Mackie or Soundcraft

[dcDoggy]

For home studio recording acoustic & electric gitbox, some vocals and maybe synth/drum machine, what do you think, in terms of quality and features, the better choice for a first mixer:

Mackie 1202/1402 VLZ Pro
or
Soundcraft Spirit M4/M8
???

[TexRoadkill]

The downside to the 1202 is the knobs instead of faders. I have to give the edge to the Soundcrafts because of the SPDIF out and slightly better EQ and Pre's. Either will do the job though.

[Mastabeta 57]

if you have a bit more cash get a spirit m series, i cant vouch much for a mackie (having never owned oned) but i think you'll like the m series.

[dcDoggy]

So far, I've been very happy with Mackie's support. Soundcraft's made in the UK; how is their US support?

[cavedog101]

soundcraft......the m series sounds very good...and i think that soundcraft operates out of nashville here in the states

[t_chance]

I have Mackie<1202,1604>, Behringer<1004>, and a Soundcraft <F-1>. The 1202 was my first and all of them still serve their purpose. The 1004 I can use without AC. on sale at my GC for $79 right now. The Soundcraft is really the one I go to first for recording, Nice long sliders, and a sweepable mid on the EQ. I don't know of any service problems with the Soundcraft units because I've never had to use their service.

[Phantasm]

I just got a soundcraft M-series. I have used mackie and behringer and I can definately say that the M-series has a better sound at comparable cost. FWIW...

[ambi]

On the topic of this. If i'm just needing to record USUALLY a stereo recording, 2 channels, but maybe sometimes 4. Would it be better to get a mackie or soundcraft with 4 preamps, and have 4 of the same flavor? Or use my art studio mp for 1 channel, and buy say a dmp3 for another 2 channels, and maybe another 2 solid clean channels. That way i could have 5 channels of preamps, 3 different flavors. Or just 4 or 6 of the same flavor from mackie or soundcraft? Assuming the price between these choices is similar. I don't think i need the functions/eq of the mixing boards, but i did rent a mackie 1202 before and i really liked being able to hear what i was recording while recording. What i mean is, i could plug the output of my soundcard into the mixing board, and have the headphones coming out of the mixing board, and speakers if i wanted to. And i could listen to my mixes on the computer through the mixing board to the headphones, and have the signal i'm recording come into the headphone mix at the same time while recording, and i was able to set the levels. Now maybe i'ts cause i'm using a shitty sound blaster card right now that i think that is a big deal, but normally i can't do that, becuase of the latency between logic audio and the sound blaster. If i have a bunch of external preamps, and just have my headphones coming out of the computer i could do this?

bleh, i feel dead.

[alexspetty]

go with mackie.. rock solid products...

i have a 1402vlz and a 24x8... love em both!

-alex

[morte sicura]

I agree with Phantasm - I have the M8 and the Mackie feels like a toy in comparison. Bought mine used - a month old - for $350, which is just about impossible to beat. Unless you need portability -- the Soundcraft is a big board in comparison to the Mackie! Nice 100mm faders, though some feel they move almost too easily. Killer pots. A much less crowded board. Very nice eq too, and the pres are at least as good, if not better, than the Mackie. Power supply is isolated in the "L" that hangs out underneath the control surface in the back and gives the board its tilt. One con comes to mind - no subgroups.

[Speeddemon]

Originally posted by morte sicura
One con comes to mind - no subgroups.

Here are two more cons:
-No EQ-bypass buttons
-No 2 sweepable mid-ranges

Ofcourse, if you want this, the next best thing is an Allen & Heath Mixwizard.
BTW, The Mixwizard 14:4:2+ DOES have 4 subgroups!
Also 10 mic inputs with INDIVIDUAL phantompower-buttons, SWITCHABLE pre/post auxes (6!!!).

Since a Mackie 1604 VLZ Pro is usually around €1300-1450 in Europe, and the Mixwizard is €1400, I say GET the Mixwizard... ofcourse the M-series are a bit cheaper, and yes, they will sound better than Behringer- and Mackie-pre's.

FWIW, I DO like Behringer's faders better than Soundcraft. Soundcraft's faders offer no resistance, feels to flimsy for my needs... Optimal fader-resistance (smoothly moved, yet not too smooth) can be found in the Midas XL4.

[morte sicura]

Yep, the Mix Wizard series is badass! But I couldn't pass up the M8 at only $350 - got me tracking several months earlier than if I'd kept saving for the A+H.

[chingon]

How much better and how big of an upgrade is it from a Makie/Soundcraft to the Allen and heath Mix Wiz?

[ericzang]

How about the difference in sound concerning line level signals, ie synths, and effect sends/returns? Do you hear much of a difference between a Behringer and an A&H or Soundcraft?

[morte sicura]

any of these mixers will be an improvement over a Behringer - I've used several of the 802 model Behringers and they all sound different - different levels from channel to channel, more / less crosstalk on different mixers, and even a mix buss with different output on left and right channels! That said, I had a "good" one (whatever that's worth) and it was good for mixing cheap Casios and looping tools and effects for my nioise project, but I sold it on eBay to help pay for my M8.

The A&H Mix Wiz series should be an improvement over the Mackie and also the M series (mainly due to flexibility in the case of the M, which sounds nice) - they're more money than either but actually close in price to the Mackie.

ar

[ericzang]

I have an A&H GL2200 next to a Behringer 2642A. I A/B tested sampler and synth line level signals through them and I don't hear a difference. I have them summed through a mackie mixer mixer (not exactly a mixer, just a summing box to effectively integrate up to 3 mixers together). Wonder if this negates any differences. I also compared them through their headphone outs and didn't hear a difference using a basic sampler sound.

I have not had any funtional or build quality problems with the Behringer 2642A. It has great routing flexibilty.

I do hear a difference between the preamps, the A&H being more full and pleasing. I then compared the A&H preamp to the RNP. The RNP made the A&H sound like the Behringer in comparison.

[Jack Hammer]

FWIW I have a Mackie 24/8 and I have had some problems. for starters, the Aux sends sometimes cut out until I raise the leve high enough to kick it back in. This sucks. I brought it in for repair and I was told that Mackie was aware of the problem and had an upgrade kit for free. The upgrade consisted of a new and allegedly better ribbon cable for the Aux bus. Actually, it is a bit better though I have still had the same problem once or twice although now it is on a different channel than it was before.

Second problem, I just upgraded my system to add a MOTU 24 i/o. As a result, I am using more of the tape ins and outs than I had previously. I have now discovered that one of the tape return inputs is bad. I have not had this problem completely checked by a pro but I am a bit annoyed since bringing the board in for repair is a major, major fucking pain in the ass (Idon't usually swear but I just want to emphasize this point).

All this, by the way, for what I would consider mediocre sound. If I were making the purchase today, I would not consider the Mackie and would simply save until I could afford at the very lest a Soundcraft Ghost though at this point an Yammaha 02R96 would be my real first choice.

The point is, Mackies are checp for a reason. They are mass produced and thus susceptible to these kind of minor progblems that, becuase of no real tech support (someone to come fix the thing in your studio), they become major problems.

[ambi]

Which allen and heath board would compete with mackie 1202?

One thing i've heard is that although people claim the soundcraft spirit pre's sound better than the Mackies, that the mackies have so much more headroom they are much better. Basically what people were saying in old posts is that the ammount of headroom it has is so much more significant than the ammount that the soundcraft has, that you shouldn't get the soundcraft.

That seemed odd to me, but i suppose there was some sort of science behind it?

What if i just want the board for the pres and a volume control for my monitors?

I'm not sure how you'd route that with the mackie, does it have faders for the monitor outputs? Are the inputs 1/4 or RCA? If the soundcraft or allen and heath had faders for the monitor output and 1/4 inputs/outputs instead of rca i'd be down!

OOH the soundcraft m4 has direct outputs on it's channels? The mackie doesn't have that, you have to use the inserts or whatever, does this make a difference? Also it looks like the soundcraft has faders for the monitor output instead of knobs.... I'm leaning towards the soundcraft!