Cakewalk SONAR vs. SP C1

[KevinTran]

I'm torn between what to upgrade. Can I hear some opinions?

I do only vocal recording right now. I'm currently using the trial version of n-Track to record and singing into a Shure SM58.

n-Track is only 40 bucks to register but seems REALLY basic. Also, I'm not totally satisfied with how my voice is sounding on the SM58, but it's tolerable.

Would you recommend getting the nice recording/editing tool or get the better LD condenser mic?

Also, could someone tell me what the differences between SONAR and Home Studio 2003 are? (besides the price)

[Fab4ever]

The main difference is that you can record as many tracks simultaneously with Sonar as your hardware can handle. In Home Studio, I believe you can only record two tracks at the same time (but you can still have unlimited total tracks in your song).

In my opinion, Home Studio is an excellent product. It's got most of Sonar's features at a much lower price.

So... I'd recommend Home Studio and a starter condenser, like a Marshall MXL V-67 or a STudio Projects B-1 AND Home Studio. Then you'll have both.... some, though not most, people actually prefer one of those mics to the C-1.

For what it's worth,

Fab

[Jburn34]

I've got the C1 and it's been great on most voices. I think its best to invest more money in some hardware like a mic or a nice outboard unit instead of dumping everything into the newest but always changing technology. I started with n-track and really liked it for some stuff but it wasn't very stable for me. I just got in the digi 001 with pro tools.

I think the suggestion about getting the B1 or the Marshall mic and a cheaper software program was good. Check out Cool Edit Pro also...not sure how much it costs but my brother has it and really likes it. If n-track is working for you then just upgrade it and later on when it's limiting you won't have wasted a bunch of money and you'll know what you're looking for.

If you're going to use the mic for more than just vocals the b1 might be a better option as everyone says it is more neutral and versatile.

Jeremy

[KevinTran]

thanks for the responses guys...

I think I'll get the smaller Cakewalk Home Studio, since I heard it provide 80% of what SONAR does at about 1/3 the cost. And get a C1 because I've read such raving reviews on it for vocals. The two will set me back about $300.

I also saw on ebay that a brand new C3 can be had for around $250. Does anyone think it's worth it to spend another $50 on getting a C3 over the C1???

[tdukex]

I think it's worth it. The C3 has multiple patterns, and from all of the samples I've heard, it is a smoother mic. A C3 for $250 is a steal.

[gordone]

What's wrong with N-Track? I have it and it works fine. I also pair it with some pretty high end gear (http://home.earthlink.net/~egordon99/studio.html)

I'd rather have N-Track with some nice mics/pres/acoustics than Sonar and an SM-58.

Remember to get some decent plug-ins too! I use Waves

[KevinTran]

Evan,
Very nice setup you got there. I especially like the Computer desk you have. Where'd you get it?

About the preamp...
Is it beneficial for a microphone to have a mic preamp rather than using the phantom power through a mixer? I see you have both preamp and mixer.

[Gidge]

stepping up to a decent LDC like the C1, v67G,v93 will be a noticable difference in sound quality, whereas upgrading software won't.....

Id stick with N-Track.....

what mixer are you using for preamps?....

[KevinTran]

I have a Crate Pro Audio CSM12 Mixer. Here are the specs. You can click on "Click Here for More Information" to see the exact specs.

http://www.crateaudio.com/products/s...ers/csx12.html

It can supply 48v phantom power to each of the 12 channels. I always thought that this was sufficient but I keep hearing everyone having a separate mic preamp.

[Jburn34]

Separate preamps are preferred not necessarily for the phantom power but because most of them will sound better than a typical mixer's preamps. I have a decent board but I can notice that even my dmp3 ($189) sounds better than the onboard preamps. There are boards that have great preamps...some studios pay thousands and thousands for their board and get some unreal preamps with it.

I would imagine that you could upgrade to a better preamp(s) for $150 on up that will sound cleaner and fuller than the preamps on your board. You really should try some out and see. I've heard (I don't know because I don't have one) that some of the really high end preamps can make a lot of crappy mics sound great.

I use decent cheap software right now (n-tracks maybe) and invest in a good mic and mic preamp...like gidge said, these won't be obsolete 3 years from now...you can keep going back to them.

Jeremy

[fishtop_records]

Sonar has lots of features beyond recording
audio. Full MIDI synth support,
softsynths, etc.

For pure audio recording, it is probably
overkill, even tho I use it that way.

CoolEdit Pro looked to be a contender, but
who knows what will happen now that
Adobe bought it.

You will need a decent mic pre to go
with an upgraded mic. Actually, you want
an upgraded mic pre no matter what.
You'd be amazed at how good a $70
Shure SM57 can sound thru a good mic pre.

Don't forget stands, cables, monitors (or at
least headphones) etc.

[KevinTran]

Just picked up a Studio Projects C3 from ebay for $255 brand new.

I have a bid in on Cakewalk Home Studio 2002 for like $30.

I'm glad you guys are letting me know about mic pres. I figure my $600 mixer's pres would be good enough. I'll have to read up on mic pres now. Sheesh! This is getting to be an expensive hobby.

I'm using the trial vers of n-track right now and I'm just not getting into it very well. Seems very limited in its abilities, although I'm still learning the basics.

[gordone]

Sorry for not getting back to you sooner!

The computer desk is made by Bush (not Dubyah!) and I bought it at Staples for ~$200.

Re. the pres, to get started, the pres in your mixer should be ok. If you had a Mackie VLZ Pro, I would tell you that you probably won't see an improvement until you spend ~$500 a channel. I would work on your engineering chops, mic placement, room acoustics, etc... before spending money on a pre-amp. I did it the opposite and all my mics and pres did for me was to reveal the limitations of my chops and my room acoustics.
I'm now at a better stage in my road to engineering nirvana, so I can appreciate the Great River and my mic collection. Remember that the pre isn't just providing phantom power, it is providing gain to bring the mic signal up to a usable line signal.
Good luck and I'm sure the C3 will be a big step up for you. Sorry you didn't get the hang of N-Track, but I've found by reading here, that User Interfaces are a very personal thing.
-Evan

Originally posted by KevinTran
Just picked up a Studio Projects C3 from ebay for $255 brand new.

I have a bid in on Cakewalk Home Studio 2002 for like $30.

I'm glad you guys are letting me know about mic pres. I figure my $600 mixer's pres would be good enough. I'll have to read up on mic pres now. Sheesh! This is getting to be an expensive hobby.

I'm using the trial vers of n-track right now and I'm just not getting into it very well. Seems very limited in its abilities, although I'm still learning the basics.

[KevinTran]

Originally posted by gordone
Re. the pres, to get started, the pres in your mixer should be ok. ...I would work on your engineering chops, mic placement, room acoustics, etc... before spending money on a pre-amp. I did it the opposite and all my mics and pres did for me was to reveal the limitations of my chops and my room acoustics.
-Evan

Glad you made it back. I'll definitely fiddle with the room acoustics. I'm probably not in the best room in the house (Living room with double window, and two entrances no doors. hehe. I might have to move all my stuff upstairs to the spare bedroom.

And I have no idea what you just said about chops... There's a nice restaurant in Atlanta by that name. Real good but expensive as hell.

kt

[gordone]

Chops as in skills, just slang I'm using
Like - "Wow that dude has mad chops on the piano"

Now that you mention it, I could really go for some lamb chops right now!

Re. acoustics, since I'm in a small room, I went for dead as possible, which means no echo, or ringy, hollowy stuff when you play (a good test is to clap your hands and listen for any echos). The auralex foam helps absorb the sound and make the room sound more dead. I add reverb after the fact. Works for me!

Originally posted by KevinTran
<snip>
And I have no idea what you just said about chops... There's a nice restaurant in Atlanta by that name. Real good but expensive as hell.

kt