccomend the most? cardioid?

[Treeline]

Sounds like "handheld" is not really a requirement, just an approach. Why not toss a LD condenser into the discussion?

A SP C3 has a multiple polar pattern, comes with a case and a shockmount, and is pretty versatile for different vocal styles. Don't bang it around, though.

[Freeform]

i need to have something handheld, and performance ready

[Treeline]

Oops.