Good Sound Accomplished - ready to move on.

[moelar2]

Hello,

I've used several alternate versions of the the various 3-4 mic techniques in this forum. I've also added individual mics and mixed them with the overheads, all of which have rendered good sound.

Now, I'm ready to move up to the next level.

I was recording a band last week and used individual tom mics, snare mic, and kick mic. I also used two mc012's for stereo overheads. Sounds real good, but it doesnt' sound tight enough. I think I basically have to add a hihat mic. I'm looking for the best way to get a tighter, maybe drier, sound. It sounds too live right now.

Mics used:
Beta 56/Audix D-Series (toms), Sm57 (snare), Beta 52 (kick), and Oktava mc012's on Overheads.

What is the best overhead arrangment to maximize cymbal pickup?

I use Cubase SX and i haven't yet gated any of the tracks. I'm sure this will eliminate a lot of leakage, but its not enough. Anytime i bring up the overheads the room characteristics take over.

More dampening? Better Mic configuration? Gating? Compression?

Any suggestions??

Thanks.

[theletterq]

Well, if you are in a live room, you will have a live sound. It looks like you need to concentrate more on room treatment than anything else.

If you are looking for more of a cymbal sound, position the overheads more up directly over the cymbals.

If you are stuck with the room you have, and aren't able (for whatever reason) to apply various treatments, your next step would be to try alternate tuning techniques and or dampening of the drums themselves.

[moelar2]

The room is moderately treated. Its a garage converted into a homerecording space. It is carpeted, and I have four 2x4 auralex panels on three walls (for a total of 12 panels).

Would making a drum enclosure out of PVC and Blankets help much?

The biggest problem is bringing up the overheads; they take over once they become audible.

[pratt]

Originally posted by moelar2
Would making a drum enclosure out of PVC and Blankets help much?

yes....I would think that isolating the kit via blankets, baffles, etc. would help your situation immensely...

can't hurt to try, right? then if you're not getting the results you want you can move on to other techniques..

[theletterq]

Do you have anything else in the room? More specifically, are there couches, chairs, etc? Adding some of these big cushy things will help as will some bookcases with randomly placed books on the shelves.

You're looking for a combination of diffusion as well as absorbtion. I am by no means even close to an acoustics expert so take what I say with about two tablespoons of salt. Just passing along what has worked for me in the past.

Isolation, as you mentioned, is another technique that could work great. You may have to augment with some good reverb unless you are truly going for a real dry sound....

We as homerecorders don't usually have the good fortune of a great sounding drum room (unless of course you study acoustics and shell out some cash for building one) so we must make do with what we have. I know of some drummers that simply refuse to record real drums because of their room limitations, and rely on various forms of electronic drums.

There is a middle ground though...I just know it!

[moelar2]

It certainly looks like i'm gonna undergo the PVC/Blanket project. I remixed the drums last night - it sounds a little better but its still too live.

When I try to gate the toms, I end up with a 'normalized' effect where everything is the same volume; can't really distinguish between bleeded sound and actual direct tom sound.

when I remove the gates, it actually sounds better. Reducing threshold and ratios seem to defeat the purpose of using the gate.

I have to find a way to get this mix sounding decent. Since I didn't record this band with a metronome, there is no steady pulse to the song. The fact that the drummer speeds up 10-20 bpm's during drum fills doesn't help either

[theletterq]

Sounds like a good idea. Remember that you may need to move a sheet or two of your Auralex to the ceiling over your "iso booth". In my experiences, some of the worst reflections I've experienced have come from the ceiling.

Good luck with this.

[simpleblue]

The mc012s are incredibly sensitive. You might need to place them dead on top of the cymbals and turn em down to avoid all of that bleed through.

[moelar2]

Good suggestion....I'll try that.

Thanks.

[Poddy]

Try bringing your overheads in closer to the kit. Try for about two stick lengths above the height of the snare. That has helped me illiminate poor sounding room effects. And usually results in a tighter punchier feel.