white album guitars

[willovercome]

i am a huge Beatles fan. i thought everyone in the world was until i did a search and found out how many of you disagree. but anyway, i do a lot of fingerpicking and playing like on the white album (Julia, Blackbird etc.). i was wondering if anyone knew of a way to recreate that sort of acoustic sound. i don't even mind the boominess of the guitar and all the fret noise because the sound is so rich.

btw-i'm not looking for how they did it, i'm just looking for how i can do it pretty close.

[DonF]

You'll need the following:

• great guitar
• great microphone (carefully placed)
• great player
• great room
• great console (well maintained)
• great recording device (ditto)

The more of these you have, the closer you'll come to the sound you are craving.

That said, I think the basic idea is to use a large-diaphragm condensor mic in the instrument's nearfield. Make sure you check and recheck that the instrument is in tune. Use new strings. (String the instrument a day or two before your session.)

HTH

[scottboyher]

Originally posted by DonF
You'll need the following:

• great guitar
• great microphone (carefully placed)
• great player
• great room
• great console (well maintained)
• great recording device (ditto)

The more of these you have, the closer you'll come to the sound you are craving.


HTH

But the Beatles didn't have any of that.

[DonF]

Originally posted by scottboyher
But the Beatles didn't have any of that.

I could listen to the guitar on "Blackbird" all day long and not get tired of it. OTOH, I plug my ears for the solo on "I'll Follow The Sun". So it's a mixed bag.

I know you're not serious, because you can't say they didn't have great microphones.

[chessrock]

I thought they used marshall mxl603s in George Martin's basement studio with a Mackie VLZ board.

Shows you what I know.

[TexRoadkill]

A lot of the Beatles stuff was recorded on ribbon mics so that can give you a bit of that sound. Usually any nice sounding guitar with a good player is pretty easy to record if you have some decent gear.

Are you looking for general guitar micing advice or something more specific?

[willovercome]

Originally posted by DonF
You'll need the following:[list][*]great guitar[*]great microphone (carefully placed)[*]great player[*]great room[*]great console (well maintained)[*]great recording device (ditto)

i have all those things just kidding.

yeah, i want specifics, general techniques, anything you've tried that comes close to the above mentioned sound.

i guess i want to know about possible mic placement/mic choice, what guitars would sound good...many of the songs have a really clear but colorful high end, and a 'muddy' but pleasent low end (i can't describe it but you know what i'm talking about - if not listen to the white album). i know someone's going to chime in about the zillion dollar this and that, but i think something close to that sound can be achieved in home studio.

[ametth]

Originally posted by scottboyher
But the Beatles didn't have any of that.

Are you being serious?

[ametth]

Originally posted by willovercome
i have all those things just kidding.

yeah, i want specifics, general techniques, anything you've tried that comes close to the above mentioned sound.

i guess i want to know about possible mic placement/mic choice, what guitars would sound good...many of the songs have a really clear but colorful high end, and a 'muddy' but pleasent low end (i can't describe it but you know what i'm talking about - if not listen to the white album). i know someone's going to chime in about the zillion dollar this and that, but i think something close to that sound can be achieved in home studio.

It depends on your home studio...I know the best acoustic guitar sound I ever got was with a Royer 121 ribbon mic, with a 2500$ guitar, into an 2000$ mic pre...if you want a great guitar sound with crappy equipment..it's most likely not going to happen.

[willovercome]

ok i think i have the equipment to get a 'good' maybe not 'great' guitar sound. i can get good guitar sounds, but for one song i really want the guitar to sound as much like the Beatles white album sound as possible.

PRES
UA-610
RNP
DMP-3
DBX 376
Presonus

MICS
NTK
NT5's
SM57
Oktava MK 319
Beta 52

GUITARS (worth mentioning)
Martin D-18
Taylor 512 (small body)
Gibson JC? (like buddy holly-i've seen video of Paul using it too)

[TexRoadkill]

You've got enough stuff there to get a lot of different tones. The only thing you are missing that is probably key to a more vintage sound is ribbon mic.

Knowing what techniques were used to get a sound really only helps if there is something very obvious about a tone like using a leslie speaker, flanger, compressed room sound etc. The Beatles guitar sound isn't really that technique dependent.

There are usually 3 good places to mic an acoustic-

1. Around the 3-12th fret close to the neck.
2. Above the bridge anywere from 4-16"
3. Anywhere else in the room and any combination of all 3.

[Jack Hammer]

Is it really the "sound" that you are so attracted to or is the performance, the song the aura etc.

I wonder if the sound would still be great if the song were crappy and the performance mediocre?

[Aaron Cheney]

Originally posted by Jack Hammer
Is it really the "sound" that you are so attracted to or is the performance, the song the aura etc.

I wonder if the sound would still be great if the song were crappy and the performance mediocre?

I've heard a lot of really well-recorded crap. Just turn on the radio.

On the other hand, I've heard some pretty good songs that were recorded very poorly, and I had a hard time listening to them too.

Usually the learning curves of song-writing and recording quality correlate w/ each other to some extent.... unless you are a hottie. Then you can go straight to the great recordings and skip the talent development stage. Me.....? Oh well, umm...... I'm trying to develop my talent anyway.

Aaron
http://www.voodoovibe.com

[eddbud]

Theres a wonderful book i picked up with an extensive guitar and amplifier guide to the beatles, really detailed if you like that sort of thing.

I think McCartney had an Early Epiphone Texan, which would sound weird becuase it was converted to left handed play. And a martin too i believe.

[scottboyher]

Originally posted by ametth
Are you being serious?

Nope.

[cavedog101]

I remember pictures of the Epiphone from sessions around that time...and yes, they put another pickguard around the hole for the lefty, so it had both....John using the J45 Gibson a lot...and the J160...These were not the 'best' acoustics that could be had at that time or anytime for that matter...but they do impart a certain sound, which George Martin caught with amazing clarity....must have been those crappy German mics and that rotten to the core EMI console...the one with all the transformers in it.........hmmmmm.........transformers..........

[willovercome]

i got the guitars to sound pretty good and close to what i want using an sm57 run through RNP on the neck of the D-18 and an NTK through the UA 610 about 3 feet straight out from the sound hole. but i think the main difference is the room. there's no way i can recreate abbey road in my studio, so i'll settle for pretty close. actually i'm happy with the guitars because i knew i'll never get the exact beatles sound - this shows what good experimentation can get you.

[DonF]

So, when do we get to hear it?

[willovercome]

soon as i get the website updated and running with mp3's (i.e. sometime between next weekend and 2005).