Is Prosody important?

[joro]

Well?
What say you wordsmiths....?

[bdbdbuck]

Well, at this point.......check the poll results. I've been writing for 35 years, and didn't know I had prosody......I did see the doctor to get it taken care of though, he said the rash would clear up in a few days. Thanks for the heads up!


bd

[stonepiano]

I think all songwriters inherently look for a sing-song type quality in the lyrics we write. It might not be intentional but we're all making sure things "sing" well. At least, I am.

Can anyone think of an successful, well-known song that completely disregards any rhythmic order? Do any of your songs not fit the rhythm of the song?

[Jagular]

I answered yes, but I can't always make it work

[Kramer]

Main Entry: pros·o·dy
Pronunciation: 'prä-s&-dE, -z&-
Function: noun
Inflected Form(s): plural -dies
Etymology: Middle English, from Latin prosodia accent of a syllable, from Greek prosOidia song sung to instrumental music, accent, from pros in addition to + OidE song -- more at PROS-, ODE
Date: 15th century
1 : the study of versification; especially : the systematic study of metrical structure
2 : a particular system, theory, or style of versification
3 : the rhythmic and intonational aspect of language
- pros·o·dist /-dist/ noun

[Buffalo Bob]

I find no fascination
In diversifying my versification
I hardly have the time
To make the damned things rhyme!

[Jagular]

Originally posted by Buffalo Bob
I find no fascination
In diversifying my versification
I hardly have the time
To make the damned things rhyme!

hehe...nice one

[mikeh]

Some of Paul Simon's material may occasionally test the outer bounderies of the fundamental concept of prosody!

[Garry Sharp]

stonepiano - how about Alanis Morrisette. Especially live. She waits 'til the end of the bar and then unleashes the lot.

Her Jagged Pill Live DVD (which ain't got no prosody!) has a lot of tedious crap in it but is worth watching for some absolute gems of performance and especially timing..

[joro]

Originally posted by Buffalo Bob
I find no fascination
In diversifying my versification
I hardly have the time
To make the damned things rhyme!

LOL!

[limoguy]

3 : the rhythmic and intonational aspect of language
- pros·o·dist /-dist/ noun


The spoken, english language exhibits prosody all by itself. The syllables we stress when we speak create a musical melody all by themselves. Our voice unconsciously rises ever so slightly when we speak the stressed syllables in the words of our conversation, thus creating a melody.

Unfortunately...I have no idea if this applies to what is being queried here or not because I just dropped my prosody on the floor and it has created one heckofa mess!

Peace!

Limoguy

[Layla Nahar]

aaaww man -- I just have to do more writing ...

[tanlith]

Lyrics can make or break a song. In the same breath I could say if the music sucks and the lyrics are brilliant ... the song still sucks...


Here is an excellent example of brilliant lyrics delivered ... there's no real spacific form to how they flow... kind of free form... but the song is brilliant...

It's a group called Jim's Big Ego and the song's called Stress

Anyone for a cup of Java? (Listen to the song... you'll get it then)

- Tanlith -

(Eternal Noob)

Yes it's true! I'm an Acid Pro junkie!!

[Gidge]

i voted yes....

i like structure.....

[tanlith]

Prosody ... ok I admit... I hadda look it up... my original reply was gunna go something like this:


"Yeah... I had one of those... but the wheels fell off..."

- Tanlith -

[chazba]

LET ME QUOTE FROM CHAZBA'S BOOK OF WISDOM

"A SONG WITHOUT PROSODY IS LIKE SOUP WITHOUT LIQUID"


CHAZBA

[Mad Hack]

First of all, prosody is a way of looking at the rythmic structure of language, it is not necessarily that structure itself. Even if something lacks rhythm, and that's pretty hard to imagine, even in something like a chant, it has a prosody.

If a line is able to be sung quickly and in little space, it is the skillful assembling of syllables that makes it possible. There is a natural prosody that English tends to follow, and without it we'd all sort of sound like the dwarf and Laura Palmer in the red room on Twin Peaks.

All poems and speech in general, have metre, and it is that that gives them their music. The rhythms are more complex when you add notes and percussion to the mix. Whether or not you are conscious of words' rhythm when you are writing is another question. It seems inevitable that you must be, however, if words and music are to have anything to do with one another.

[Buffalo Bob]

Some say metre
Some say meter
Some say either
Some say eidder
Metre, meter
Either, eidder
Let's call the whole thing off.

[crawdad]

Yes, its important to me. I think of it as being kind of like the underlying "manners" of a song, so to speak. It makes it all more comfortable to listen to, and--like Gidge--I like structure. Little variances don't bother me at all, but chaos does!

[zer0sig]

i don't necessarily focus much on prosody, but i find that the lyrics i write exhibit it, because they SOUND better being read to myself. various literary devices come out because they sound better, rather than because i'm trying to use some specific method of producing them. over time, that sort of thing becomes rahter automatic. hell, i find myself speaking in meter at times.

[glynb]

"There is a natural prosody that English tends to follow, and without it we'd all sort of sound like the dwarf and Laura Palmer in the red room on Twin Peaks."
Wow, Twin Peaks, excellent film, and what a scene you selected there to make your point - must dust off the video soon and watch that again.

Its strange sometimes you see aspiring song writers posting lyrics on groups like this that may rhyme, but just don't 'sound right' - I think when writing if the words put together sound like they could be used in general conversation (and we're not talking two college professors discussing nuclear physics, just ordinary people) then you're on the right lines.

It doesn't really matter what you're saying in the song its the way you say it. The song may not even have a meaning as long as each of the words and phrases sounds right. Where the skill comes in is knowing what sounds right - some people seem to do it instinctively, others struggle and just don't get it - coming up with convoluted non-conversational lines in order to get a rhyme at the end!

Words written by Robbie Williams are a good example - each line sounds OK - but the lines don't add up to a coherant meaning. Does it matter - no they're still hits (at least here in the UK).

[gascap]

Interesting topic.

Prosody or not...the one song that I've always been pointed too with no rhymes - which was very radio friendly, I might add - was "Annies Song" by John Denver (You fill up my senses...) Ain't a dang rhyme it...still a lovely song. I suppose it has strong Prosody then.

[Aaron Cheney]

Originally posted by gascap
Interesting topic.

Prosody or not...the one song that I've always been pointed too with no rhymes - which was very radio friendly, I might add - was "Annies Song" by John Denver (You fill up my senses...) Ain't a dang rhyme it...still a lovely song. I suppose it has strong Prosody then.

Yes, I refer to that song often as a good example of the exception to the rules: no rhymes, no verse, no chorus. The song works based on only two things: a beuatiful metaphor and the emotional content.

Awkard phrases bug the crap out of me. Prosody to me is almost more important than rhyme. Well-conceived prosody makes your lyrics sound more natural when sung, it affects the pace of your lyrics, and also makes them more appealing to the ear.

To quote Mike Myers once again, you should never "Put the wrong emPHASis on the wrong syLABle."

Aaron
http://www.voodoovibe.com

[LI_Slim]

I think that prosody is always important, but that doesn't mean that it is always important to have a classic meter or rhyme scheme. I think it works sometimes to include a "clashing" prosody at times to bring attention to certain lyrics; it can have a dramatic effect. Dylan of course did (and does) stuff like that a lot.

[Henri Devill]

Originally posted by LI_Slim
I think that prosody is always important, but that doesn't mean that it is always important to have a classic meter or rhyme scheme. I think it works sometimes to include a "clashing" prosody at times to bring attention to certain lyrics; it can have a dramatic effect. Dylan of course did (and does) stuff like that a lot.

Ditto!Also droppin' ryhme to accent is cool too...I guess this is what they mean by knowin' the rules to break 'em



Don